Looking To Buy First Time For Liveaboard

[Dozee]

Hi all

 

due to things iam looking a buying a nb as a home and project, here is what i am looking at, feedback very much appreciated and thoughts on price, also looking at residential mooring at Thames Ditton marina as closer to work.

https://www.tingdeneboatsales.net/boat-spec.php?Make=Narrowboat&Model=57-Pinder-Boats-Semi-Trad&BoatID=7637650

 

Dozee

[mrsmelly]

2 minutes ago, Dozee said:

Hi all

 

due to things iam looking a buying a nb as a home and project, here is what i am looking at, feedback very much appreciated and thoughts on price, also looking at residential mooring at Thames Ditton marina as closer to work.

https://www.tingdeneboatsales.net/boat-spec.php?Make=Narrowboat&Model=57-Pinder-Boats-Semi-Trad&BoatID=7637650

 

Dozee

I didnt read the full ad but the dreaded word " Project "was in there, what does it need doing??

[Dozee]

Lol, layout and decor, new kitchen by the looks, I am viewing it Thursday morning.

 

Dozee

[mrsmelly]

1 minute ago, Dozee said:

Lol, layout and decor, new kitchen by the looks, I am viewing it Thursday morning.

 

Dozee

Its an x hire boat built by Johny Pinder, he built good shells as does his sons who took the business on, he built me a shell twenty years ago. If the hull is good thats the main thing followed by the engine. If you could scrape 50k together you will get a hell of a lot more boat needing nowt doing to it. But of course 15k is a few quid. Decor and kitchens are quite easy to change if its not all gone mushy and wet.

[David Mack]

Typical hire boat layout. So not much living room space, but you get the separate rear cabin.

[booke23]

The advert is a bit light on details. No mention of hull thickness, engine hours or insulation material. There must be a few horrors as the broker is describing it as a project. £36k is perhaps a bit pricey for a 1991 project boat.....depends what needs doing I suppose. I like the saloon windows! 

 

Fitted out by Black Prince, so would have been a hire boat for the first 20 years of its life. Engine hours likely to be very high assuming it still has the original engine.  

 

8 minutes ago, Dozee said:

Lol, layout and decor, new kitchen by the looks, I am viewing it Thursday morning.

 

Dozee

 

Is that allowed? (lockdown)

Edited November 3, 2020 by booke23

[Dozee]

Thats good to know, absolutely no chance of going that high, wish I could, I would book a full inspection/survey before parting with cash, am thinking to reverse the layout and reduce to 1 berth with more living space as I'm single, was thinking of offering 30k cash. Can still do viewings but with gloves on ect

 

Dozee

[peterboat]

33 minutes ago, Dozee said:

Hi all

 

due to things iam looking a buying a nb as a home and project, here is what i am looking at, feedback very much appreciated and thoughts on price, also looking at residential mooring at Thames Ditton marina as closer to work.

https://www.tingdeneboatsales.net/boat-spec.php?Make=Narrowboat&Model=57-Pinder-Boats-Semi-Trad&BoatID=7637650

 

Dozee

I had one of these slightly newer and a cruiser stern, it was a good boat that I enjoyed greatly, ex hire and well made for easy repairs 

[Ally]

When you go to view, check what the insulation is, and look to see if it would be practical to fit a s/f stove anywhere. Reliance on purely an eberspacher might not be ideal.

Find out if there have been any recent surveys that are available,  but either way I would get a survey done, any offer should be subject to survey. 

Look for an inspection hatch in the floor in the back cabin too.

Notice the smell when you walk in.

Take note of things like sockets, amount and position. Relatively easy to rectify but worth a note.

Expect costs like new batteries.

Is there a service record? (May well not be)

Have a really good dig around, look inside cupboards at the back, are there signs of damp? Are the window surrounds in good condition?

The hull and engine are the most important parts, a survey can tell you about hull condition. But if there is a lot of remedial work to be done, it could easily end up at that £50 k mark.

Have you viewed a few, or is this the first?

I would encourage you to view as many as possible.

 

 

[LadyG]

I would look elsewhere if you want a liveaboard you really don't want a project.

Look for something a bit smaller and with a stove fitted amidships, changing anything major, and you will be thinking a sailaway would be easier, buy a sailaway and you will be thinking a house would be easier.

Boats eat  your money and your time, but it's lovely , most of the time.

Living in a conventional marina is not something I would risk again, an online mooring with power and reasonable access would be the way I would go.

It's frosty this morning, my windows are well insulated, the boat is well insulated, I have curtains which are designed to improve insulation, I am in shorts and T shirt, as always, bacon sarnie, home baked bread, fresh coffee, and tootsies warming by the fire.

Sunny all day, so once I'm organised I'm off to the woods to collect some dry firewood, I don't suppose you'll have the time, I expect you are on train, setting off for the Metropolis, 

John Betcheman had a few lines about that.

 

Edited November 4, 2020 by LadyG

[Tuscan]

Don’t see the point of spending £30k plus on a boat you then want to completely refurb/redesign. At least buy a boat that is laid out how you like so you just need to upgrade. Boats can be very expensive to refit.

[dor]

Seems a lot for what even the broker describes as a project.

Important details brief or missing from description.  Take someone with you who knows and understands boats.  Be prepared to throw away £1K for a survey.

I would have thought a SF stove is essential for a liveaboard.

[peterboat]

I don't see the issue its going to sell as a holiday boat for a family, because that's what it is. The insulation will be polystyrene because mine was and it was a similar age and made by the same makers. I converted mine by moving kitchen to the stern and making the front one big living area with a back boiler stove more a less in the middle of the boat simples 

[doratheexplorer]

The advert says project, but the pictures and description say otherwise.  When I hear 'project', I expect to see something which has sunk and been refloated, or similar.

[peterboat]

1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

The advert says project, but the pictures and description say otherwise.  When I hear 'project', I expect to see something which has sunk and been refloated, or similar.

Same here which is why I said it would sell as a family holiday boat. I can see 35k if it survey's well, the kubota will run nearly forever, nice boat from what I can see

[LadyG]

2 hours ago, peterboat said:

I don't see the issue its going to sell as a holiday boat for a family, because that's what it is. The insulation will be polystyrene because mine was and it was a similar age and made by the same makers. I converted mine by moving kitchen to the stern and making the front one big living area with a back boiler stove more a less in the middle of the boat simples 

Yes Peter, but you knew what you were letting yourself infor, OP is a novice he is , essentialy short of cash, this is a sinkpot for cash,

It would be OK as a summer holiday fun thing, but never ever a liveabourd, no not never.

It's more akin to a caravan than a boat.

Did you take a record of the opportunity cost of every hour, all the tols, the materials, , if you cost your labour at #£10 per hour and include all the time, including sweating over a computer, travelling costs, cost your transport at £2.. per mile, just how much did it cost,

Don't forget a skip hire to remove all internal furnishings, bed, sofa, partitions, trim, batteries, old fuel, fuel cleaning, servicing al existing stuff, replacing old redundant stuf with up to date stuff, all your work clothes,, I only did a part re-furb, and in one year I went through three pairs of used jeans and six T shirts,, there were new trainers, new tools, paint, painbrushes etc etc.

I increasc Ed the value of my boat within three months by £4K.

Another year on, and I've spent another £3k, That :£7K is direct costs, does not incude my labour.

Edited November 4, 2020 by LadyG

[peterboat]

3 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Yes Peter, but you knew what you were letting yourself infor, OP is a novice.

It would be OK as a summer holiday fun thing, but never ever a liveabourd, no not never.

It's more akin to a caravan than a boat.

Nope my first boat was the same as this one, so whilst an engineer to trade I was a novice in the boating world 

[LadyG]

15 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Nope my first boat was the same as this one, so whilst an engineer to trade I was a novice in the boating world 

Yes, anything is possible, but why choose the wrong boat to begin with, especially if OP thinks £30K is the budget, the total spend, it's just the down payment.

That boat will be just above 0 Centigrade at 04.00, OP would wake up shivering, get in to his car and turn the heater on, en route to MacDonalds for a 99p breakfast. Not healthy. Not sustainable.

Edited November 4, 2020 by LadyG

[peterboat]

3 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Yes, anything is possible, but why choose the wrong boat to begin with, especially if OP thinks £30K is the budget, the total spend, it's just the down payment.

That boat will be just above 0 Centigrade at 04.00, OP would wake up shivering, get in to his car and turn the heater on, en route to MacDonalds for a 99p breakfast. Not healthy. Not sustainable.

Because it's a sellers market! And snooze and you lose! It was the same when I bought my first boat by the time I got there to vie9it was sold so I bought a 6 berth boat and covered it to a 2 berth with a little work and a nice new kitchen. Stove installed in the new large saloon, with nice bed setee so 2 friends could stay over 

 

[LadyG]

4 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Because it's a sellers market! And snooze and you lose! It was the same when I bought my first boat by the time I got there to vie9it was sold so I bought a 6 berth boat and covered it to a 2 berth with a little work and a nice new kitchen. Stove installed in the new large saloon, with nice bed setee so 2 friends could stay over 

 

So how much did you spend, including your own labour.

This is the wrong boat, it does not matter how the market is, you don't buy a  1960's Fiat500 if you want to do 30k miles per year, and live n the highlands with rough roads and no de-icing in winter.

 

Edited November 4, 2020 by LadyG

[peterboat]

16 minutes ago, LadyG said:

So how much did you spend, including your own labour.

This is the wrong boat, it does not matter how the market is, you don't buy a  1960's Fiat500 if you want to do 30k miles per year, and live n the highlands with rough roads and no de-icing in winter.

 

You miss the point I looked at lots of boats before buying the one I did trouble is most of those boats had sold before I got there! So when a hire fleet was changing I found one I liked and paid a very large deposit on it, if I hadn't it would have been gone the next day! My costs don't matter as in the way of the world my boat worked out cheap for me

[noone]

15 hours ago, mrsmelly said:

Its an x hire boat built by Johny Pinder, he built good shells as does his sons who took the business on, he built me a shell twenty years ago. If the hull is good thats the main thing followed by the engine. If you could scrape 50k together you will get a hell of a lot more boat needing nowt doing to it. But of course 15k is a few quid. Decor and kitchens are quite easy to change if its not all gone mushy and wet.

I have a 21 year old Pinder semi trad..If the hull has been looked after,you should have no worries with it.?

[Dozee]

Lots of varying opinions and thoughts here, sadly circumstances for me dictate a need for a roof over my head apart from the car in about 4 weeks or so, I do have a bit more money handy to get me started on a refurb, I have done houses before and have more than enough tools on hand and also work in the timber industry so get a very nice discount

 

Dozee

[peterboat]

5 minutes ago, Dozee said:

Lots of varying opinions and thoughts here, sadly circumstances for me dictate a need for a roof over my head apart from the car in about 4 weeks or so, I do have a bit more money handy to get me started on a refurb, I have done houses before and have more than enough tools on hand and also work in the timber industry so get a very nice discount

 

Dozee

It's an easy one as long as the hull and engine are ok, kitchen at stern and big saloon at the pointy bit solid fuel stove with backboiler on bulkhead in middle.  I ended up with a oil fired bubble stove because it was nearly new and cheap as chips. Enjoy your new life 

[Ally]

But do look around, the broker may have others, or nearby brokerages if there are

 

And let us know how you get on?