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Edgeware & Balham on The Stratford?


cheshire~rose

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3 minutes ago, cheshire~rose said:

Well they say no publicity is bad publicity and this seems to have got a lot of publicity for the IWA :) 

 

I just had a look at the competition link in the original post.  The photo in question has a comment under it

 

Quote

Lengthsman’s Cottage, Stratford Canal. 
Editorial note: As a recognisable location, we would like to acknowledge that the composition of this image has been visibly altered


Was that comment originally there or has it been added recently?  That note would account for the background having been mirrored, but not really that the boats are photoshopped in.

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11 minutes ago, john6767 said:

I just had a look at the competition link in the original post.  The photo in question has a comment under it

 


Was that comment originally there or has it been added recently?  That note would account for the background having been mirrored, but not really that the boats are photoshopped in.

No, that note wasn't there when I started this thread 

 

 

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The Lengthsman's Cottage Stratford Canal was the winner of the Heritage & Restoration Section and would imply that this section is to highlight achievements on restoration. That the lengthsman's cottage includes new build extensions is perhaps a matter for discussion, but if the image of the cottage has been reversed that is another factor to be considered as it does not show even the true perspective.

 

The same person also had a winner in the Active Waterways Competition and again there is the question of either accuracy or alteration.

 

The wonders of digital enhancement have become available on a greater scale now, but there is the issue of ethics. Is it right to alter images for competitions? There is a clear advantage to those who have the software and the skills and such distracts from the genuine ability to take a good composition image.

 

With the 2020 IWA Competition the art of digital composition has overtaken the art of photography and may be it is time to call an end to this  competition.

 

 

 

 

 

Ashby Canal.jpg

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20 hours ago, BuckbyLocks said:

Europe was built in 1974 I think. It's first trip in and around Brum was to promote the European Union. Because of that it was 'launched' the other side of the Bar Lock by Edward Heath. I helped with the fit out, was present at the 'Launch' and also helped by steering the dead boat down into Stratford when the engine broke its crankshaft half way down the South Stratford. The Ansells boat was definitely pre 70. 

May 1975 according to this photograph of mine.

20201106_145326_Europa_0001.jpg.eaaa21710d0f2197a422afca484e9c05.jpg

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I'm not sure that I understand why these images are so bad. Photographs have never been an exact representation of their subject (unless you live in a two-dimensional world with limited contrast and very variable colours). All that's happened is that we now have the tools to manipulate the results in new, and fairly extreme, ways. Personally I kinda-sorta like the images but wouldn't see them as competition winners.

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9 minutes ago, GilesMorris said:

I'm not sure that I understand why these images are so bad. Photographs have never been an exact representation of their subject (unless you live in a two-dimensional world with limited contrast and very variable colours). All that's happened is that we now have the tools to manipulate the results in new, and fairly extreme, ways. Personally I kinda-sorta like the images but wouldn't see them as competition winners.

There's nothing wrong with trick photography but, as you imply, its use in competitions could be seen as cheating.

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4 minutes ago, GilesMorris said:

I'm not sure that I understand why these images are so bad.

They're not "bad" in any moral sense or even in an artistic, aesthetic sense (although that is a matter of taste)

 

5 minutes ago, GilesMorris said:

but wouldn't see them as competition winners.

This is the issue at point - should they even be entered. 

 

In the old days of film photography there were a lot of tricks some of which were accepted and some of which (such as double exposure) were cheating, certainly in any sense of "this is a picture of..." (the loch Ness Monster?) - the tricks ran from under or over exposure, to using filters, to changing the chemicals on processing. 

 

Back then, cutting a pair of boats off one photo and sticking them on another would mean the end result was not a photograph but a collage  a collection or combination,  from the Greek Kolla, or glue

 

Just as many of the digital effects can be likened to developing E6 film with E4 chemicals, photoshopping can be likened to cutting and pasting - artistic, but not really photography. 

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It's a bit like painting by numbers in a way. Not really painting and not true photography - that is, taking a picture of something in real life as it appear in real life. Filters Are fine for cloudscapes, but building up an image from overlaying images with a computer, whilst clever, is not really what photographic competitions should be about.

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always felt photography was about catching a unique opportunity in time, not manipulating an image. Still each to their own.

I will never forget the excitement of doing your own developing and printing, watching  a negative come to life in the stink of toxic gasses.

 

There was something about developing a black and white roll film and then using an enlarger to print the negative. Now I have a program that scans negatives, or positives, into digital form. Yet  the images are still original, when ever taken. In the darkroom or by these modern processes the image can be improved, but there is a big difference between that and what can be done in photoshop. Still techniques such as are found in  photoshop are useful in restoring damaged heritage images.

 

Manipulating an image, as stated above, I also do not agree with.

 

  

 

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1 minute ago, Heartland said:

always felt photography was about catching a unique opportunity in time, not manipulating an image. Still each to their own.

I will never forget the excitement of doing your own developing and printing, watching  a negative come to life in the stink of toxic gasses.

 

There was something about developing a black and white roll film and then using an enlarger to print the negative. Now I have a program that scans negatives, or positives, into digital form. Yet  the images are still original, when ever taken. In the darkroom or by these modern processes the image can be improved, but there is a big difference between that and what can be done in photoshop. Still techniques such as are found in  photoshop are useful in restoring damaged heritage images.

 

Manipulating an image, as stated above, I also do not agree with.

 

  

 

The Russians were experts with people leaving and arriving on balconies 

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8 hours ago, Heartland said:

The Lengthsman's Cottage Stratford Canal was the winner of the Heritage & Restoration Section and would imply that this section is to highlight achievements on restoration. That the lengthsman's cottage includes new build extensions is perhaps a matter for discussion, but if the image of the cottage has been reversed that is another factor to be considered as it does not show even the true perspective.

 

The same person also had a winner in the Active Waterways Competition and again there is the question of either accuracy or alteration.

 

The wonders of digital enhancement have become available on a greater scale now, but there is the issue of ethics. Is it right to alter images for competitions? There is a clear advantage to those who have the software and the skills and such distracts from the genuine ability to take a good composition image.

 

With the 2020 IWA Competition the art of digital composition has overtaken the art of photography and may be it is time to call an end to this  competition.

 

 

 

 

 

Ashby Canal.jpg

I don't know where this bridge is, it has a feel of being on the T&M somewhere up around Acton Bridge but I really have no idea.

 

I rather like this image, probably because at first glance it doesn't seem to be an impossible scene like the other one. 

 

I think yo get that photo the photographer must have been on a moored boat as the subject came past. That would also account for there being very little prop wash as the boat has slowed down to pass a moored boat. The dog in the foreground even appears to be giving a slightly sidelong glance at the photographer.

 

Whether it would be a likely or appropriate place to be moored I can't comment but at first glance this image doesn't mess with the potential reality to try and make a photo fit the title 

 

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2 minutes ago, cheshire~rose said:

I don't know where this bridge is, it has a feel of being on the T&M somewhere up around Acton Bridge but I really have no idea.

 

I rather like this image, probably because at first glance it doesn't seem to be an impossible scene like the other one. 

 

I think yo get that photo the photographer must have been on a moored boat as the subject came past. That would also account for there being very little prop wash as the boat has slowed down to pass a moored boat. The dog in the foreground even appears to be giving a slightly sidelong glance at the photographer.

 

Whether it would be a likely or appropriate place to be moored I can't comment but at first glance this image doesn't mess with the potential reality to try and make a photo fit the title 

 

I would suggest he was probably sitting waiting for a lock by the way he is standing and the dogs looking ashore

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33 minutes ago, cheshire~rose said:

I don't know where this bridge is, it has a feel of being on the T&M somewhere up around Acton Bridge but I really have no idea.

 

I rather like this image, probably because at first glance it doesn't seem to be an impossible scene like the other one. 

 

I think yo get that photo the photographer must have been on a moored boat as the subject came past. That would also account for there being very little prop wash as the boat has slowed down to pass a moored boat. The dog in the foreground even appears to be giving a slightly sidelong glance at the photographer.

 

Whether it would be a likely or appropriate place to be moored I can't comment but at first glance this image doesn't mess with the potential reality to try and make a photo fit the title 

 

It looks like a building is reflected in the side of the boat but without knowing where the bridge is it is difficult to know whether there is a building alongside.

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2 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

It looks like a building is reflected in the side of the boat but without knowing where the bridge is it is difficult to know whether there is a building alongside.

Looking at the reflection in the side of the boat  I think it could be the bridge reflected there? Maybe this one hasn't been messed with?

 

It says it is at Zouch, I am not familiar with that bit of canal could it be? 

Here it is: 

 

https://canalplan.uk/photo/cvgi_0

 

Footbridge over Zouch Cut number 44. It appears boats do moor there 

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Zouch cut, River Soar. Looks right and as stated above the bridge is reflected on the side of the boat. The image appears to have been enhanced but I suspect the boat and bridge were photographed together. Trouble is the photographer has created doubt as to whether any of their images are true representations of what they purport to show.

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1 minute ago, Captain Pegg said:

Zouch cut, River Soar. Looks right and as stated above the bridge is reflected on the side of the boat. The image appears to have been enhanced but I suspect the boat and bridge were photographed together. Trouble is the photographer has created doubt as to whether any of their images are true representations of what they purport to show.

Or maybe I created the doubt by asking the opening question? 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, cheshire~rose said:

Or maybe I created the doubt by asking the opening question? 

 

 

No you exposed that first image for what it is, not a genuine photograph. As to if it is acceptable for the photographic competition, that is down to the organisers, who clearly thought it was ok to use a photoshop composite.  It is reasonable therefore to question as genuine photographs any that this person publishes as he seems to specialise inphotoshopped works.

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4 minutes ago, john6767 said:

No you exposed that first image for what it is, not a genuine photograph. As to if it is acceptable for the photographic competition, that is down to the organisers, who clearly thought it was ok to use a photoshop composite.  It is reasonable therefore to question as genuine photographs any that this person publishes as he seems to specialise inphotoshopped works.

Or they didn't notice and took it on face value

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