BSS. ??

[Bobbybass]

Hi.

 

My boat is due a BSS next March.

 

I dug out the old one, and was puzzled?

 

There were various comments with the certificate that were never actioned.

 

" Gas leak from old hose in gas locker".

I checked with a meter and there is/was  still a leak and the flexible hose is/ was ( not now ) dated 1991 !!.

 

" No gas shut off sign on kitchen cupboard".

 

There wasn't still a sign..I've just fixed one on.

 

" Fuel tank breather blocked". 

 

The very obviously old breather was blocked and I replaced it.

 

My extinguishers were all date stamped 2000

 

I thought all of these items were supposed to be actioned before issuing a certificate ?..

 

Have I got that wrong ?.

 

Thanks.

 

Bob

 

[WotEver]

No, you’ve got that right. 

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, Bobbybass said:

Hi.

 

My boat is due a BSS next March.

 

I dug out the old one, and was puzzled?

 

There were various comments with the certificate that were never actioned.

 

" Gas leak from old hose in gas locker".

I checked with a meter and there is/was  still a leak and the flexible hose is/ was ( not now ) dated 1991 !!.

 

" No gas shut off sign on kitchen cupboard".

 

There wasn't still a sign..I've just fixed one on.

 

" Fuel tank breather blocked". 

 

The very obviously old breather was blocked and I replaced it.

 

My extinguishers were all date stamped 2000

 

I thought all of these items were supposed to be actioned before issuing a certificate ?..

 

Have I got that wrong ?.

 

Thanks.

 

Bob

 

 

That's the BSS for you - makes you feel all safe and snuggly doesn't it !

[TheBiscuits]

1 hour ago, Bobbybass said:

I thought all of these items were supposed to be actioned before issuing a certificate ?..

 

Is it actually a certificate, or a notice of failure?

 

What does it say immediately after the line:

"Did the boat meet all the applicable minimum safety requirements?"

 

It will either be Yes or No!

[Alan de Enfield]

2 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Is it actually a certificate, or a notice of failure?

 

What does it say immediately after the line:

"Did the boat meet all the applicable minimum safety requirements?"

 

It will either be Yes or No!

Surely the point is that (presumably) it has been licensed for the last 4 years and yet the OP has found that of the list of failure points non have been rectified. How could it be licensed without the work being done and a subsequent BSS issued

[Bobbybass]

10 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

Is it actually a certificate, or a notice of failure?

 

What does it say immediately after the line:

"Did the boat meet all the applicable minimum safety requirements?"

 

It will either be Yes or No!

It says...yes...????

[Machpoint005]

This all seems to suggest that if you want a dodgy BSS examiner - Bobby knows where to find one. 

 

If you want a useful document - go somewhere else!

 

 

 

[Bobbybass]

Hey !!!!?

 

You're not accusing me ?

 

The previous owner obtained this !!

[Machpoint005]

Yes, but you have the information!

 

[RichM]

Not surprised reading this. I had my BSS cert done two years ago, not very thorough. Without meaning to sound disrespectful, the chap was far too big to get into the nooks and crannies and have a proper look. The only things he really checked were the smoke/carbon monoxide alarms along with the fire extinguishers. I had someone else check it over not long after. 

He also did another boat next to mine at the time and commented that the electrics were not earthed properly, but issued a certificate anyway. No doubt the owner would have given him a hard time if he didn’t pass it. I can imagine many people would be less willing to part with their cash without a certificate in their hand. It’s too easy for rogue examiners  to avoid any potential aggro by just signing a piece of paper and then being done with it.

Edited September 3, 2020 by RichM
Clarity

[Alan de Enfield]

One of the regular BSS examiners in a marina we used to be in, was not qualified to do gas-checks on Liveaboard boats so he used to tell them to go out shopping or to the pub for an hour so there was no one living aboard when he got there.

 

He passed every boat he examined so if you just wanted a certificate to get licensed, he was your man.

If you want to have a safety check find someone else.

[Machpoint005]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

>> If you want to have a safety check find someone else.<<

 

Do your own safety check first (according to the rules) then find someone else. Always best to know what's going on!

 

This doesn't only apply to gas (in fact, the gas is the difficult bit), but to the whole shooting match.

 

[Alan de Enfield]

9 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

 

Do your own safety check first (according to the rules) then find someone else. Always best to know what's going on!

 

This doesn't only apply to gas (in fact, the gas is the difficult bit), but to the whole shooting match.

 

Exactly, I did my own BSS examination and even knowing where everything was and what did what it took me about 3 hours.

The examiner arrived the next day and from me opening the gates to the marina to let him in, to opening the gates to the marina to let him out was 20 minutes.

 

He sat in the saloon, said "I can see you have a CO alarm, are the filler caps correctly marked, and as it passed last time It'll pass it this time" (he did not do the previous examination)

I was waiting for him to fail it for not having a fuel shut-off so I could explain it didn't require one !!

 

I only wanted the 'pass' to licence the boat as I knew it already met or exceeded everything the BSS required.

 

The previous examiner had passed the boat in 2014, with three of these extinguishers :

 

 

 

The BSS is really not fit for purpose.

 

Edited September 3, 2020 by Alan de Enfield

[WotEver]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The BSS is really not fit for purpose.

It’s a bit like the early days of the MOT. My grandad was a retired mechanic and he phoned his ex-boss and said he needed an MOT. “Sure, what’s the reg?”  

[Momac]

It would seem the previous owner of the OP's boat was  not very responsible.  The gas leak should have been an immediate  priority followed by the extinguisher replacement assuming the date on them is an expiry date. The other items being  less significant . 

However  a pass certificate should not have been issued in the OP's case for the gas leak alone.

 

The date of manufacture on the orange gas hose is not significant with regard to the BSS examination  but the condition of the hose is significant.

 

I have  known people to offer up boats for the survey, agree with the surveyor they will  make good the identified failure points  immediately but then do nothing after the surveyor has gone. Even some people have been known to send photographs  of remedial work to the surveyor that are fake,  receiving  a pass certificate in return  . Its not necessarily always the surveyor who is  the guilty party. 

 

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

39 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Its not necessarily always the surveyor who is  the guilty party. 

Yes it is - it is the responsibility of the surveyor to  ensure the work is done - he is a 'professional' and is putting his name down on a fraudulently issued document.

Any other profession and he would be "struck off".

If the boat fails, the certificate should not be issued until a second visit has been made to confirm the work has been done.

Does an MOT station accept that you have done the necessary work without seeing the vehicle ?

[Momac]

8 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Does an MOT station accept that you have done the necessary work without seeing the vehicle ?

No it doesn't but the the way the BSS scheme is operated is not to the the standards of MOT testing, as  you know. 

In practice surveyors don't want to make a  second visit and people don't want to pay twice.

 

The surveyor who did my test failed my neighbours boat for a gas  hose issue and has insisted  on a  second visit.   It seems not to be  so  in the OP's case.

 

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

21 minutes ago, MartynG said:

No it doesn't but the the way the BSS scheme is operated is not to the the standards of MOT testing, as  you know. 

In practice surveyors don't want to make a  second visit and people don't want to pay twice.

 

The surveyor who did my test failed my neighbours boat for a gas  hose issue and has insisted  on a  second visit.   It seems not to be  so  in the OP's case.

 

 

 

 

 

I had an examiner fail my boat for not having an RCD (it didn't require one as its only an advisory, not a requirement - but that's another BSS training problem*) he said he would come back the following day if I gave him a call to say I had installed one, quick nip down to Toolstation, back to the boat, fitted and job done. He came the following day, checked it was installed and gave me the certificate.

 

* I registered a formal complaint with the BSS regarding Examiners making up their own rules, but never heard from them.

[Naughty Cal]

While in our care our boat has had three BSS tests now by three different examiners. They have all picked up on different things but missed others.

 

Our most recent test for example noticed that the fire extinguishers were dated and all well out of date. The previous two examiners had missed this.

 

Our most recent test however failed to notice that the gas hose was out of date yet a previous examiner had picked up on this and it was subsequently changed for that test.

[Momac]

1 hour ago, Naughty Cal said:

Our most recent test however failed to notice that the gas hose was out of date yet a previous examiner had picked up on this and it was subsequently changed for that test.

The date in the orange gas hose is irrelevant.

The hose can be as old as the boat and still pass if it is in good condition with no sign of perishing.

 

[Tom and Bex]

11 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Does an MOT station accept that you have done the necessary work without seeing the vehicle ?

Depends on the garage, but yes, had them do that several times - issued a pass on condition car was taken straight home and certain things were done (even welding on one occasion!). Also taken car back for retest, and had them log car onto computer, and issue a pass while car is still sat in car park. Sometimes with a cursory glance to see if failure item(s) look new, sometimes not even that. 

 

Not going to name garage, but had built good working relationship over several years.