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PD1964

“Boating Beyond Repair” warning to Newbies How not to buy a boat

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May be worth watching to all people thinking of buying an old boat of how not to do it.

 This couple from Youtube Vlog “Boating Beyond“ have found the hard way that you never buy a 30 year old boat without getting it surveyed.

  They bought their boat 10 month ago called “AWOL” a 45ft Springer built 1989. The seller/owner had a survey done a couple of month prior(probably for insurance reasons being built in 1989 and 30 year old) They say it was a good survey and he has also said on his social media that this is normal procedure for a seller to survey his own boat prior to selling(totally wrong never let a seller influence the survey) so they bought the boat a 1989 45ft Springer.

  They as everyone else starts a Vlog “Boating Beyond” for some reason they have the boat pulled out last month to find holes under the water line on the Swim, remember he says it had a good survey not a year previously. They carry on blackening, new anodes, deck boards, maybe thinking the holes are minor. Finally they get a Surveyor to survey/thickness test the hull, he recommends over plating in areas(the boat has already had previous over patching/plating) so holes patched up and re-floated, more holes out and patched again, re-floated more leaks.
  Now with no money they are stuck with a boat that’s needs serious hull repairs. This is a big warning to new young boaters of the perils of buying an old boat without getting a survey and it shows that a lot of YouTube Vloggers know absolutely nothing about boats, so don’t let them influence you(seek experienced or professional people to help)

  I’ll be surprised if he does not set up a funding page to get money for the repairs. As they have already mentioned their Paypal account for money help.

 Please watch the YouTube for the pitfalls of old Springers.

 

Edited by PD1964

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What's your (or anyone's) opinion on marinas that have surveys done, and make them available?

 

When we were looking for our first boat we asked to see the out-of-water survey of each boat that interested us performed by the marina. Some of these surveys showed good hull condition, and others not, which greatly narrowed down our selection. After we put a deposit down, we asked the same surveyor to do the interior of the boat. Both the out-of-water and interior survey led to some fixups agreed by the marina. Was this careless, somewhat careless, or not careless? I'm wondering if it makes a difference if it's a marina versus a private seller.

Edited by Thomas C King

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A lot of people have been asking why these holes were not picked up by the surveyor or the thickness of the hull mentioned on the Survey they say was good. They have also said since it’s a year old the Surveyor should be held to account. 
  They “Boating Beyond” have never mentioned any of the technical findings of the survey or it’s recommendations, only saying it was a good survey. 
  If you watch their previous YouTube Vlog he seams apprehensive about the back end when it gets lifted out, as though he knows about the holes and the problem.

 

Edited by PD1964

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4 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

What's your (or anyone's) opinion on marinas that have surveys done, and make them available?

 

When we were looking for our first boat we asked to see the out-of-water survey of each boat that interested us performed by the marina. Some of these surveys showed good hull condition, and others not, which greatly narrowed down our selection. After we put a deposit down, we asked the same surveyor to do the interior of the boat. Both the out-of-water and interior survey led to some fixups agreed by the marina. Was this careless, somewhat careless, or not careless? I'm wondering if it makes a difference if it's a marina versus a private seller.

always commission your own survey.

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50 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

This is a big warning to new young boaters of the perils of buying an old boat without getting a survey and it shows that a lot of YouTube Vloggers know absolutely nothing about boats, so don’t let them influence you(seek experienced or professional people to help)

Some YouTubers are really good, because they tell you to get a proper professional to look at things and emphasise the importance of a proper survey ;)

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1 minute ago, Thomas C King said:

Some YouTubers are really good, because they tell you to get a proper professional to look at things and emphasise the importance of a proper survey ;)

You should always seek professional advice and if not use an experienced person you trust with a proven track record in the business. 
  Like everything the quality of Vloggers  vary, these “Boating Beyond” said it was normal for a seller to survey before putting on the market, this is just wrong and dangerous advice, look what has happened to them.

 

 

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Seems a bit odd to me to black the hull outside and paint the engine bay, before getting the surveyor in, just so he can grind off patches of blacking, with the subsequent welding damaging the internal engine bay paint too.

 

The surveyor looks at first glance to have done a comprehensive survey, with plate thicknesses marked all over the hull. Yet he failed to pick up the weakness under the battery box and the leaks around the rudder tube - both places where corrosion can be expected, and he should have been looking more carefully. If the surveyor failed to notice these things at this stage, then what value would there have been in a pre-purchase survey?

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 I wonder if a surveyor has ever done any testing with a hammer on this boat i.e giving the hull a good wack. As some of the places where the holes were found look very thin and weak.

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43 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

 I wonder if a surveyor has ever done any testing with a hammer on this boat i.e giving the hull a good wack. As some of the places where the holes were found look very thin and weak.

The real wonder, I suspect, would be if a surveyor ever turned up anything useful. Most surveys are so full of weasels they could house a menagerie.

I know it's slightly different, but my last house structural survey basically said the house should be avoided because he didn't like the layout and there was a council estate half a mile away. He missed every single thing actually faulty.

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1 hour ago, David Mack said:

Seems a bit odd to me to black the hull outside and paint the engine bay, before getting the surveyor in, just so he can grind off patches of blacking, with the subsequent welding damaging the internal engine bay paint too.

 The whole thing seams odd especially the last two Vlogs, If you know boats it makes no sense. It’s as if they have somehow known about the holes and problems.

  Maybe they were mentioned when they bought the boat and got it so cheap and don’t want you to know, as they just say “it had a good survey” and never mention anything to back this statement up, but to miss all those issues the original Surveyor wants shot. If it was me I’d be mentioning names and asking serious questions of his incompetence and professionalism, but the Vloggers are not answering the questions asked about the sellers pre-purchase survey, which again is odd.

  To be honest I’m just waiting for the Crowd Funding appeal to start😂

 

  

Edited by PD1964

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6 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

 The whole thing seams odd especially the last two Vlogs, If you know boats it makes no sense. It’s as if they have somehow known about the holes and problems.

  Maybe they were mentioned when they bought the boat and got it so cheap and don’t want you to know, as they just say “it had a good survey” and never mention anything to back this statement up, but to miss all those issues the original Surveyor wants shot. If it was me I’d be mentioning names and asking serious questions of his comp  to professionalism.

  To be honest I’m just waiting for the Crowd Funding appeal to start😂

 

  

I also couldn't get my head around how thin the back end was but the previous survey allegedly didn't flag it up.

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If you have not paid the Surveyor it matters not a whit how good or bad the survey is, because the Surveyor has no contract with  or responsibility to, you.

 

Boatyard and "brokers" surveys are worth nowt.

 

Always commission and pay for your own Survey or buy-in to a previous  survey if you wish to avoid another lift out.

 

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Lifting an old boat, especially an already over plated Springer in strops puts some destructive forces on the hull, especially  around the rear swim and uxter plates.

 

Had the same problems in the past, every time you lift it it buckles somewhere else. 

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2 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Wasn't it lifted to repair leaky/ thin bits, I am surprised they didn't check it all over

30 year old Springers are all thin bits!

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Springers could soon be a byword for "Springer leak". 

 

Anyone who buys a Springer and not getting a hull survey is taking a gamble with their large wad of cash. 

Edited by mark99

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Feel very sorry for that pair and the many others who face problems like that. Who would you (or I ) go to to avoid that problem? A surveyor? Personally I only know of a couple who I would say are suitably experienced. A steel fabricator? Maybe. A welder with a hammer? possibly. I reckon I and many others who have been around rotten, rusty, heartbreaking boats for a while could do a pretty good job with a grinder and a hammer. Perhaps there is a place for us glass half empty grumpy cynics to save people from themselves.

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4 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Wasn't it lifted to repair leaky/ thin bits, I am surprised they didn't check it all over

They say in their Vlog these were only identified after it had been power washed, but watch the Vlog of it getting lifted, he seams to know there’s something wrong with the back end????

 I puzzle why it was lifted out, as if it had a full survey a year earlier it would of been out of the water and the ideal time for the seller to blacken prior to putting it on the market, after all this is why he had it surveyed according to the new owners(Vloggers)

  

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46 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

 The whole thing seams odd especially the last two Vlogs, If you know boats it makes no sense. It’s as if they have somehow known about the holes and problems.

  Maybe they were mentioned when they bought the boat and got it so cheap and don’t want you to know, as they just say “it had a good survey” and never mention anything to back this statement up, but to miss all those issues the original Surveyor wants shot. If it was me I’d be mentioning names and asking serious questions of his incompetence and professionalism, but the Vloggers are not answering the questions asked about the sellers pre-purchase survey, which again is odd.

  To be honest I’m just waiting for the Crowd Funding appeal to start😂

 

  

I think the idea is you make a donation into their Paypal account. There seems to be any number of these boating vloggers on Youtube many making their living from the number of views /subscribers they get . A similar thing is happening with the vanlife community linked I suspect to the idea of cheap living . There seems to be several unanswered questions around the surveys on this boat. 

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I've watched several of their videos, and compared to others they are quite good. 

They had the boat lifted to get the blacking done as it doesn't seem to have been done before they bought it, and yes he knew there were a few problems at the back, but not under the battery box.

I get the impression they didn't have their eyes open very much when the went into buying a boat.

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1 minute ago, Graham Davis said:

I've watched several of their videos, and compared to others they are quite good. 

They had the boat lifted to get the blacking done as it doesn't seem to have been done before they bought it, and yes he knew there were a few problems at the back, but not under the battery box.

I get the impression they didn't have their eyes open very much when the went into buying a boat.

He says he has had boats before and has put a couple of pictures on one of his Vlogs. The scary thing is he says it’s normal for the seller to get a survey done prior to putting his boat on the market, I just hope people don’t believe him who watch his Vlog.

  I suspect that the seller of the boat had to get a survey as the boat was 30 year old for his insurance company. The surveyor picked the faults up and he quickly got rid as cheap as he could. I doubt the couples story of it having a good survey prior to them buying, as he never answers questions regarding it. All he says is “it had a good survey” obviously  a doctored old one looking at the state of the hull.

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They'd previously lived on a lumpy water boat in a harbour i think, guessing Bristol way?

 

You can tell from previous vids they are a bit naive and take folk at face value, someone probably told him it was normal so he now takes that as gospel.

 

of course, nobody here ever made a daft mistake did they? cut the poor buggers a bit of slack, it's their home that's sinking :(

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11 minutes ago, Graham Davis said:

I get the impression they didn't have their eyes open very much when the went into buying a boat.

The guy has previous experience of owning a boat on wobbly water, but I agree... he formed an emotional attachment to a bad boat (he keeps calling it "a good boat").  There are boats of this vintage and much older that are solid as a rock because they were loved throughout their lives - probably having a good overplate at some point - and this will be reflected in the documentation and an independent full survey.  I'm afraid you get what you pay for.

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8 minutes ago, Graham Davis said:

I get the impression they didn't have their eyes open very much when the went into buying a boat.

 

On another forum i frequent (not boating) a poster recently posted this in response to a question as to why so many people buy 'rubbish'.

 

Ignorance is bliss. These younger collectors (which being in my early 30s, I must admit part in that group) do not visit the *forum*, they pretty much stick to facebook. They do not do research because they don't want to spend time doing so.

Research is not instant gratification. And with so many of us (not me) living at home with parents, they've got extra cash to spend without doing that research or even caring.

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