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Which 240 hook up socket ?


narrowboatmike

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4 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

perhaps it would help if we all agreed to call these items bulkhead plug and cable socket.

Surely it is simple.

 

Think of your normal domestic 'extension lead' for comparison.

 

You plug in the plug of the extension lead into the socket in the house wall (you plug your shoreline plug into the bollard)

Unroll the extension lead and you have a socket on the end (unroll your shoreline and you have a socket on the end)

Plug your 'drill' into the socket and you have power. (You plug your boat into the socket and you have power)

 

Obviously a boat is a bit big so pick up and push into the socket so the socket is pushed ONTO the boat plug.

 

Having said that it is better to actually connect the boat end first - Why ?

Because if you connect the bollard end first and then walking back to the boat drop the socket into the water you can 'blow' the whole marina, or at a minimum trip the bollard.

4 minutes ago, Loddon said:

I know that I have been using these connectors almost all my life

 

The reply was to Robthe plod who had labelled his illustrations incorrectly.

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2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Having said that it is better to actually connect the boat end first - Why ?

Because if you connect the bollard end first and then walking back to the boat drop the socket into the water you can 'blow' the whole marina, or at a minimum trip the bollard.

Being pedantic you should not switch on the supply until after both ends are connected.

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1 minute ago, Loddon said:

As I said when mounted pins down the water runs down the case of the surface mount appliance inlet male connector and fills the female coupler with water. 

 

 

Ok, if that is your experinec then that is your experience.

I have been boating for over 30 years (and caravanning before that) and never had an inveted plug or socket get water ingress.

 

Maybe the quality of the fitings plays a part ?

2 minutes ago, Loddon said:

Being pedantic you should not switch on the supply until after both ends are connected.

True.

Trip the bollard, plug in, connect the boat, go back to bollard and reset the trip.

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1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Maybe the quality of the fitings plays a part ?

No they came from work and he never used rubbish.

If you have always used IP67 versions it doesn't usually happen. 

Experience of these connectors is something I do have.

I could list loads if other foibles with these connectors where they can fail in normal use ;)

 

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35 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

An simple & elegant solution to a non-problem.

 

I'd suggest that is the 'right way up'.

The plug is wired thru' the bulhead so water cannot get in there.

Any rain hitting the plug or socket  will run down the outside (it will not run uphill in the gap between plug & socket)

The rain cannot penetrate the socket cable entry point and will just run downwards.

 

 

I'd be very interested for someone who believes this to be 'the wrong way up' to explain why.

 

I've never, not once, had water getting into my plugs or sockets when installed like this.

 

 

 

 

 

It is the wrong way up. look at the picture and you can clearly see the shroud on the trailing socket facing upwards which allows water into it. The trailing socket is always the larger diameter so fits over the plug so the socket should always point downwards.  It sounds to me that you have got a surface socket (hollow pins) pointing downwards and a trailing plug (solid pins) inserted  upwards. If you have a trailing plug both ends of the shoreline it's very dangerous as it's possible to touch the live pins when plugged into the shoreline.  Please post a picture of you installation.  

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9 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

 

It is the wrong way up. look at the picture and you can clearly see the shroud on the trailing socket facing upwards which allows water into it. The trailing socket is always the larger diameter so fits over the plug so the socket should always point downwards.  It sounds to me that you have got a surface socket (hollow pins) pointing downwards and a trailing plug (solid pins) inserted  upwards. If you have a trailing plug both ends of the shoreline it's very dangerous as it's possible to touch the live pins when plugged into the shoreline.  Please post a picture of you installation.  

No, it had the correct plug / socket ends.

 

Showing pictures of my current boats would not be much help'

 

One has the Marinco (marine') plug where everything is sealed with neoprene gaskets, (The Cat) and the other (the Cruiser) has a recessed plug behind a 'flap' that is lifted and the whole plug and socket combination is recessed into the boat.

 

image.jpeg.407705cd2df891e0ab05fd3da97ecdca.jpeg

 

CARAVAN FLUSH FITTING 240V 3 PIN MAINS PLUG INLET BOX WHITE - PO113W

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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30 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

 

It is the wrong way up. look at the picture and you can clearly see the shroud on the trailing socket facing upwards which allows water into it. The trailing socket is always the larger diameter so fits over the plug so the socket should always point downwards.  It sounds to me that you have got a surface socket (hollow pins) pointing downwards and a trailing plug (solid pins) inserted  upwards. If you have a trailing plug both ends of the shoreline it's very dangerous as it's possible to touch the live pins when plugged into the shoreline.  Please post a picture of you installation.  

When I didn't know better, I fitted a surface 'socket' (the pin one) the wrong way up, just as pictured. The 'plug' on the cable filled up with water, just as Flyboy described.

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16 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

No, it had the correct plug / socket ends.

 

Showing pictures of my current boats would not be much help'

 

One has the Marinco (marine') plug where everything is sealed with neoprene gaskets, (The Cat) and the other (the Cruiser) has a recessed plug behind a 'flap' that is lifted and the whole plug and socket combination is recessed into the boat.

 

image.jpeg.407705cd2df891e0ab05fd3da97ecdca.jpeg

 

CARAVAN FLUSH FITTING 240V 3 PIN MAINS PLUG INLET BOX WHITE - PO113W

Yes what you have is a proper marine set up which should  not let water in.  What I am talking about is the cheapo  surface mount plugs/sockets that most inland boats have.  Rob the plods pictures are typical of what most boats (including mine) have on inland waterways.

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14 minutes ago, Alastair said:

When I didn't know better, I fitted a surface 'socket' (the pin one) the wrong way up, just as pictured. The 'plug' on the cable filled up with water, just as Flyboy described.

You can drill a 4.5mm hole in the trailing socket to drain any water before it gets into the wiring. This works quite well on surface plugs that are mounted pins down.

CIMG9826.JPG

Edited by Flyboy
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27 minutes ago, Flyboy said:

Yes what you have is a proper marine set up which should  not let water in.  What I am talking about is the cheapo  surface mount plugs/sockets that most inland boats have.  Rob the plods pictures are typical of what most boats (including mine) have on inland waterways.

Yes, I kmow, but on the dozen or so NB's I've had I have used the 'standard' blue plugs and sockets, but have not used the £1 Chinese ones off Ebay, but quality ones giving a level of 'waterproofness'.

Loddon suggest they may be IP67, I don't remember, its some years since I last installed any but they didn't have the twist lock so may be IP66

 

It's important to note that although an IP66 is waterproof against hose-directed water, rain or snow, it's not intended to be submerged in water

 

IP67 means that the 'item' can be submerged in 1 metre of water for 30 minutes without any ingress.

I know the Marinco ones are IP67.

 

Surely it makes sense to use these in a wet, boat environment.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

IP67 means that the 'item' can be submerged in 1 metre of water for 30 minutes without any ingress.

I know the Marinco ones are IP67.

It is however unlikely the shore power socket would be required to function if submerged in 1m of water as  boats are usually quite good at  keeping the socket above the water line , especially when in a marina and connected to shore power.

No so many Marinco (expensive) sockets are seen on lumpy water boats - more often the caravan flap type shown  earlier  .  Although why  shore power inlets  are located on the outside of the boat and not in a more protected location I don't quite understand. My first boat had the shore power inlet under a cockpit seat which was under canvas canopy cover most of the time - very well protected - simply trailed the cable onboard .  

The same with fuel filler caps - is a flap as used on almost all cars  these days and seen with a simple pull cable release on VW's in the early 1970's  too much to ask ? 

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32 minutes ago, MartynG said:

No so many Marinco (expensive) sockets are seen on lumpy water boats

The Marinco on the Cat.

In my experience most 'proper' sea-going boats have that type, whilst coast-hoppers have the standard IP44 type, or, the 'behind the flap' type.

InkedIMG_1018 Zoom_LI.jpg

32 minutes ago, MartynG said:

No so many Marinco (expensive) sockets are seen on lumpy water boats

The Marinco on the Cat.

In my experience most 'proper' sea-going boats have that type, whilst coast-hoppers have the standard IP44 type, or, the 'behind the flap' type.

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