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Water Tank Painting


katie_hannah

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1 hour ago, jenevers said:

Agreed. I wouldn’t do it.

I’ve done it and without injury, but it is not my favourite job.

You will need a beanie hat (no matter how hot it is in there), vacuum cleaner, foam ear plugs, impact safety goggles, dust mask and thin gloves.  Only turn the angle grinder on when you are suitably wedged in a secure position.  If you are not confident using an angle grinder this is NOT the job to learn how to use one.

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I am quite lucky, I have the luxury of being able to drop several vacuum hoses into a tank or engine bay when doing nasty jobs.you still need several showers to get the crap out of everywhere.

There is NO easy way to do this unless you are getting someone else to do it.

 

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YouTube Bloggers provide useful primers.

Disposable gloves.

Good lamp - painting black in a dark hole is a bit difficult.

Endorse point about take up tube - mine was nearly blocked.

Latest discovery - foam rubber cushion to sit/kneel/lie on. Major asset!

Try Boat Paint for Rylard water tank coating - excellent service.

Warm dry day

Self satisfied feeling once you finish!!!

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1 minute ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Its a lot easier to get and keep it dry inside if the boat is on the hard, condensation is your nemesis.

TD'

Liberal application of second hand newspapers + warm dry day.

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On 02/07/2020 at 21:36, blackrose said:

It's a water based product after all so you wouldn't expect it to last very long underwater.

Have you had a bad experience with Vactan in this application, BR? I ask because it seems to me that once it's reacted chemically with the rust and done its job, the water base doesn't matter much any more.  Furthermore, with it being sandwiched between the steel it treated and the bitumen applied over it, I'd have thought it pretty convincingly isn't strictly "underwater" any more either. 

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3 hours ago, Sea Dog said:

Have you had a bad experience with Vactan in this application, BR? I ask because it seems to me that once it's reacted chemically with the rust and done its job, the water base doesn't matter much any more.  Furthermore, with it being sandwiched between the steel it treated and the bitumen applied over it, I'd have thought it pretty convincingly isn't strictly "underwater" any more either. 

Vactan is approved for use in potable water tanks.  it forms a coating similar to acrylic paint.

 

perhaps the pragmatic solution is to thoroughly wash and remove any loose silt, rust and crud from the tank, then dry thoroughly and vacuum out any remaining dust, then give the tank a good coat of vactan and leave to cure for 2 days with the tank cover removed.

 

repeat every 2 years.

 

not a big task.

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For the angle grinder method, where the dust is really unbelieveably bad, find someone to lend, or hire a positive pressure hood and visor. This provides fresh filtered air from a battery powered fan and filter normally worn on your waist and a flexi pipe to the visor to supply the air. When working in the tank the pipe is just long enough to position fan/filter outside the tank. Advantages are you can breath fresh air, you can see better, not so claustrophobic, and it keeps your face cool. It's still not a good experience but it is much better than without. Be prepared to spend a long time cleaning the kit before you give it back to its owner !

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8 hours ago, Sea Dog said:

Have you had a bad experience with Vactan in this application, BR? I ask because it seems to me that once it's reacted chemically with the rust and done its job, the water base doesn't matter much any more.  Furthermore, with it being sandwiched between the steel it treated and the bitumen applied over it, I'd have thought it pretty convincingly isn't strictly "underwater" any more either. 

I had a bad experience with Vactan once, and that was user error. I used it on an engine bilge, but had failed to get it really dry. My reasoning was that, as it was wate based, a little extra wouldn't hurt. I suspect it never got really dry, as condensation set in overnight. It didn't last long! ;)

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Endorse all previous comments - just spent a few happy hours ? applying second coat of Rylard. Cushion! Invaluable. Accept that you will not get good coverage with your first pass - you'll always miss odd patches so concentrate on getting a coat on. The second can address the above and can be more generous. 

Get in those impossible corners first. Accept that you will not fit easily in the tank unless you are a world-class contortionist. Wait for the good weather. The base of your tank is not horizontal so place a full can of blacking with care?. Will it ever dry..........

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On 03/07/2020 at 11:43, Up-Side-Down said:

I hate all water based finishes with a passion. However, as I understand it, Vactan reacts chemically with the rust and is based on tannic acid so the fact that it has a water content seems irrelevant to me. 

 

It's not irrelevant. The tannic acid will work fine converting the rust, however the water-based carrier solution for the chemical won't last long immersed in water and corrosion will soon return. Anecdotally, from what I've read on here that is most people's experience of using Vactan inside their water tanks and was my point.

Edited by blackrose
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On 04/07/2020 at 16:52, Iain_S said:

I had a bad experience with Vactan once, and that was user error. I used it on an engine bilge, but had failed to get it really dry. My reasoning was that, as it was wate based, a little extra wouldn't hurt. I suspect it never got really dry, as condensation set in overnight. It didn't last long! ;)

 

Since Vactan is supposed to be fine painted over damp surfaces and a little extra water is supposed to be ok I'm not sure your case was user error?

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On 04/07/2020 at 07:44, Sea Dog said:

Have you had a bad experience with Vactan in this application, BR? I ask because it seems to me that once it's reacted chemically with the rust and done its job, the water base doesn't matter much any more.  Furthermore, with it being sandwiched between the steel it treated and the bitumen applied over it, I'd have thought it pretty convincingly isn't strictly "underwater" any more either. 

See my post above. The tannic acid is fine - same as any other rust converter. The water based carrier is not. My comment on anecdotal experiences of other forum members was based on those who use Vactan alone in their tanks without overcoating with bitumen. However, even with bitumen over the top, once your bitumen coating starts to break down the Vactan won't last long.

 

I've never used Vactan in a water tank but I have used in my engine bilges overcoated with top coats. It didn't last long. Rust started coming back through in about a year because it couldn't handle a bit of condensation.

 

I've no problem with using tannic acid to convert difficult to remove areas of rust. My point is that if you were choosing a primer for steel would you really choose a water based primer? That's effectively what you're doing when you choose to use Vactan.  

Edited by blackrose
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a 'plastic bag' made of material similar to that used for an inflatable boat.  they used to be made to order by hovercraft companies, although it seems those outfits have moved away from making tanks to fit boats.   they work fine, but you still have a steel tank that never dries out, so it needs to be very well painted before inserting the tank liner, and I would line the tank with a forgiving and insulating material like 25mm polystyrene stuck on with suitable adhesive, in order to protect the liner. 

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Never had any success with bag tanks, they always crease when empty and split when full. 

Properly done a bitumened steel tank will last for years before it needs doing again. I know of many that were done by me over 10 years ago and they are still OK.

Makes a hell of a mess of my hair even wearing a net and cap.

Not looking forward to doing any more at my age...................................before you ask.?

 

TD'

Edited by Tracy D'arth
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8 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Never had any success with bag tanks, they always crease when empty and split when full. 

 

what, even if made to fit and properly suspended using the fixing loops provided (I am referring to the tank I had made by Hovercraft Consultants)?

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Never had a hovercraft one. Never had loops on them.  Must of been buying the wrong ones, were made for boats though.

How do you hang them in an existing bow tank?

The connections were stupid too, trying to connect the outlet to the existing and then the fill to the deck fitting without ripping them off was not easy.

A can of bitumen is so much easier!

TD'

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11 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Not looking forward to doing any more at my age...................................before you ask.?

 

 Drat.  If you're wanting to charge me £300 to bleed two radiators I was hoping you'd throw in doing the water tank for free!

 

 

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20 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 Drat.  If you're wanting to charge me £300 to bleed two radiators I was hoping you'd throw in doing the water tank for free!

 

 

I'll do a deal, £300 for the [ bleeding ]heating and I'll supervise the tank blacking and do the H&SE risk assessment and quality control for free.

How's that?

TD'

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20 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

 

How do you hang them in an existing bow tank?

The connections were stupid too, trying to connect the outlet to the existing and then the fill to the deck fitting without ripping them off was not easy.

 

err .....   drill 4 holes in the deck and fix screw eyes.

 

so easy to make the connections - I cannot understand what is so difficult.  all you need is a couple of lengths of flexi-hose of the right diameter and suitable clamps.

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On 11/07/2020 at 17:22, blackrose said:

See my post above. The tannic acid is fine - same as any other rust converter. The water based carrier is not. My comment on anecdotal experiences of other forum members was based on those who use Vactan alone in their tanks without overcoating with bitumen. However, even with bitumen over the top, once your bitumen coating starts to break down the Vactan won't last long.

 

I've never used Vactan in a water tank but I have used in my engine bilges overcoated with top coats. It didn't last long. Rust started coming back through in about a year because it couldn't handle a bit of condensation.

 

I've no problem with using tannic acid to convert difficult to remove areas of rust. My point is that if you were choosing a primer for steel would you really choose a water based primer? That's effectively what you're doing when you choose to use Vactan.  

Fairy snuff. I'm surprised though, as I've treated rusty bits on my boat with winter approaching just using Vactan and no over-painting.  It's quite successfully kept rust at bay until the following summer, even in places of constant exposure to the elements, such as the roof.  I guess the best thing is to just go with a product we're comfortable with.

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On 03/07/2020 at 17:16, Machpoint005 said:

Everyone seems to be forgetting the first job: get the bl**dy hatch off!

So far I've managed to shift 7 of the 16 screws holding mine down.

 

Apologies for the slight hijacking of the thread but I've now removed all 16 screws. They weren't up to my attack with the puddles of Nitromors on each of them, repeated at 15-minute intervals for an hour or two, then an impact driver and 1kg club hammer. All the screws are in good condition for re-use though. 

 

The tank doesn't look as bad as I was expecting, but the hard work really begins now.

  • Happy 1
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OK - two coats of Rylard stuff drying/curing in built in steel tank. I've read the data sheet but has anyone practical experience of the process of flushing/cleaning out ready for fresh water? It's a big tank and running the pump to empty it once, never mind three times will take for ever. Contemplating Milton or detergent or camping water purifier. Might just have to bale the tank to speed emptying. What say you?

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