Anderton Lift To Close For A Year

[Hudds Lad]

7 minutes ago, Athy said:

Would that not be just one person speaking to one other person? The "conference" part shows that several people are involved.

but is a conference not usually something that goes on over several days? otherwise its just a meeting

[Athy]

10 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

but is a conference not usually something that goes on over several days? otherwise its just a meeting

It certainly can be. But it just means that people are conferring.

[doratheexplorer]

34 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

We used to just call them a 'video conference'. No new,  made up, corporate nonsense.

A video conference and a webinar are not the same thing.

 

A video conference is fully collaborative.  A webinar is one person giving instruction to others, who might occassionally interject.  People might well use these terms wrongly though.

[Rob-M]

1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

A video conference and a webinar are not the same thing.

 

A video conference is fully collaborative.  A webinar is one person giving instruction to others, who might occassionally interject.  People might well use these terms wrongly though.

I agree, to me a webinar is an online seminar so therefore is mainly a presenter presenting something and others watching\listening (or playing on their phone). There may be opportunity for questions either through voice, video or typing in a chat facility.

[dor]

3 hours ago, Athy said:

Would that not be just one person speaking to one other person? The "conference" part shows that several people are involved.

Don't we have to call them "stakeholders" now?

 

Corporate bullshit that I refused to use when working.  Just the same as I always referred to "customers" not "clients", who where dealt with by "salespeople" not "sales executives"

[Guest]

We called them a video conference 10-15 years ago no matter what the format was.

 

Webinar is just another silly made up corporate BS word. Probably crept into the education sector too.

[Athy]

57 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

 

Webinar is just another silly made up corporate BS word. Probably crept into the education sector too.

Nah, they still call them staff meetings as far as I know.

1 hour ago, dor said:

Just the same as I always referred to "customers" not "clients",

On the railways they've gone the other way: we used to be passengers, now we're customers.

....who alight at a "station stop".

[cuthound]

1 hour ago, The Happy Nomad said:

We called them a video conference 10-15 years ago no matter what the format was.

 

Webinar is just another silly made up corporate BS word. Probably crept into the education sector too.

 

Indeed, I had my first video conference back in the early 90's, to talk to American clients who were experiencing some power related problems with their UK based equipment housed in what was then the worlds largest telephone exchange.

 

I had to go to a dedicated "video conference suite" which was kitted out with loads of huge cameras and microphones. It was hired out to many large companies.

[doratheexplorer]

New words only stick around if they serve some purpose.  Webinar has a meaning which is distinct from video conference or staff meeting.  Those moaning about the word have clearly never been involved in one.  If I'm invited to a webinar, I prepare accordingly and differently than for a conference or general meeting.  Thus it's useful and will probably be used for some time yet, until technology or society evolves in a way to render such things obsolete.  Necessity is the mother of invention and all that...

 

I was first invited to a webinar about ten years ago, so I realise that it's not a familiar thing to all the oldies on this forum.

[magpie patrick]

3 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

If I'm invited to a webinar, I prepare accordingly and differently than for a conference or general meeting. 

Indeed - I recently realised I can attend many webinars in my pyjamas - not so clever for zoom meetings!

 

(Not if it's me presenting, although even then some webinars I've been to make no use of cameras at all) 

 

On a more serious note, the interaction in a webinar is very asymmetrical, whereas for me at least a Zoom meeting or Teams meeting is likely to be a balance of speaking and listening. 

 

(I use the terms Zoom and Teams as my clients use either but not both, and I have to remember which one to set up or log onto)

[doratheexplorer]

2 minutes ago, magpie patrick said:

Indeed - I recently realised I can attend many webinars in my pyjamas - not so clever for zoom meetings!

 

(Not if it's me presenting, although even then some webinars I've been to make no use of cameras at all) 

 

On a more serious note, the interaction in a webinar is very asymmetrical, whereas for me at least a Zoom meeting or Teams meeting is likely to be a balance of speaking and listening. 

 

(I use the terms Zoom and Teams as my clients use either but not both, and I have to remember which one to set up or log onto)

It's easy to tell on this thread, who's of working age and who's not...

 

How about shirt, tie + pyjama bottoms and virtual background.  That'll trick em!

 

You really don't want to know what I'm wearing from the waist down when I'm on Zoom/Teams meetings!

Edited October 28, 2020 by doratheexplorer

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

New words only stick around if they serve some purpose.  Webinar has a meaning which is distinct from video conference or staff meeting.  Those moaning about the word have clearly never been involved in one.  If I'm invited to a webinar, I prepare accordingly and differently than for a conference or general meeting.  Thus it's useful and will probably be used for some time yet, until technology or society evolves in a way to render such things obsolete.  Necessity is the mother of invention and all that...

 

I was first invited to a webinar about ten years ago, so I realise that it's not a familiar thing to all the oldies on this forum.

I was involved in one, in fact several over many years. We also used to use 'conference calls' when using the telephone rather than video . I guess there must be a new 'hip' word for those that us oldies don't know about. ?

 

But we called it a video conference. The word 'webinar' didn't even exist 10-15 years ago. If it did I clearly worked for an employer that wasn't daft enough to use it. The term video conference was used regardless of the format, whether it be a seminar type presentation or a meeting.

 

 

[1st ade]

4 minutes ago, magpie patrick said:

Indeed - I recently realised I can attend many webinars in my pyjamas - not so clever for zoom meetings!

 

(Not if it's me presenting, although even then some webinars I've been to make no use of cameras at all) 

 

On a more serious note, the interaction in a webinar is very asymmetrical, whereas for me at least a Zoom meeting or Teams meeting is likely to be a balance of speaking and listening. 

 

(I use the terms Zoom and Teams as my clients use either but not both, and I have to remember which one to set up or log onto)

"Teams" (a product from Microsoft) has several modes - it can be a two party video call (which, even on a small screen, is surprisingly good), it can be a video conference call (which is quite good) but it also has a presentation mode where the presenter is the only one allowed to speak (or present) but allows a quite good Q&A session on request - a reasonable compromise on the lecturer not being interrupted but given space (and the format) for questions at the end

[doratheexplorer]

Just now, doratheexplorer said:

It's easy to tell on this thread, who's of working age and who's not...

 

2 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

I was involved in one, in fact several over many years. We also used to use 'conference calls' when using the telephone rather than video . I guess there must be a new 'hip' word for those that us oldies don't know about. ?

 

But we called it a video conference. The word 'webinar' didn't even exist 10-15 years ago. If it did I clearly worked for an employer that wasn't daft enough to use it. The term video conference was used regardless of the format, whether it be a seminar type presentation or a meeting.

 

 

It came in about 10 years ago I think.  It's a useful term for the reasons given.  If it weren't useful we wouldn't have the word 'seminar' either.  Prior to this, people would turn up expecting a meeting, get something quite different and get cross...

[magpie patrick]

2 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 We also used to use 'conference calls' when using the telephone rather than video . I guess there must be a new 'hip' word for those that us oldies don't know about. ?

 

Nope, they are the original conference call, and if someone asks for a conference call that's what I expect. One big difference is that most mobile phones can host such a call these days. 

 

As for the other terms, most language evolves to enhance understanding - the distinction is useful, just as the distinction between meeting and seminar is useful

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

It's easy to tell on this thread, who's of working age and who's not...

 

How about shirt, tie + pyjama bottoms and virtual background.  That'll trick em!

 

You really don't want to know what I'm wearing from the waist down when I'm on Zoom/Teams meetings!

Well I'm working age, or rather  61 was last time I checked.

 

I'm lucky enough not to have to work though.........

 

I will ask my daughter about this new fangled term. She works from home (not just because of the C word) in a new job. All their training and meetings are on line (as is all her work) so if anybody has heard of the term she will have.

[doratheexplorer]

From wikipedia;

 

"The term "webinar" is a portmanteau of web and seminar, meaning a presentation, lecture, or workshop that is transmitted over the web. The coined term has been attacked for improper construction,^[2] since "inar" is not a valid root. Webinar was included on the Lake Superior University 2008 List of Banished Words,^[3] but was included in the Merriam-Webster dictionary that same year.^[4]"

[magpie patrick]

4 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

Superior University 2008 List of Banished Words,^[3] 

Superior meaning snooty in this instance?   

Edited October 28, 2020 by magpie patrick

[Guest]

Just now, doratheexplorer said:

From wikipedia;

 

"The term "webinar" is a portmanteau of web and seminar, meaning a presentation, lecture, or workshop that is transmitted over the web. The coined term has been attacked for improper construction,^[2] since "inar" is not a valid root. Webinar was included on the Lake Superior University 2008 List of Banished Words,^[3] but was included in the Merriam-Webster dictionary that same year.^[4]"

Yes I've done that.

 

I'm not denying the term exists or is in use.

 

The comments on wiki are very interesting though.

 

And of course unsurprisingly it appears to have originated in the US.... quelle surprise!

2 minutes ago, magpie patrick said:

Superior meaning snooty in this instance?   

No, I'm with them on this. Too late now though unfortunately.

 

And I'm far from snooty, just old as has been pointed out.........

[doratheexplorer]

7 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

Yes I've done that.

 

I'm not denying the term exists or is in use.

 

 

Except you pretty much have:  "All their training and meetings are on line (as is all her work) so if anybody has heard of the term she will have."

 

I'm now waiting with baited breath for your daughter's approval as to whether I'm just delusional or not. I'm not sure why your daughter is the arbiter of such things, but our is not to reason why.

[Guest]

Just now, doratheexplorer said:

Except you pretty much have:  "All their training and meetings are on line (as is all her work) so if anybody has heard of the term she will have."

 

I'm now waiting with baited breath for your daughter's approval as to whether I'm just delusional or not. I'm not sure why your daughter is the arbiter of such things, but our is not to reason why.

I'm curious as to how widely used the term is.

 

She works for a tech savvy private health care company - I'm curious to know if they routinely use the term. It's far from being 'arbitration' on anything.

[BEngo]

5 hours ago, dmr said:

I love the Weaver, we spent half the winter on it a couple of years ago, and it does contain a number of big expensive structures. Anderton lift is a big and iconic part of the waterways and I suspect CRTwould not be brave enough to abandon it.

If it closes for a year half of me things this forum plus NABO etc should organise monthly cruises up the MSC just to keep plenty of boats using the Weaver.

My cynical side fears that CRT would then say "MSC works fine, we don't really need a working Anderton, its only boaters who use it and the visiting cyclists don't care whether it works or not.

 

................Dave

Anderton lift, or the trip boat that uses it, plus cafe etc. actually makes money for CRT   (in a normal year that is), and ticks a lot of the attracting people to waterways boxes, so they have little incentive to close the lift permanently IMO.  That said, the capacity of CRT to be stupid seems to be even larger than that of their predecessors, so we shall see.

 

The current lift is almost all a complicated machine that was brand new but over 20 years ago.  The main bits that survive in use from previous versions are the frame, the hole in the ground  and the tanks. These bits are fairly easily looked after. Other parts are not.

 

The lift is computer controlled, unlike its predecessors.  The computers  and the peripheral bits that tell the computers and the operators what is actually happening are all 1990's technology and are obsolete, big style.   Combine that with the general old age of the system, which operates in a fairly hostile environment (though not as hostile as it was once) and it is no longer a reliable device.  That has safety as well as operational consequences.

 

I would agree that during a prolonged closure it would be good to see the boaters organisations arranging Weaver Access trips via the MSC, both to Ellesmere Port and to Salford docks.

 

Maybe the IWA could combine access with a rally at the lower flash?

N

 

 

 

[doratheexplorer]

1 minute ago, The Happy Nomad said:

I'm curious as to how widely used the term is.

 

She works for a tech savvy private health care company - I'm curious to know if they routinely use the term. It's far from being 'arbitration' on anything.

If what you say is true then she will have heard of it.  It's in common usage.  When talking with customers/clients/people at work, I don't expect to have to explain what I mean by webinar.

 

Obviously, I had to explain it on here, but CWDF is a special case!

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

If what you say is true then she will have heard of it.  It's in common usage.  When talking with customers/clients/people at work, I don't expect to have to explain what I mean by webinar.

 

Obviously, I had to explain it on here, but CWDF is a special case!

Which bit do you think might not be true?

 

And  you actually didn't have to explain any thing. The original comment I made was in a semi light hearted fashion as it is a word that I personally think is a bit 'daft'. I see no need for you to personally defend it's use  quite so vigorously..........................................................................unless of course you invented the term. ?

 

I think perhaps on reflection shooting someone for coming up with such a silly word was perhaps going over the top. A simple public flogging might be sufficient.

 

 

Edited October 28, 2020 by The Happy Nomad

[tree monkey]

34 minutes ago, 1st ade said:

"Teams" (a product from Microsoft) has several modes - it can be a two party video call (which, even on a small screen, is surprisingly good), it can be a video conference call (which is quite good) but it also has a presentation mode where the presenter is the only one allowed to speak (or present) but allows a quite good Q&A session on request - a reasonable compromise on the lecturer not being interrupted but given space (and the format) for questions at the end

Im new to this sort of thing but I've been fairly impressed with teams/zoom as it happens, the big problem with it is it has given even more opportunity for pointless meeting by over zealous management.

I have heard though it is perfectly possible to log into an "important" meeting and completely ignore it