What Do I Need To Make A Boat With A Classic Engine Legal?

[Jen-in-Wellies]

In a few decades time my boats Beta 43 will be a classic engine, compared with all the boats with electric, dilithium crystal and antimatter powered engines. Classic is just a matter of time, assuming it doesn't wear out, or blow up first.

Jen

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, Jen-in-Wellies said:

In a few decades time my boats Beta 43 will be a classic engine, compared with all the boats with electric, dilithium crystal and antimatter powered engines. Classic is just a matter of time, assuming it doesn't wear out, or blow up first.

Jen

 

Historic isn't though.  History stopped in 1965 for narrowboats*.

 

* defined as “working and ex-working canal narrow boats, those being cargo carrying, towing, ice breaking, maintenance or official inspection craft originally built prior to 1965”

 

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

16 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

Interesting point there - if the RCD Owners Manual stated it to be an inch narrower than it was actually constructed, then is that not similar to your "lack of rope ladder" example?

Good point - the RCD requires boats to be built to within certain dimensions / tolerances.

 

 

 

ISO 8666: establishes uniformity of definitions of main dimensions and related data, and of mass specifications and loading conditions. It applies to small craft having a length of the hull of up to 24 m.

 

 

My manual simply says :

 

 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Alan de Enfield

[captain birdseye]

20 hours ago, BEngo said:

It needs to comply with the Recreational Craft Directive, if you wish to be legally able to sell it within 5 years of constructing it.  Alan de E will be along with all the details soon.

The problems with a new RN are:

They are vapourware.  No-one I know claims any have been made for several  years.  Even the RN Register members admit that there is not a full engine set of parts on the shelf and that some of the key patterns are unaccounted for.

Some of the bought in parts- fuel pump, injectors, are no longer in production.

The engine does not have the necessary emissions certification, and afaik no one is planning to get it.

The engine does not have the necessary noise certification, and afaik no one is planning to get it.

 

 Easier to buy a good boat with a decent engine and plan a complete refit, bit even then you will be in RCD territory.

 

N

 

Odd you should say RN Register member says they are not made any more. Page 9 of their current newsletter says there are two under construction at the moment and a DM3 being built , plus another DM2 awaiting confirmation before build starts. 

Linky thing

http://www.rnregister.org.uk/RNRN-105-WebSmall.pdf

Edited May 24, 2020 by captain birdseye

[Athy]

17 minutes ago, captain birdseye said:

Odd you should say RN Register member says they are not made any more. Page 9 of their current newsletter says there are two under construction at the moment and a DM3 being built , plus another DM2 awaiting confirmation before build starts. 

Linky thing

http://www.rnregister.org.uk/RNRN-105-WebSmall.pdf

That's good news, though it is a pity that (as I understand it) they probably won't be able to be installed in narrowboats.

I've only once seen a DM3, when Mel Davis put one in one of his boats. It was a splendid-looking beastie. I wonder where it will end up: in a sea-going vessel?

[BEngo]

Please read what I wrote.  " Even the RN Register members admit that there is not a full engine set of parts on the shelf and that some of the key patterns are unaccounted for."

 

The first half of that statement is borne out by the article  linked to .

 I do not claim that no more engines  can be built.  The patterns could  be re-created, or maybe  have been rediscovered.  Other items can be made. 

I do say that I know of no engines  that have been delivered for some time.

 

The problems of noise and emissions testing will also need to be sorted if a legally CE marked boat is to be built.

 

N

 

[Athy]

Just now, BEngo said:

Please read what I wrote.  " Even the RN Register members admit that there is not a full engine set of parts on the shelf.

 

N

 

Perhaps because the parts now missing have recently been used in the construction of new engines?

[captain birdseye]

In all this conjecture, has anybody actually spoken to the company or know that a newly built model of the engine concerned is not compliant, or know that the engines can or cannot be fitted in new boats for certain, and if they can how and under what circumstances. I am just thinking that it is a bit unfair to tell people to not consider an engine because of unsubstantiated claims when it is a business's income that is at risk.

 

To BEngo's point on spares, I have only needed few parts for my DM2 over the years I have owned the boat and when I have needed something the company have been able to supply the parts within a day or two. I suspect it all depends on who you speak to as with all things peoples opinions are dependant on their experiences

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, captain birdseye said:

In all this conjecture, has anybody actually spoken to the company or know that a newly built model of the engine concerned is not compliant, or know that the engines can or cannot be fitted in new boats for certain, and if they can how and under what circumstances.

 

I have twice suggested to the OP that this should be his next course of action, he / we are then discussing from a position of known facts.

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Just an idea, why not just ask RN if these new engines are to be built and marked as CE Noise & Emissions Compliant.

 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Alan de Enfield

[David Mack]

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Just an idea, and to maybe give an 'easy way out', why not just ask RN if these new engines are to be built and marked as CE Noise & Emissions Compliant.

Tony Redshaw says their Indian-built Lister clone can be provided with a certificate of conformity.

http://www.vintagediesels.co.uk/lister-cs2/

[Alan de Enfield]

23 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Tony Redshaw says their Indian-built Lister clone can be provided with a certificate of conformity.

http://www.vintagediesels.co.uk/lister-cs2/

It is not just a 'certificate of conformity' the engines must be marked with a CE approval number, similar to the RCD approval plaque

 

 

 

Maybe that is a market that could be developed by the company selling 'Bombay University Degree' certificates, genuine copies of driving licences and passports ?

 

"Tell us engine make, model and serial number and we will send you a certificate of compliance and a small metal plaque to mount on the engine - just £100 of your British pounds"

 

 

 

Only engines that were CE marked during the production process are accepted. Engines need a declaration of conformity from the engine manufacturer as well as a certificate issued by the technical control body. A declaration of conformity for engines produced before the certificate was issued is not valid. However, engines will be accepted if they are CE marked in a recreational boat used in the EEA before 01/01/2006. If you replace your engine in a recreational vessel after 01/01/2006, the new engine will need CE marking.

 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Alan de Enfield