Antisocial boaters

[markeymark]

15 hours ago, The Bearwood Boster said:

I just feel too many folk really don't care any more.We go out of our way to make sure neighbours aren't upset by our music etc.Each time we ask,we're told no problem.We've even said don't feel you have to be polite.Why do some folk feel the need to be so very loud ?We moor in one of the best marinas around(on the Shroppy) & even there,there are folk with seriously yappy dogs.Yep,I know dogs bark but they should be able to be quiet.

As a long time dog owner, its the owners not sorting out their dogs thats the problem. Locking dogs up all day in a house or a boat is unfair to the dogs..they bark cos they are stressed  and want out or are excited. I turn down work if i cant take my dogs with me..they are my friends for life..... my kids

[Paul Gwilliams]

1 minute ago, markeymark said:

As a long time dog owner, its the owners not sorting out their dogs thats the problem. Locking dogs up all day in a house or a boat is unfair to the dogs..they bark cos they are stressed  and want out or are excited. I turn down work if i cant take my dogs with me..they are my friends for life..... my kids

Too true

[Onionman]

On 05/08/2020 at 22:45, Izz said:

Before anyone starts, yes I am moving tomorrow.

 

I've had a gentleman moor right up next to me. He likes to run not one, but two very noisy generators until well past midnight. He also enjoys confrontations, funnily enough.

Don Corleone (The Godfather) has this to say:

 

“There are men in this world,” he said, “who go about demanding to be killed.  You must have noticed them.  They quarrel in gambling games, they jump out of their automobiles in a rage if someone so much as scratches their fender, they humiliate and bully people whose capabilities they do not know.  I have seen a man, a fool, deliberately infuriate a group of dangerous men, and he himself without any resources.  These are people who wander through the world shouting, ‘Kill me.  Kill me.’  And there is always somebody ready to oblige them.”

 

One day he'll meet someone more aggressive and more capable at fighting who will teach him a lesson he may survive to remember.

 

Until then, he'll look like he's winning every confrontation but, unknown to him, someone will one day drill a hole when he's off the boat. Or one night when his generators are blanking out all noise from outside, someone less capable of face-to-face aggression will be pouring a bottle of full-sugar coke into his generator fuel tanks or putting sand in the genny oil filler cap (and possibly the boat's engine for good measure). He'll pay. Someone will punch him from behind like this.

 

And, if not, he'll still be first to a coronary.

 

Vin

Edited August 9, 2020 by Onionman

[The Bearwood Boster]

8 hours ago, markeymark said:

As a long time dog owner, its the owners not sorting out their dogs thats the problem. Locking dogs up all day in a house or a boat is unfair to the dogs..they bark cos they are stressed  and want out or are excited. I turn down work if i cant take my dogs with me..they are my friends for life..... my kids

Absolutely right,and I love the idea of your doggies being your kids-spot on !

[Athy]

17 hours ago, markeymark said:

. I turn down work if i cant take my dogs with me.

You're fortunate to have that choice - there are many occupations in which it would be difficult to to take a dog along.

 

Teaching is not necessarily one of them. Lt.-Col. Holmes, a retired military man who taught part-time in one of my prep schools, always brought his miniature schnauzer Bertie into school. In the classroom, Bertie would sit contentedly on a cushion in a corner of the room while his master taught the Common Entrance boys.

[Hudds Lad]

Was this on the Oxford somewhere between the Ashby and Hillmorton locks? We passed a line of boats moored before a bridge (forget which) and the last one squeezed in before the bridge hole had three gennies on the back under the pram hood, two of which were running and sat side by side, the engine was also running at quite high revs. This was mid afternoon and we were looking for a mooring, so glad it wasn't there, we felt sorry for all the other boats moored nearby.

[Victor Vectis]

2 hours ago, Athy said:

You're fortunate to have that choice - there are many occupations in which it would be difficult to to take a dog along.

 

Teaching is not necessarily one of them. Lt.-Col. Holmes, a retired military man who taught part-time in one of my prep schools, always brought his miniature schnauzer Bertie into school. In the classroom, Bertie would sit contentedly on a cushion in a corner of the room while his master taught the Common Entrance boys.

Common boys at a prep school!

 

Good heavens, what is the world coming to?

 

People will be voting labour next.

 

?

 

 

Edited August 10, 2020 by Victor Vectis

[Bewildered]

My brother in law once looked after my brothers Staffordshire Bull Terrier while my brother was on holiday, my brother in law thought it would be really funny to feed the dog Brussel sprouts on the eve of my brothers return. However my brother in law is an idiot and got the days wrong, he fed the sprouts to the dog a day early and had to put up with a constantly farting Staffie for a full day

 

edit to add: my sister was not impressed 

Edited August 10, 2020 by Bewildered

[Thomas C King]

On 08/08/2020 at 09:35, Rambling Boater said:

The trouble with that theory is that other than a few areas like Sweden (who didn't enforce lock down and faired better than us per capita) there is little to prove it.

Sweden has been doing terribly compared to its similarly populous neighbors, this is an interesting article on the politics of it all: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/26/swedish-exceptionalism-coronavirus-covid19-death-toll

[Rambling Boater]

1 hour ago, Thomas C King said:

Sweden has been doing terribly compared to its similarly populous neighbors, this is an interesting article on the politics of it all: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/26/swedish-exceptionalism-coronavirus-covid19-death-toll

I don't suck up to newspapers. The FACT is that they did better than the UK. Look at the raw data and make your own mind up 

[Rambling Boater]

Ok, to be fair, maybe lots of people don't  suck up to.newspapers, or BBC, or social media.

 

 

Just tried to put up a poll here to see what you think. Sadly no joy. 

 

 

Athy, help please. Did I do something wrong?

[Thomas C King]

21 minutes ago, Rambling Boater said:

I don't suck up to newspapers. The FACT is that they did better than the UK. Look at the raw data and make your own mind up 

I'm not suggesting we should all agree with newspaper articles, otherwise we'd be in an incoherent state, but go and look at the information behind it.

 

Anyway, to answer, "better" is normative and hence an opinion, and in this case it's not shared with the consensus of epidemiologists, including Sweden's primary/state one. Why, even when compared to the UK? You need to compare to similar contexts, countries in this case. For example, the Netherlands has more bike accidents per cyclist than the UK, but it would be wrong to conclude that it's more dangerous for cyclists (we should actually conclude the opposite). Likewise, Sweden's population density is completely different to ours. Comparing to similar and neighboring countries paints an appalling picture of how badly it is done with its policy, which despite the far higher deaths has not achieved herd immunity.

[Rambling Boater]

7 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

I'm not suggesting we should all agree with newspaper articles, otherwise we'd be in an incoherent state, but go and look at the information behind it.

 

Anyway, to answer, "better" is normative and hence an opinion, and in this case it's not shared with the consensus of epidemiologists, including Sweden's primary/state one. Why, even when compared to the UK? You need to compare to similar contexts, countries in this case. For example, the Netherlands has more bike accidents per cyclist than the UK, but it would be wrong to conclude that it's more dangerous for cyclists (we should actually conclude the opposite). Likewise, Sweden's population density is completely different to ours. Comparing to similar and neighboring countries paints an appalling picture of how badly it is done with its policy, which despite the far higher deaths has not achieved herd immunity.

Excellent example of the use of words to hide the numbers.

[Thomas C King]

19 minutes ago, Rambling Boater said:

Excellent example of the use of words to hide the numbers.

I don't think this is going anywhere. If there is something wrong with the common interpretation of the data by epidemiologists, and "words are being used to hide" whatever is wrong, then you can describe in specific detail your objections to the interpretation and what the science has got wrong...

Edited August 10, 2020 by Thomas C King

[Rambling Boater]

16 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

I don't think this is going anywhere. If there is something wrong with the common interpretation of the data by epidemiologists, and "words are being used to hide" whatever is wrong, then you can describe in specific detail your objections to the interpretation and what the science has got wrong...

Your problem. Not the other 67 million.

 

Ok to be fair, only a very few have looked at ONS data and realised that the weekly death figures became normal 2 MONTHS ago. 

 

 

[Thomas C King]

1 minute ago, Rambling Boater said:

Your problem. Not the other 67 million.

That doesn't make sense to me, I'm afraid you'll have to elaborate. "67 million" suggests to me that you think I'm talking about the UK? I'm talking about Sweden, which is doing poorly compared to countries with similar population density and culture but polar-opposite policies.

[Rambling Boater]

5 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

That doesn't make sense to me, I'm afraid you'll have to elaborate. "67 million" suggests to me that you think I'm talking about the UK? I'm talking about Sweden, which is doing poorly compared to countries with similar population density and culture but polar-opposite policies.

NO, look at the figures Foxy 

[Thomas C King]

3 minutes ago, Rambling Boater said:

NO, look at the figures Foxy 

The figures overwhelmingly support everything I've just said. If you have some research contrary, then I'd be interested in giving it a read. If we're reading from different sources, then you may find this paper, one of many, an interesting starting point: https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciaa864/5866094

[Rambling Boater]

17 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

The figures overwhelmingly support everything I've just said. If you have some research contrary, then I'd be interested in giving it a read. If we're reading from different sources, then you may find this paper, one of many, an interesting starting point: https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciaa864/5866094

I'd recommend everyone here, look at that link from about 6 weeks ago. It recommends f all.

 

 

[Thomas C King]

3 minutes ago, Rambling Boater said:

I'd recommend everyone here, look at that link from about 6 weeks ago. It recommends f all.

 

 

"Sweden has attracted much international attention for its different approach to the COVID-19 pandemic. By applying only very light mandates—closure of high schools and universities only and advising isolation by symptomatic individuals and those over 70—it appears a substantial outlier in its public health strategy. Our analysis suggests that individual actions in Sweden have created a more graduated scenario: voluntary self-isolation in Sweden has provided a combined population response intermediate between the public-health mandates alone and the stronger mandate regime implemented by other countries and regions. Sweden has had a similarly intermediate number of reported COVID-19 deaths—fewer per capita than Italy, Spain, and the United Kingdom but more than its Scandinavian neighbors that implemented strong measures promptly and more than most other European countries (Supplementary Table 1; 35/100,000 in Sweden versus 9.3 in Denmark, 5.2 in Finland, and 4.7 in Norway as of May 15). Benefits of the individual-response approach include increased flexibility; drawbacks include decreased coordination in the maintenance and strategic relaxation of controls. Predicted deaths and ICU demand are also greater with voluntary adherence than with stringent mandates until adherence rates exceed 75%. Whether mandated or voluntary, self-isolation of a substantial fraction of the population profoundly reduces ICU need and mortality if applied early and with substantial adherence rates. It therefore also follows that greater self-isolation in Sweden would have commensurately reduced deaths. Most national strategies consider both public-health and economic effects of infection-control mandates; based on preliminary European data, the economic impacts on Sweden appear similar to its neighbors [37]."

[Rambling Boater]

3 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

"Sweden has attracted much international attention for its different approach to the COVID-19 pandemic. By applying only very light mandates—closure of high schools and universities only and advising isolation by symptomatic individuals and those over 70—it appears a substantial outlier in its public health strategy. Our analysis suggests that individual actions in Sweden have created a more graduated scenario: voluntary self-isolation in Sweden has provided a combined population response intermediate between the public-health mandates alone and the stronger mandate regime implemented by other countries and regions. Sweden has had a similarly intermediate number of reported COVID-19 deaths—fewer per capita than Italy, Spain, and the United Kingdom but more than its Scandinavian neighbors that implemented strong measures promptly and more than most other European countries (Supplementary Table 1; 35/100,000 in Sweden versus 9.3 in Denmark, 5.2 in Finland, and 4.7 in Norway as of May 15). Benefits of the individual-response approach include increased flexibility; drawbacks include decreased coordination in the maintenance and strategic relaxation of controls. Predicted deaths and ICU demand are also greater with voluntary adherence than with stringent mandates until adherence rates exceed 75%. Whether mandated or voluntary, self-isolation of a substantial fraction of the population profoundly reduces ICU need and mortality if applied early and with substantial adherence rates. It therefore also follows that greater self-isolation in Sweden would have commensurately reduced deaths. Most national strategies consider both public-health and economic effects of infection-control mandates; based on preliminary European data, the economic impacts on Sweden appear similar to its neighbors [37]."

The numbers. 

[Thomas C King]

2 minutes ago, Rambling Boater said:

The numbers. 

In the quote and the paper.

[Arthur Marshall]

On 08/08/2020 at 23:38, David Mack said:

But I believe you are the owner of a trombone

...

I am  but I don't play it on the boat unless I'm in a secluded spot! I do have quieter instruments to amuse myself with (and a mute for the trombone).

And in response to another post, yes, Blakemere is a lovely spot. And where I am now, no engines or gennies are running and I'm back to liking boating again...

[Rambling Boater]

21 minutes ago, Thomas C King said:

In the quote and the paper.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

[Thomas C King]

1 minute ago, Rambling Boater said:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

I am talking about Sweden, for which a peer-reviewed paper in a reputable journal is far more relevant than... unrelated statistics about England and Wales!? This is a wind up, I'm done.