12v wiring bamboozlement

[BlueStringPudding]

On 24/05/2020 at 15:51, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

 

Disconnect the Victron panels (at the MC4 plugs) so the flashing light of irritation stops.

Thank you ??

 

The Victron array is now disconnected.

The SunSaver array is now reconnected and working. 

The irritating flashing blue light of doom still continues, presumably because the Victron is still connected to the batteries. I can live with that for now. I've shut a door and closed a curtain and can now pretend it's not there for a while ?

[cuthound]

1 hour ago, BlueStringPudding said:

Thank you ??

 

The Victron array is now disconnected.

The SunSaver array is now reconnected and working. 

The irritating flashing blue light of doom still continues, presumably because the Victron is still connected to the batteries. I can live with that for now. I've shut a door and closed a curtain and can now pretend it's not there for a while ?

 

Stick a bit of black insulating tape over the offending light. ?

[BlueStringPudding]

So I have finally given up on trying to borrow a Victron dongle and I've forked out for one. (Ouch)

I used it to update the software in the controller, which might have been part of the problem ? Now the flashing blue light of doom is a steady on light of hopefully not-doom. And the app which had indicated that the controller was OFF instead now shows it's charging state. So this is progress ?

 

I'm *thinking* that the Victron controller is working as it should but there are a couple of things I would like to understand in order to be sure. Today is an overcast but bright day. The solar array for the Victron is wired in series with a peak possible voltage of about 60v. The other solar array is 400w and has a SunSaver controller, those panels are connected in both series and parallel so put out a lower peak voltage than the Victron array.

 

So my questions are:

 

Firstly,  why is the Victron array frequently putting out zero Amps according to the app, despite indicating that the same array is simultaneously producing 40v or more? 

 

Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?

 

Here are three readings from Victron app a few minutes apart (the Victron solar array is rated 330W, 60v).  Earlier where it now indicates FLOAT it was indicating BULK while showing 1.3A at the PV and 1.1A  at the battery (so it can get above zero but is currently choosing not to!)

Edited August 21, 2020 by BlueStringPudding

[TheBiscuits]

Switch a load on, the larger the better.

 

I suspect your batteries are full!

 

The display only shows what the Victorian is doing, so earlier the SunSaver might have been doing more work - remember the previous discussion about having two separate solar arrays.

[BlueStringPudding]

Oh, and this is something else I don't understand. The History tab on the app shows how the Victron has been charging the batteries over time. Except it's lying: the Victron solar panels have been unplugged from the controller for a couple of months! I only plugged them in again last night! 

So has the app got its dates confused; or (again) is it not really reading the Victron controller output but instead the battery bank (which will have been charged in part by the SunSaver array and in part by the engine during the time the Victron array was disconnected)?

Just now, TheBiscuits said:

Switch a load on, the larger the better.

 

I suspect your batteries are full!

 

The display only shows what the Victorian is doing, so earlier the SunSaver might have been doing more work - remember the previous discussion about having two separate solar arrays.

I don't understand how full batteries would change the Solar section of the app to indicate zero Amps. Surely in a full battery scenario, zero Amps should only be indicated in the Battery section of the app, because the panels ought to produce current on the PV side of the controller irrelevant of the battery status?

[MoominPapa]

On 21/05/2020 at 12:14, BlueStringPudding said:

once I have assistance from the beautiful, lovely Monkey Mcgee later.

 

Busted MPPT in Baton Rouge, waitin' for the sun
And I's feelin' near as faded as my jeans

 

MP.

 

[Jen-in-Wellies]

47 minutes ago, BlueStringPudding said:

I don't understand how full batteries would change the Solar section of the app to indicate zero Amps. Surely in a full battery scenario, zero Amps should only be indicated in the Battery section of the app, because the panels ought to produce current on the PV side of the controller irrelevant of the battery status?

There has got to be somewhere for it to flow, or there are no amps. A full battery will be taking no current from the controller, so no current will flow from the panels. There will still be a voltage across them, but no current. Similar to when a mains plug is pulled from a socket. There will be no current flowing, but stick a multimeter across the socket pins it will still show 240V. 

Jen

[BlueStringPudding]

1 hour ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

There has got to be somewhere for it to flow, or there are no amps. A full battery will be taking no current from the controller, so no current will flow from the panels. There will still be a voltage across them, but no current. Similar to when a mains plug is pulled from a socket. There will be no current flowing, but stick a multimeter across the socket pins it will still show 240V. 

Jen

Thanks. That's clear (again) ?

 

-----------

 

 

That's my first question answered, but how about my second? Does anyone know this please?

 

"Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?"

Edited August 21, 2020 by BlueStringPudding

[WotEver]

18 minutes ago, BlueStringPudding said:

Thanks. That's clear (again) ?

 

-----------

 

 

That's my first question answered, but how about my second? Does anyone know this please?

 

"Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?"

Just the Victron.

[BlueStringPudding]

34 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Just the Victron.

 

Excellent. Thank you. ?

[BlueStringPudding]

 

 

Last (and very much least) if the Battery section of the app only shows what the Victron is putting out (matron) then how does that explain the barchart I posted above (#130) which shows days and days of charging during the months that the Victron solar array was unplugged? ??

Edited August 21, 2020 by BlueStringPudding

[TheBiscuits]

1 hour ago, WotEver said:

Just the Victron.

 

3 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

The display only shows what the Victorian is doing, so earlier the SunSaver might have been doing more work - remember the previous discussion about having two separate solar arrays.

 

Ok, so I got autocorrected, but I thought it was clear enough!

 

@BlueStringPudding did you try switching a load on and checking again?

[jonathanA]

Remember the victron is measuring the voltage at its terminals, so even if it's doing nothing their is still a voltage for it to see from the batteries, charger or whatever else you have connected up, hence your bar chart readings 

[BlueStringPudding]

23 minutes ago, jonathanA said:

Remember the victron is measuring the voltage at its terminals, so even if it's doing nothing their is still a voltage for it to see from the batteries, charger or whatever else you have connected up, hence your bar chart readings 

Thanks. But that confuses me now because it seems to contradict what WotEver said above. ?

 

The reason I asked the question is because of course both battery terminals of both solar controllers connect to the same busbar which in turn leads to the battery bank. Hence asking: "Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?"

 

So which is it? Anyone know, please?

Edited August 21, 2020 by BlueStringPudding

[BlueStringPudding]

2 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

Ok, so I got autocorrected, but I thought it was clear enough!

 

@BlueStringPudding did you try switching a load on and checking again?

It does indeed increase Amps (a tiny amount). With the fridge running full whack, the shower pump on, two 12v sockets charging gadgets, and the macerator loo flushing simultaneously, the app goes from showing zero Amps and therefore zero Watts to this:

 

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, BlueStringPudding said:

Thanks. But that confuses me now because it seems to contradict what WotEver said above. ?

 

The reason I asked the question is because of course both battery terminals of both solar controllers connect to the same busbar which in turn leads to the battery bank. Hence asking: "Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?"

 

So which is it? Anyone know, please?

 

I am with JonathanA in that I don't see how the battery section of the Victron thing can measure and display anything but the battery voltage and that will include and enhancement form the other array, alternator or charger. Amps is different. I would be able to measure and display the current it is delivering but it could not measure the current from any other charging device.

[WotEver]

2 hours ago, BlueStringPudding said:

Secondly, does the "Battery" section of the app dashboard show me the voltage and amp outputs of both the solar arrays combined at the battery bank? Or just what the Victron controller is trying to put out to battery bank?"

It will show the voltage of the batteries. It will show you amps out of itself only. 

2 hours ago, BlueStringPudding said:

It does indeed increase Amps (a tiny amount). With the fridge running full whack, the shower pump on, two 12v sockets charging gadgets, and the macerator loo flushing simultaneously, the app goes from showing zero Amps and therefore zero Watts to this:

Which shows that the only reason it was showing 0 Amps prior was that the batteries were full. 

12W = 1A going into the batteries. 

[BlueStringPudding]

Thanks everyone. ??