phasing out of fossil fuels - programme

[Dr Bob]

14 minutes ago, phantom_iv said:

 

Instavolt are excellent. Tesla's supercharger network is a major competitive advantage for them though at present.

Thanks for that. I will have a look at them on the net. I would only need it as a backup in case on a long trip one of the superchargers wasnt working. Most of the time I charge in the marina.

[phantom_iv]

https://instavolt.co.uk/mcdonalds-partners-with-instavolt-to-deliver-rapid-charging-network-at-drive-thrus/

https://instavolt.co.uk/first-instavolt-ev-rapid-charger-goes-live-at-mcdonalds/

 

Looks like Instavolt are rolling out chargers at McDonalds across the UK... this will make a significant difference.

[ditchcrawler]

3 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

The start of this thread had loads of posts saying "No one is going to get an electric car 'cause there is nowhere to charge them". There are now a lot of recent posts saying "There are all these charging posts being installed, but they are hardly used. What a waste of parking". I've not checked and I am not going to, but I wonder how many are being posted by the same people! ?

I often go to fill up with diesel and am the only car at the service station, maybe they should take the other pumps out and make Asda carpark bigger

[phantom_iv]

1 minute ago, ditchcrawler said:

I often go to fill up with diesel and am the only car at the service station, maybe they should take the other pumps out and make Asda carpark bigger

 

I will admit to having plugged my car in for a largely unnecessary charge on one or two occasions on the grounds that those were the only spaces left in the car park ?

[Jen-in-Wellies]

45 minutes ago, phantom_iv said:

https://instavolt.co.uk/mcdonalds-partners-with-instavolt-to-deliver-rapid-charging-network-at-drive-thrus/

https://instavolt.co.uk/first-instavolt-ev-rapid-charger-goes-live-at-mcdonalds/

 

Looks like Instavolt are rolling out chargers at McDonalds across the UK... this will make a significant difference.

So the global warming and pollution won't get us, but the obesity and coronaries will. ?

Edited January 7, 2021 by Jen-in-Wellies

[ditchcrawler]

14 minutes ago, phantom_iv said:

 

I will admit to having plugged my car in for a largely unnecessary charge on one or two occasions on the grounds that those were the only spaces left in the car park ?

Is that looked on by other motorists the same as boaters when you have the hose run out but the tap off ?

[Mike Todd]

1 hour ago, phantom_iv said:

https://instavolt.co.uk/mcdonalds-partners-with-instavolt-to-deliver-rapid-charging-network-at-drive-thrus/

https://instavolt.co.uk/first-instavolt-ev-rapid-charger-goes-live-at-mcdonalds/

 

Looks like Instavolt are rolling out chargers at McDonalds across the UK... this will make a significant difference.

and for those us us who would not want to be spotted within half a mile of a Big Mac, for the sake of our diet . . .

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

and for those us us who would not want to be spotted within half a mile of a Big Mac, for the sake of our diet . . .

 

A very long lead.

[Thomas C King]

On 06/01/2021 at 11:17, phantom_iv said:

This isn't unusual - some charges can go even higher than this. 30p/kwh works out somewhere in the region of 7.5p/mile, which is still a decent saving on current petrol costs. Obviously if you charge at home you'll save a lot more, but public infrastructure has to pay for its installation cost somehow.

I might be ignorant of the benefits of getting the market involved here, perhaps there is innovation through competition, but I just can't see it in this context.

 

The infrastructure can be privately owned, and hence discourage people from taking up electric through higher costs. These costs will mean either not meeting climate targets, or banning ICE and harming the economy when people struggle to get on-board, or simply delaying uptake due to a chicken-or-egg situation where companies aren't installing because of lack of consumers and vice versa. Or, it can be publicly owned and energy provided at market rates.

[phantom_iv]

32 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

The infrastructure can be privately owned, and hence discourage people from taking up electric through higher costs. These costs will mean either not meeting climate targets, or banning ICE and harming the economy when people struggle to get on-board, or simply delaying uptake due to a chicken-or-egg situation where companies aren't installing because of lack of consumers and vice versa. Or, it can be publicly owned and energy provided at market rates.

There's no reason why local authorities for example can't install chargers and supply electricity. Look at chargeplace Scotland for example. I guess it depends wether you think the costs should be paid by everyone, or people that use them. However I do think that public-run chargers should be charged at a price that pays for the initial installation and ongoing maintenance, I don't think they should be taxpayer funded in the long run (no issue with initial capital being provided by taxpayers, as long as this is paid back with interest). Electricity at market rates is unlikely to happen even if they are publicly owned.

 

Ultimately, the setup costs of these things is fairly low in the grand scheme of things. I see no reason why public and private offerings can't coexist... let them compete to provide the best service at the lowest cost!

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, phantom_iv said:

There's no reason why local authorities for example can't install chargers and supply electricity. Look at chargeplace Scotland for example. I guess it depends wether you think the costs should be paid by everyone, or people that use them. However I do think that public-run chargers should be charged at a price that pays for the initial installation and ongoing maintenance, I don't think they should be taxpayer funded in the long run (no issue with initial capital being provided by taxpayers, as long as this is paid back with interest). Electricity at market rates is unlikely to happen even if they are publicly owned.

 

Ultimately, the setup costs of these things is fairly low in the grand scheme of things. I see no reason why public and private offerings can't coexist... let them compete to provide the best service at the lowest cost!

 

The laws regarding the re-selling of electricity have been amended such that re-sellers of electricity can charge any 'rate' they want, specifically because of the need to recover the infrastructure costs - sellers of electricity in marinas and caravan parks, flats etc can only charge their users the same amount as they are charged by their supplier.

[Thomas C King]

8 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

The laws regarding the re-selling of electricity have been amended such that re-sellers of electricity can charge any 'rate' they want, specifically because of the need to recover the infrastructure costs - sellers of electricity in marinas and caravan parks, flats etc can only charge their users the same amount as they are charged by their supplier.

Exactly. Of course, increased competition should bring the costs down (although counter-intuitively this isn't always the case, for reasons I won't go into). But, it's a slow way to get people to give up ICE, starting with early adopters and a small pool of people which limits the market's investment into expanding the infrastructure. There are probably knock-on effects for the development of more economic electric vehicles and related technologies as well.

[ditchcrawler]

If cost of recharge is such a major factor in car ownership why does anyone with fossil fuelled car buy fuel at motorway service stations and pay perhaps 20 to 25% more than at Tesco.

[nb Innisfree]

Tesla (or rather Elon Musk) has everything in hand, they are leading, and will continue to lead, the push to get rid of ICE, once that is achieved they will back off.

Their primary aim of leading EV takeup is not just to be the biggest but to stop the world burning fossil fuel, for the sake of the planet he can't be allowed to fail. 

 

IMO ?

Edited January 7, 2021 by nb Innisfree

[Thomas C King]

Question, are any of you doing anything to capture carbon from flue gas? A cursory search brings up more large-scale solutions for industry.

[peterboat]

30 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

Question, are any of you doing anything to capture carbon from flue gas? A cursory search brings up more large-scale solutions for industry.

I don't think it's possible which is why we will get caught out by regulators eventually 

[Dr Bob]

37 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

Question, are any of you doing anything to capture carbon from flue gas? A cursory search brings up more large-scale solutions for industry.

Our company is. We have just applied for a grant to do something unique with carbon capture.

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

We have just applied for a grant to do something unique with carbon capture.

 

Maybe release it back into the wild ?

Quite a lot of Zoos do that with some species.

[Dr Bob]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Maybe release it back into the wild ?

Quite a lot of Zoos do that with some species.

We are trying to reduce release you muppet!

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Dr Bob said:

We are trying to reduce release you muppet!

 

Releasing it back again would be fairly unique, and it wouldnt surpise me if there was a grant for it.

[ditchcrawler]

Inject it into the soil as fertiliser along with the dried pee 

[Thomas C King]

59 minutes ago, peterboat said:

I don't think it's possible which is why we will get caught out by regulators eventually 

You mean whatever carbon capture processes are used in industry, they are too expensive or not physically scalable down to what the average boat needs, or something else? I don't really know anything about the physics of it.

53 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

Our company is. We have just applied for a grant to do something unique with carbon capture.

Fizzy drinks? Pumped into the ground for fracking? Something else?

[TheBiscuits]

54 minutes ago, Dr Bob said:

Our company is. We have just applied for a grant to do something unique with carbon capture.

 

If you're still intending to try and spin CO2 into carbon nanotubes using three ecofans powered by the waste heat it's still not viable. 

 

The nanotubes aren't strong enough to take the full force of the ecofans ...

[Dr Bob]

33 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

You mean whatever carbon capture processes are used in industry, they are too expensive or not physically scalable down to what the average boat needs, or something else? I don't really know anything about the physics of it.

Fizzy drinks? Pumped into the ground for fracking? Something else?

Something else.

29 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

If you're still intending to try and spin CO2 into carbon nanotubes using three ecofans powered by the waste heat it's still not viable. 

 

The nanotubes aren't strong enough to take the full force of the ecofans ...

Nah, this is a good idea that does not involve ecofans or fish.

[peterboat]

1 hour ago, Thomas C King said:

You mean whatever carbon capture processes are used in industry, they are too expensive or not physically scalable down to what the average boat needs, or something else? I don't really know anything about the physics of it.

Fizzy drinks? Pumped into the ground for fracking? Something else?

I think we boat users will just be in the do dah either with having to find some way of cleaning up our act, or maybe exemption? Or no boat life in the winter ?