BMC 1.5 miles per gallon - 134 mile journey

[Amh300]

Hi,

I'm planning my first ever long journey from Willowtree Marine in W.London to Fazeley Marina in Tamworth. According to CanalPlan, this is a trip of 134 miles, 2¼ furlongs and 107 locks (I've never navigated a lock before!). The journey could take around 10 days at 7 hours per day. I'm trying to work out how much diesel I'd need. Any idea, or pointer to some info that would help me calculate this?

Thanks!

Andrew

 

[dor]

1.2 - 1.4 litres per hour.

[Tracy D'arth]

Ah, so you meant a BMC 1.5 diesel engine, fuel consumption not 1.5 miles per gallons!!!!

 

Depends on the boat and how fast you travel and how long doing locks. 

Roughly for a 50 to 58 foot boat 1.3 to 1.5 litres per hour running.

Canal planner will give you the total hours running rather than the milage which takes no account of locks.

Edited August 3, 2020 by Tracy D'arth
Grammatical correction

[Tony Brooks]

and if you are new to canal boating remember the speed limit of 4mph is rarely possible, especially on narrow canals. On some 2 mph is more reasonable. If you try to drive the boat too fast for the canal it is likely to cause bad tiller vibration, difficulty in steering and a much higher fuel consumption.

[Slim]

Given that you've never done a lock I would allow a good 100 hours of engine running time. At 1.4 l per hour that's 140 l or 31.64835164............gallons.?

[Tracy D'arth]

I have found that on average doing longish trips there are as many locks as there are hours run.

Allow 15 minutes a lock, say 20 allowing for the odd Q.

Allow 2 mph as average speed.

Why are you so concerned about consumption?

[Amh300]

1 hour ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Ah, so you meant a BMC 1.5 diesel engine, fuel consumption not 1.5 miles per gallons!!!!

 

Depends on the boat and how fast you travel and how long doing locks. 

Roughly for a 50 to 58 foot boat 1.3 to 1.5 litres per hour running.

Canal planner will give you the total hours running rather than the milage which takes no account of locks.

Yes, apologies - the title of my post could have been clearer! Ah, ok. So if canal planner takes no account of locks, and there are 107 of them to navigate, then it's going to take way longer than 10 days! 20m per lock = 35 hrs of locks.

10 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I have found that on average doing longish trips there are as many locks as there are hours run.

Allow 15 minutes a lock, say 20 allowing for the odd Q.

Allow 2 mph as average speed.

Why are you so concerned about consumption?

Thanks Tracy - it was just to get a sense of how much diesel I should take with me. I have 2x20l and 1x5l jerry cans worth of diesel plus a full tank.

[Tracy D'arth]

Just now, Amh300 said:

Yes, apologies - the title of my post could have been clearer! Ah, ok. So if canal planner takes no account of locks, and there are 107 of them to navigate, then it's going to take way longer than 10 days! 20m per lock = 35 hrs of locks.

You misunderstand, canal planner will give you total trip time including doing all the locks, time run end to end. But the mileage over the ground will not allow time at locks, so 134 miles at 2mph is 67 hours  plus 107 locks at 20 minutes each is 35 hours.

Total time is 102 hours so fuel will be 130 to 150 litres. But why are you concerned about fuel?

[OldGoat]

16 minutes ago, Amh300 said:

Yes, apologies - the title of my post could have been clearer! Ah, ok. So if canal planner takes no account of locks, and there are 107 of them to navigate, then it's going to take way longer than 10 days! 20m per lock = 35 hrs of locks.

No time allowance for locks??  News to me...

I've just signed on and gone to the settings options page where you can set the times for pretty well everything -

narrow locks = 12 minutes 8 minutes in a flight...

Perhaps you need to sign on to get these details - but it's free and not intrusive...

 

Aha  - misunderstood. No fuel allowance while in a lock, but that will be minimal anyway.

However - apart from the usage  - there are several places along the way that sell fuel, provided that they are open...

 

Edited August 3, 2020 by OldGoat

[Amh300]

1 minute ago, Tracy D'arth said:

You misunderstand, canal planner will give you total trip time including doing all the locks, time run end to end. But the mileage over the ground will not allow time at locks, so 134 miles at 2mph is 67 hours  plus 107 locks at 20 minutes each is 35 hours.

Total time is 102 hours so fuel will be 130 to 150 litres. But why are you concerned about fuel?

Ah, ok. My mistake - that's a relief anyway! My trip isn't until the start of September, so its good/reassuring to have this chat with the experts! I suppose I'm worried about running out! But I'm sure it's easy enough to find refuelling stations along the way.

[Tony Brooks]

Unless you have syphoned whatever may be in the bottom of the fuel tank I would be far more concerned about drawing contaminated fuel/water into the system. Best drain the bottom of the tank in the next few weeks and then at least annually.

[Tracy D'arth]

6 minutes ago, Amh300 said:

Ah, ok. My mistake - that's a relief anyway! My trip isn't until the start of September, so its good/reassuring to have this chat with the experts! I suppose I'm worried about running out! But I'm sure it's easy enough to find refuelling stations along the way.

Never a problem but it may be in future with the imposition of white derv, many will stop selling I think.

Most narrowboats hold around 200 litres, hirers never give it a thought, just plough on regardless.

[Machpoint005]

The OP should take a clean stick with him, dip the tank every so often, and find out what depth of diesel he uses per day. The number of litres (or gallons) is immaterial if you just fill the tank when the level gets to within (say) 15cm of the bottom.

[magnetman]

I've had about a dozen diesel engines over the years but my latest boat which has twin BMC 1.5D engines likes full tanks. I never really bothered before but it seems to like it so I am taking the approach of keeping the tanks full and having 2 X 20 litre plastic drums which I use to top up the tank manually the fill them at the boatyard, fuel boat or whatever. 

 

Just keep the tanks full. It's the best way to do it. 

[Amh300]

Thanks for all your replies folks! Very helpful advice here. Much appreciated ?

[David Schweizer]

5 hours ago, Amh300 said:

Hi,

I'm planning my first ever long journey from Willowtree Marine in W.London to Fazeley Marina in Tamworth. According to CanalPlan, this is a trip of 134 miles, 2¼ furlongs and 107 locks (I've never navigated a lock before!). The journey could take around 10 days at 7 hours per day. I'm trying to work out how much diesel I'd need. Any idea, or pointer to some info that would help me calculate this?

Thanks!

Andrew

 

As people have already said, fuel consumption depends on a number of factors including how hard you push the boat, and the design of the hull. Our old boat had very long swims, and although deeper than many modern boats, it swam like a fish. I have just cheched my records and it seems that an average was about 1.2 litres oper hour, but that was on a recently re built BMC 1.5. Before the re-build it was more like 1.5 litres per hour.

[nicknorman]

I would expect to be able to do that trip without refuelling, but anyway there are plenty of refuelling possibilities on the way. I wouldn’t bother with any Jerry cans etc unless you have already filled them.
 

We moor at Fazeley Mill Marina and one advantage of being a moorer is 10% discount on their already fairly cheap fuel. So don’t arrive with too much fuel, it will likely be cheaper there than most other places.

[TheBiscuits]

7 hours ago, OldGoat said:

narrow locks = 12 minutes 8 minutes in a flight...

 

I plan for 6 minutes standalone, 5 in a flight ...

 

Tying up and untying again wastes 5 minutes per lock.

 

On last year's BCN challenge we were averaging 4 minutes per lock, but that's not sustainable for a long run.  24 hours was long enough at that pace!

[PhilR]

7 hours ago, Amh300 said:

Yes, apologies - the title of my post could have been clearer! Ah, ok. So if canal planner takes no account of locks, and there are 107 of them to navigate, then it's going to take way longer than 10 days! 20m per lock = 35 hrs of locks.

Thanks Tracy - it was just to get a sense of how much diesel I should take with me. I have 2x20l and 1x5l jerry cans worth of diesel plus a full tank.

As Tracy said, a typical narrowboat with built in tank will hold about 200 litres of fuel. That would be more than enough for your journey, Furthermore you will be passing several boatyards which sell diesel.

 

Personally, I would avoid taking extra fuel in 20 litre jerry cans. Filling fuel tanks from those often involves some spillage into the canal, or the bilge..

 

Phil

 

 

 

[PhilR]

21 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

I plan for 6 minutes standalone, 5 in a flight ...

 

Tying up and untying again wastes 5 minutes per lock.

 

On last year's BCN challenge we were averaging 4 minutes per lock, but that's not sustainable for a long run.  24 hours was long enough at that pace!

But the OP has never been through a lock before and he might be single-handed.

I am sure you must have had a crew of 3 or 4 when you did the BCN Challenge?

[TheBiscuits]

1 minute ago, PhilR said:

But the OP has never been through a lock before and he might be single-handed.

I am sure you must have had a crew of 3 or 4 when you did the BCN Challenge?

 

Officially three, but we argued for two as MrsBiscuit was mostly looking after our (then) 2 year old, BobBiscuit.

 

Sue wouldn't accept that, but agreed that a toddler is much more of a hindrance than a help!  She did agree not to count Bob as a full crew member.

 

Most of the actual work on the challenge was @Duck-n-Dive and me, and I was very pleased he was there when I fell in at the bottom of the Crow and couldn't climb out ...

 

Yes, if I'm singlehanding I allow an extra couple of minutes per lock, but I still don't usually tie up. 

 

I was taught by an old working boatman that if the boat isn't moving you're losing time and money.  I don't rush around locks, but I'm usually already in the next position for efficient working.  It's more to do with thinking ahead than running - I'm built for comfort not speed!

[Amh300]

12 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

I plan for 6 minutes standalone, 5 in a flight ...

 

Tying up and untying again wastes 5 minutes per lock.

 

On last year's BCN challenge we were averaging 4 minutes per lock, but that's not sustainable for a long run.  24 hours was long enough at that pace!

4 minutes per lock - wow ?

[nicknorman]

4 minutes ago, Amh300 said:

4 minutes per lock - wow ?

It does also depend on the locks. Locks in and around Birmingham are pretty quick, other narrow locks such as on the Coventry can take more than 4 minutes just to fill! Also depends on boat length. A shorter boat can still be moving quite fast into the locks when the gate(s) are closed, whereas a full length boat has to be fully into the lock and stationary before the gate(s) can be closed.

[TheBiscuits]

50 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

It does also depend on the locks. Locks in and around Birmingham are pretty quick, other narrow locks such as on the Coventry can take more than 4 minutes just to fill! Also depends on boat length. A shorter boat can still be moving quite fast into the locks when the gate(s) are closed, whereas a full length boat has to be fully into the lock and stationary before the gate(s) can be closed.

Absolutely right.  45 foot boat, so we have had the gates closed and the paddles open before the boat has completely stopped.

[cuthound]

As others have said, depends on canal, boat, number of locks and your speed.

 

When I had my last shareboat some of the co-owners though the boat was suddenly using more fuel (it wasn't but the government had just started to impose a higher rate of tax on the percentage of fuel used for propulsion). I got tasked with minitoring fuel consumption, so I asked my co-owner to provide me with fuel used, hours run and locks & miles per trip.

 

The 58 foot boat with a BMC1.8 used between 1.4 and 2.2 litres per hour. The lowest was on heavily locked canals, where the boat spent more time on tickover and the highedt on the shallow  and lock free canal where most owners tried to go to fast for the depth of the canal.