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Mike Todd Veteran

Mike ToddDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

A marina moorer cannot officially be required to have a licence in a private marina. By official, I mean by law. 

 

 

Assuming 'by law' you mean statutory law, OK. But since there is also contract law which is also enforceable, you have still not answered the question - so what?

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Higgs Influencer

Higgs

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

Assuming 'by law' you mean statutory law, OK. But since there is also contract law which is also enforceable, you have still not answered the question - so what?

 

If you have conceded that a licence is not a legal requirement in a private marina, what other requirement of a licence could justify its need? I accept there are the terms and conditions of the marina in force, but these are not of a licensing authority. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Higgs
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Higgs Influencer

Higgs

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Contract Law. He’s already said so. 
 

 

No - the terms and conditions of the marina do that. The contract doesn't confer any legal right of enforcement on the marina, or CRT. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Higgs
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Jerra Veteran II

Jerra

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

No - the terms and conditions of the marina do that. The contract doesn't confer any legal right of enforcement on the marina, or CRT. 

Surely the marina has a legal right to refuse a mooring or require people to leave if they break their contract with the marina i.e. to have the boat licenced.

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Arthur Marshall Veteran II

Arthur Marshall

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

If you have conceded that a licence is not a legal requirement in a private marina, what other requirement of a licence could justify its need? I accept there are the terms and conditions of the marina in force, but these are not of a licensing authority. 

 

Need is irrelevant, as is logic or common sense. All that matters is what a marina says you have to have to be allowed by them to moor in it.  Nobody has to justify anything. There's no end to this particular argument, as we all know...

There's no law, for example, to say I can't live most of the year on my current leisure mooring as I did on the previous one, except that this farmer will turf me off and the other one didn't mind.  Laws, terms and conditions, rules, guidelines - none of them have any actual meaning or effect unless they are enforceable, and, if they are, and they are enforced, and you don't have the reciprocal clout to disenforce it, then you're stuffed, and that's all that matters.  It all comes down to where you are in the food chain...

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Higgs Influencer

Higgs

Posted
Posted
Just now, WotEver said:

... form a contract between you and them.

 

That wouldn't solve the issue.

 

 

Just now, Arthur Marshall said:

Need is irrelevant, as is logic or common sense. All that matters is what a marina says you have to have to be allowed by them to moor in it.  Nobody has to justify anything. There's no end to this particular argument, as we all know...

There's no law, for example, to say I can't live most of the year on my current leisure mooring as I did on the previous one, except that this farmer will turf me off and the other one didn't mind.  Laws, terms and conditions, rules, guidelines - none of them have any actual meaning or effect unless they are enforceable, and, if they are, and they are enforced, and you don't have the reciprocal clout to disenforce it, then you're stuffed, and that's all that matters.  It all comes down to where you are in the food chain...

 

You could use that rationale of yours to justify how the Mafia work. No authority - who cares. 

 

 

 

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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted
Just now, Higgs said:

That wouldn't solve the issue.

But it does.  Because if you breach those terms (by not having a license) then you won't have a mooring.

 

There's no law that states I have to pay the farmer the rent for my business premises but if I didn't then I wouldn't have any business premises.  It's a very simple contract, just like the one you have with the marina.

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Jerra Veteran II

Jerra

Posted
Posted
Just now, Higgs said:

 

I haven't broken any contracts.

 

 

You seem to being having difficulty with the fact that the marina is entitled to put whatever it likes in its contract T&Cs.   Then if people don't stick to the contract they are entitled to evict them.

 

That isn't menace its normal business, you make a contract and if either party breaks the contract there are consequences.

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Higgs Influencer

Higgs

Posted
Posted
Just now, Jerra said:

You seem to being having difficulty with the fact that the marina is entitled to put whatever it likes in its contract T&Cs.   Then if people don't stick to the contract they are entitled to evict them.

 

That isn't menace its normal business, you make a contract and if either party breaks the contract there are consequences.

 

I wasn't party to the contract the marina signed with CRT. And to my knowledge, there's nothing specified in the terms of my licence agreement with CRT that says I must consider a marina part of CRT's statutory authority. 

 

 

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Mike Todd Veteran

Mike ToddDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Higgs said:

 

I wasn't party to the contract the marina signed with CRT. And to my knowledge, there's nothing specified in the terms of my licence agreement with CRT that says I must consider a marina part of CRT's statutory authority. 

 

 

Why should there be?

 

But you still have not answered the question, so what? 

 

Given that a moorer wishes to stay in the marina indefinitely, and the marina wish to keep their connection to the canal, what difference does it make? 

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Jerra Veteran II

Jerra

Posted
Posted
Just now, Higgs said:

 

I wasn't party to the contract the marina signed with CRT. And to my knowledge, there's nothing specified in the terms of my licence agreement with CRT that says I must consider a marina part of CRT's statutory authority. 

 

 

I don't think without reading the thread again anybody has suggested what you are suggesting.    The point under discussion is IMO simple.

 

The marina owners are entitled to make any agreement they want with CRT for access to the canal.   Then they are also entitled to say we will only allow moorings if you have a current boat licence.   All simple straightforward business.  I see no reason why anybody should try to pretend otherwise.

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Higgs Influencer

Higgs

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Mike Todd said:

Given that a moorer wishes to stay in the marina indefinitely, and the marina wish to keep their connection to the canal, what difference does it make? 

 

Make up your mind. Am I supposed to be buying a licence for the benefit of the marina, or, to give me entitlement to use the canal . 

 

 

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Jerra Veteran II

Jerra

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Find the specific mention of that in your licence agreement. 

 

 

How many time do you need told it is nothing to do with you and your licence agreement.  It is based on standard business practice and contract law.

 

Why do you keep pretending it is to do with an agreement between you and CRT?

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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Higgs said:

Make up your mind. Am I supposed to be buying a licence for the benefit of the marina, or, to give me entitlement to use the canal . 

Neither.  You are buying a license in order to comply with your contractual obligations with the marina.  By happy coincidence that license will also permit you to use CRT's waters.  Of course, you're under no obligation to do so but you can if you wish.

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