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Midnight

Petition to apply pressure to CaRT

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45 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

C&RTs primary function is as a Navigation Authority, dredging a non-navigable canal to develop a nature reserve should, (I would have thought) in view of the condition of the waterways, have been way down their expenditure budget.

 

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/about-us/where-we-work/yorkshire-and-north-east/pocklington-canal-project/pocklington-canal/dredging-on-the-pocklington-canal

 

Normally the Canal & River Trust carry out dredging to keep our network of canals open to boats, but in fact all of the dredging on the Pocklington Canal is taking place in the non-navigable upper reaches of the canal. So why dredge an area you can’t take a boat along? The (possibly surprising) answer: to help our wildlife!

 

https://www.canalboat.co.uk/news/dredging-project-on-the-pocklington-to-protect-rare-aquatic-plants-1-4861053

 

“It’s important to remember that the canal is a man-made environment and so sometimes it’s necessary to step in and give nature a helping hand,” said project officer Lizzie Dealey.

 

“By tackling some of the dominant reeds in the middle of the canal then we’ll be able to improve conditions for rarer plant species but also dragonflies and other wildlife.”

 

Found it :

Edit to add C&RTS Objectives and raison d'etre :

 

Nothing in the primary objectives about dragonfly's

.

 INTERPRETATION

1. Defined terms The interpretation of these Articles is governed by the provisions set out in the Schedule at the end of the Articles.

 

OBJECTS AND POWERS

2. Objects The Trust’s objects are:

2.1 to preserve, protect, operate and manage Inland Waterways for public benefit:

2.1.1 for navigation;

2.1.2 for walking on towpaths; and

2.1.3 for recreation or other leisure-time pursuits of the public in the interest of their health and social welfare;

 

2.2 to protect and conserve for public benefit sites, objects and buildings of archaeological, architectural, engineering or historic interest on, in the vicinity of, or otherwise associated with Inland Waterways;

 

2.3 to further for the public benefit the conservation protection and improvement of the natural environment and landscape of Inland Waterways;

 

2.4 to promote, facilitate, undertake and assist in, for public benefit, the restoration and improvement of Inland Waterways;

 

2.5 to promote and facilitate for public benefit awareness, learning and education about Inland Waterways, their history, development, use, operation and cultural heritage by all appropriate means including the provision of museums;

 

2.6 to promote sustainable development in the vicinity of any Inland Waterway for the benefit of the public, in particular by:

 

2.6.1 the improvement of the conditions of life in socially and economically disadvantaged communities in such vicinity; and 2.6.2 the promotion of sustainable means of achieving economic growth and regeneration and the prudent use of natural resources

Well, after doing the Harborough Arm today, there is dragonflys and all other sorts of nature, it hasnt been dredged in years, and the sides are so overgrown, most of the time it is reeds/trees touching both sides of the boat at the same time.

Mind you, it is 70 years since the IWA first did something about it.

Edited by matty40s

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On 29/07/2020 at 16:38, matty40s said:

Locks are too bloody short.

Nope, your boat is too long

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Ryan  (of Jules Fuels)  who does the supply boat North of Stoke Bruerne and some of the Oxford canal, sent a text out saying he can't deliver North of Long Buckby due to the unplanned CRT stoppage. Apparently the pending issue was reported to CRT over a year ago.

 

So, many boaters may have a problem getting supplies not to mention the damage to buisnesses and navigational problems for those in the area.

 

On a plus note, I'm seeing lots of boats out now, so hopefully any issues will get reported to CRT. The petition above is a good way to vent concerns if you thing the infrastructure is getting worse and think CRT aren't doing enough. 

 

 

 

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On 29/07/2020 at 10:42, Midnight said:

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/refer-canal-river-trust-to-govt-for-failures-to?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign&quote_id=quote2&title_id=title1&recruiter=12840375&shared=ok&loc=view-petition&fbclid=IwAR26epjIazzyte_pei2mlf4GfhXUtQFptc6dS7xjPptXcTcvnm0kUQOCm3Q#_=_

 

Apologies for copying this link from TB but being moored locked on the Calder Navigation with little chance of escaping for a decent holiday cruise and even less chance of getting back I am fed up to the back teeth of Parry & Co who seem to forget CaRT is supposed to be a navigation Authority.

Please sign if you are a p**sed off as I am.

Done. 👍

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Most of the locks coming through Leicester seems to have a paddle taped off, Birstall lock 2.....this wouldnt be a problem if the gates on the river sections didnt leak like sieves.

Some of the tape has been there so long it has completely faded to white.

A surprising lack of rubbish until below Lime Kilns lock, and then disgraceful.

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12 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Most of the locks coming through Leicester seems to have a paddle taped off, Birstall lock 2.....this wouldnt be a problem if the gates on the river sections didnt leak like sieves.

Some of the tape has been there so long it has completely faded to white.

A surprising lack of rubbish until below Lime Kilns lock, and then disgraceful.

Just a thought on this.

 

One of the council web sites has an interactive map where walkers can report problems with the footpaths. The good thing about that is that everyone can see what others have reported.

 

Has CRT got a similar facility? If not, it might help them locate issues. 

 

I'm sure many of us report issues to CRT via the help line.  I don't know about anyone else but I've found the help line hard work as you tend to have to repeat everything twice IF you get through to the relevant dept. I've also found they rarely phone back with feedback on the progress when promised.

 

Edit to say could this facility be added to open canal maps?

Edited by Rambling Boater

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On 05/08/2020 at 19:18, Rambling Boater said:

Just a thought on this.

 

One of the council web sites has an interactive map where walkers can report problems with the footpaths. The good thing about that is that everyone can see what others have reported.

 

Has CRT got a similar facility? If not, it might help them locate issues. 

 

I'm sure many of us report issues to CRT via the help line.  I don't know about anyone else but I've found the help line hard work as you tend to have to repeat everything twice IF you get through to the relevant dept. I've also found they rarely phone back with feedback on the progress when promised.

 

Edit to say could this facility be added to open canal maps?

You could investigate if fixmystreet could be extended to cover waterways.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Allan(nb Albert) said:

You could investigate if fixmystreet could be extended to cover waterways.

 

 

I'm secretly hoping Mr Parry might see the benefits of such a useful tool.

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17 hours ago, Rambling Boater said:

I'm secretly hoping Mr Parry might see the benefits of such a useful tool.

 

I doubt it because it would increase their workload... 😣

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12 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

And highlight what an appalling job they are doing.

I think it is fair to say that that CRT executives and trustees have gone the extra mile to hide the true state of the waterways and the appalling job they are doing -

 

Abandoned the steady state model used by BW to determine yearly underspend.

 

Abandoned measures (both numerical and financial) of the backlog in maintenance.

 

Produced false measurements of days lost to unplanned navigation closure. When found to be under reporting by 80% they simply abandoned measurement. After all Defra only requires that they report on towpath closure.

 

Misrepresent in annual reports how much is actually spent on maintenance.

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Allan(nb Albert) said:

I think it is fair to say that that CRT executives and trustees have gone the extra mile to hide the true state of the waterways and the appalling job they are doing -

 

Abandoned the steady state model used by BW to determine yearly underspend.

 

Abandoned measures (both numerical and financial) of the backlog in maintenance.

 

Produced false measurements of days lost to unplanned navigation closure. When found to be under reporting by 80% they simply abandoned measurement. After all Defra only requires that they report on towpath closure.

 

Misrepresent in annual reports how much is actually spent on maintenance.

 

 

 

 

Genuine question:

 

How many Freedom of information requests have you entered over the last 5 years?

 

Edited by Goliath
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59 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

And how much does it cost for someone to respond to them, maybe wasting some of the limited funds available that could be better spent on dredging or repairing a bit of infrastructure.

I find myself wondering the same. I wonder how many lock gates could have been made over the years if C & RT hadn't had to spend money responding to Freedom of Information requests.  I should imagine it is not a five minute job responding and must use a lot of staff resources.  F of I requests to, for example, the Scottish parliament might well provide information which the Government would rather not divulge and with the information being available, other politicians, the press  and members of the public can make their views known and the outcome might force  a change which affects the situation of a lot of the population.  F of I requests to the likes of C&RT on the other hand, appear to me as an individual wanting to know "something" and the result will seldom affect many people, apart for reducing the money available to spend on the upkeep of the canals. 

Just my views though,

 

haggis

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Allan gets a bit 'touchy' when you bring up the cost of responding to FOI requests. Both in time and resources.

 

He will be along shortly to attempt to justify himself no doubt.

 

 

Edited by The Happy Nomad

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On 29/07/2020 at 17:41, hughc said:

 The system is not as it was during the eighties and nineties the level of unplanned stoppages is far worse and this can only be due to the poor decisions taken by successive managements. Under funding is partly to blame but an apparent lack of empathy with the history and culture of the cut by CaRT management becomes yearly more apparent. Regards, HughC.

 

In the 80's there weren't three Trans-Pennine routes open and neither was the K&A. .  I think the problem is that funding hasn't just kept up with the extra responsibilities dropped on BW, and now C&RT, If you just look at those three:

 

Rochdale : 32 miles and 91 locks
Huddersfield Narrow : 24 miles and 74 locks
K&A : 56 Miles and 78 locks

 

Mileage wise it's not a lot but in terms of infrastructure its a lot to take on.  Did BW and CRT get any more funding for taking these on?

 

They have a limited budget - so when it comes to keeping things open they are going to have to cut back on things - and where do you think they're going to look at cutting maintenance? Is it going to be on a low use Trans-Pennine route, the C&H, or on something like the Four Counties / Llangollen?

 

So if we want everything to be open and never closed then either they get a lot more funding from the government (which given the imploded economy isn't going to happen) or they will have to put boat licences up by so much that people get rid of their boats.  Or we have to accept that things will be broken from time to time.

 

Anyone remember Preston Brook being closed? Blisworth? Wast Hill? Harecastle?  Closures due to serious structure failures are not new.

 

Edited by StephenA
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An idea?

Can boaters not help more?

Maybe put license costs up by, say, 50% and let boaters earn the increased costs back by doing unskilled work on the canal system at a fixed daily rate?

It would free up some money that is paid out now to contractors ie grass cutting, litter picking etc.

Of course people unable to work due to age or health should be exempt from the increased license costs.

It could be classed as voluntary work with the rebate as an incentive.

Not sure how the taxman would react and of course the workers would need supervision.

Just a thought.

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26 minutes ago, StephenA said:

Anyone remember Preston Brook being closed? Blisworth? Wast Hill? Harecastle?  Closures due to serious structure failures are not new.

 

In general people have short memories, the long ones they hold on to tend to be the ones that fit their current narrative. 

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On 08/08/2020 at 18:06, The Happy Nomad said:

Allan gets a bit 'touchy' when you bring up the cost of responding to FOI requests. Both in time and resources.

 

He will be along shortly to attempt to justify himself no doubt.

 

 

Looks like I might have to do a FOI request myself if he don’t answer. 

I kept it easy, I asked only for the last 5 years. 

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On 09/08/2020 at 13:14, smiler said:

An idea?

Can boaters not help more?

Maybe put license costs up by, say, 50% and let boaters earn the increased costs back by doing unskilled work on the canal system at a fixed daily rate?

It would free up some money that is paid out now to contractors ie grass cutting, litter picking etc.

Of course people unable to work due to age or health should be exempt from the increased license costs.

It could be classed as voluntary work with the rebate as an incentive.

Not sure how the taxman would react and of course the workers would need supervision.

Just a thought.

 

Give CRT more money and they will just waste more money, take work off them to save money and they will waste that money also..

 

A trend has been set, waste money and get away with it.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Dave Payne said:

 

Give CRT more money and they will just waste more money, take work off them to save money and they will waste that money also..

 

A trend has been set, waste money and get away with it.

 

 

In the old days it was called empire building. 

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On 07/08/2020 at 22:47, Goliath said:

Genuine question:

 

How many Freedom of information requests have you entered over the last 5 years?

 

You first. How many Freedom of Information requests have you made  over the last 5 years.

 

You may wish to start a new thread rather than drag this one off topic.

 

Edited by Allan(nb Albert)
Fat fingers

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On 08/08/2020 at 14:08, haggis said:

I find myself wondering the same. I wonder how many lock gates could have been made over the years if C & RT hadn't had to spend money responding to Freedom of Information requests.  I should imagine it is not a five minute job responding and must use a lot of staff resources.  F of I requests to, for example, the Scottish parliament might well provide information which the Government would rather not divulge and with the information being available, other politicians, the press  and members of the public can make their views known and the outcome might force  a change which affects the situation of a lot of the population.  F of I requests to the likes of C&RT on the other hand, appear to me as an individual wanting to know "something" and the result will seldom affect many people, apart for reducing the money available to spend on the upkeep of the canals. 

Just my views though,

 

haggis

A very old survey found that responding to simple freedom of information requests made via whatdotheyknow.com cost just under 15 pounds.  FOI allows authorities to refuse requests on the grounds of cost.

 

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On 03/08/2020 at 14:18, Alan de Enfield said:

Primarily because the C&RT press release specifically stated they were trying to improve the environment for dragonfly' breeding, instead they killed off the 5 years of dragonfly life-cycle.

Might this have been a matter of the lesser of two evils, the dragonflly likes a particular habitat and without maintenance the habitat would disappear, so unfortunately destructive maintenance is required to maintain the habit long term, either that or watch it slowly decline into a damp ditch

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