Can we cruise again?

[dogsarelandseals]

5 minutes ago, Athy said:

Hong Kong Flu was called just that. I have always believed that this was because it originated in Hong Kong.  Likewise German measles, which I seem to remember being vaccinated against as a boy. It is not uncommon to name things after their place of origin: Yorkshire pudding, Kiwi fruit.....

   So, was Spanish Flu not of Iberian origin?

No I don't believe it was. Here's some reading if you're interested https://www.history.com/topics/world-war-i/1918-flu-pandemic

 

I don't have a dog in this race, I just study history

[The Welsh Cruiser]

30 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

However he rationalises it, he seems to believe that he will survive anything the virus can throw at him, (he may be correct, or he may not), and he definitely doesn't care if he infects someone else when he has it.

 

I'm not sure why anyone would resist it. I had my first ever flu jab in December. It was a mere scratch that I hardly felt, and I cant see any rational reason for not having it. Same would/should apply to a Covid19 vaccine.... but there have always been people like Welshy around. They are lucky that there are plenty who will happily accept a vaccine.

My feelings regarding vaccinations are certainly a minority one. Mind you, this country prides itself on being welcoming to minorities, does it not? Or is this perhaps not accurate, the truth being that it's welcoming to a clearly defined list of minorities with all other minorities (there are plenty) being excluded from the privilege of exercising their beliefs and instead, forced to adopt the practices resulting from the mind set of the majority?  

[Sir Nibble]

22 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

I've heard of re-infection, but can a vaccine give any better outcome. If a person's body had the capacity to defend itself, and was resilient, it is a better system than vaccine - for those people. What is a vaccine meant to do, but to encourage a reaction in the body to produce antibodies. 

 

 

 

The reports of reinfection have been shown to be false positives caused by residual chemical markers from the initial infection. There are no confirmed cases of reinfection. A vaccine can give a better outcome by killing fewer people.

Edited May 14, 2020 by Sir Nibble

[Higgs]

Just now, Sir Nibble said:

The reports of reinfection have been shown to be false positives caused by residual chemical markers from the initial infection. There are no confirmed cases of reinfection.

 

There's some hope in immunity - good. 

 

 

[Higgs]

13 minutes ago, Sir Nibble said:

 A vaccine can give a better outcome by killing fewer people.

 

It could, when it's here, if safe. 

 

 

 

Edited May 14, 2020 by Higgs

[Athy]

8 minutes ago, dogsarelandseals said:

 

 

I don't have a dog in this race, I just study history

Nor a land seal?

Are you currently a student? I did not study history at university but have devoted much time to its investigation since.

[mrsmelly]

1 hour ago, Richard10002 said:

You are not the most observant, are you?   

 

You call it twaddle because you know it's correct, and you have no rational response.

 

Again, let me make it easy for you - You, and I, and anyone, are free to continue to "Stay At Home".... but the guidance/advice/rules have changed, and we are now free to "Leave Our Homes For As Long As We Like", as long as we "Stay Alert", (and go home each night). We can even go Cruising if we like  

 

 

Of course you can, any pratt stupid enough can do those things. those with what Boris called common sense however will stay locked down, you realy have no idea do you. Do yoiu ask your local labour mp each day what he will allow you to do or your own personal nanny?

[dogsarelandseals]

Just now, Athy said:

Nor a land seal?

Are you currently a student? I did not study history at university but have devoted much time to its investigation since.

All my land seals are off cruising today!

 

I am yes, I switched from completely different subject and I love it. What era are you particularly interested in?

[mrsmelly]

53 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

a "tiny few" Smelly. If you want to, you can stop worrying about it... the deals done! We've left!

 

or... Perhaps you don't want to stop worrying about it, and will still be moaning about it in a decade or so?

I know the deal is done its the muppets on your side wetting their nappies at the moment and wanting to stay any pay even more to the failing eu economy. They will be crushed as before but whats wrong with these losers?

40 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

But the country has been trained no to make their own common sense decisions. At one time you wouldn't think of parking on a blind bend or brow of a hill or road junction. Today you need a double yellow line to tell you that and it there isn't one then people park there. You need No Mooring signs opposite winding holes so now if it doesn't say no mooring its OK to moor there. People today need telling exactly what they can do and cant do. You see this weekend some places will be packed, just like the weekend before the fines came in.

Unfortunately you are correct  there are plenty of muppets out there who will now go boating and doing lots of other stuff and if they catch covid they will be employing a solicitor to take the government to court for allowing them out, as if its a demand. Same eeejuts that pile up on blind bends on country roads because they are thick enough to think 60mph is a target they have to achieve.

[BilgePump]

17 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

there are plenty of muppets out there who will now go boating and doing lots of other stuff and if they catch covid they will be employing a solicitor to take the government to court for allowing them out, as if its a demand. Same eeejuts that pile up on blind bends on country roads because they are thick enough to think 60mph is a target they have to achieve.

 

Nice to be an armchair warrior back afloat, now people have to go back to work and are having to come up with a way of dealing with this new reality? But boating and going out are the demon? I will be going paddling, will move my boat, am not part of the compensation culture and have a clean licence due to driving considerately. Just as I will be visiting and using my boat from now on. 

[Sir Nibble]

22 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

It could, when it's here, if safe. 

 

 

 

Well given that you seem happy to advocate gaining immunity by infection I suppose "safe" is a relative term? I think we can be confident that no vaccine passed for use will kill 30,000 people in three months.

[mrsmelly]

1 minute ago, BilgePump said:

 

Nice to be an armchair warrior back afloat, now people have to go back to work and are having to come up with a way of dealing with this new reality? But boating and going out are the demon? I will be going paddling, will move my boat, am not part of the compensation culture and have a clean licence due to driving considerately. Just as I will be visiting and using my boat from now on. 

Yes and all thats fine because you probably realise that you are putting yourself possibly in harms way and may be risking passing something on to others. Nail on head bit is that people now have to go back to work but those of us retired dont have to suddenly do anything we can use our common sense and stay in till its a little safer. Just because we can certainly doesnt mean its a good idea. We could drive to and viist any one of our five kids and nine grandkids  but as a family we have all decided common sense thing is not to do so.

[Richard10002]

47 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Question my logic, but you have no proof that a vaccine is superior to the body's own defences, where these defences have proved to be able. 

 

 

 

 

I wasn't questioning your logic was I? In fact, I actually said that I lean towards believing that immunity is likely, thus agreeing with your "logic", to a degree.

 

However, you also stated that proof of immunity exists. It seems that the proof that you talked about doesn't exist.

 

It doesn't matter either way. It is just strange that you would assert something that you either know not to be true, or don't know is true - you certainly have no evidence for what you stated.

[Richard10002]

37 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Of course you can, any pratt stupid enough can do those things. those with what Boris called common sense however will stay locked down, you realy have no idea do you. Do yoiu ask your local labour mp each day what he will allow you to do or your own personal nanny?

Crikey... having talked bollox since Sunday, you've well and truly moved the goalposts haven't you? You started off saying that Boris's message was clear and easy to understand, and that only 1 thing had changed, (despite talking about 2 things in the same post). Then you talked knowingly about the 2 things that had changed, and also inferred that the message wasn't clear, by stating that things would be clarified as the week went by. You also stated unequivocally that there would be no cruising, and so on. In terms of "the bollox you spout" I have lost count. You are not quite in Higgsys league, but you are definitely getting close - it is almost as though it is deliberate?

 

Now, rather than talking about what is allowed or not, (where you failed miserably), you seem to be saying that anyone who follows the guidelines in Boris's speech, and the subsequent clarification, is "a stupid pratt".

 

Don't get me wrong, myself and my wife are remaining pretty much as locked down as before.... just like you and yours - we don't want to be the guinea pigs in this relaxation where infections will increase.

 

I might go for a cruise to the countryside with the dog over the next few days, (it's allowed, of course), as that will actually be safer than the usual walk around the cemetery where there is a risk of getting a bit to close to the living, as well as the dead.

[BilgePump]

5 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Yes and all thats fine because you probably realise that you are putting yourself possibly in harms way and may be risking passing something on to others. Nail on head bit is that people now have to go back to work but those of us retired dont have to suddenly do anything we can use our common sense and stay in till its a little safer. Just because we can certainly doesnt mean its a good idea. We could drive to and viist any one of our five kids and nine grandkids  but as a family we have all decided common sense thing is not to do so.

I certainly don't criticise anyone who can stay at home for doing so at this time. Protect yourself, your family and the NHS. Admirable. Yes, I could be/put others in harm's way but I know my mooring and access and it is less than hour from home in an area I work in. I could also have been/put others in harm's way in the supermarket, bank queue, PO, hardware shop etc for the last seven weeks. My parents over 70 have stayed home as advised and I certainly haven't suggested to them that they start waltzing out as they have no need (the groups etc they enjoy are suspended and I've dropped off their shopping) but I have been in those places listed plus more and have to continue working, often near my boat. Now we are allowed to do so, I intend to visit it follwoing all social distancing guidance because it is a quiet bit of safe sanity that allows me to deal with the world as it is.

[Machpoint005]

1 hour ago, Richard10002 said:

a "tiny few" Smelly. If you want to, you can stop worrying about it... the deals done! We've left!

 

 

 

But it turns out it's just as well we are still in the transition period, but perhaps he hasn't heard about the international tariff-free trade in PPE (as just one example) which we still currently enjoy?

 

1 hour ago, Sir Nibble said:

...die of terminal obstinacy...

Black humour, maybe, but ? ? ? for that phrase!

[Machpoint005]

1 hour ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Mind you, this country prides itself on being welcoming to minorities, does it not? Or is this perhaps not accurate, the truth being that it's welcoming to a clearly defined list of minorities with all other minorities (there are plenty) being excluded from the privilege of exercising their beliefs and instead, forced to adopt the practices resulting from the mind set of the majority?  

 

For goodness' sake, take the chip off at least one of your shoulders once in a while!

 

 

[The Welsh Cruiser]

5 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

 

For goodness' sake, take the chip off at least one of your shoulders once in a while!

 

 

Do you have a view regarding my questions? 

[doratheexplorer]

2 hours ago, Higgs said:

 

This started off as a discussion for or against the blanket use of a vaccine.

 

 

No it didn't.  It started off as a discussion on whether we might be allowed to start cruising again.  The answer seems to be - yes, a bit.  Maybe a bit more soon.

1 hour ago, Richard10002 said:

and this peer reviewed proof that you talk of came from?

 

Your response suggests that you made it up, and it doesn't exist, does it?

Surely not!  Higgs is usually so thorough in his research!

[Sir Nibble]

12 minutes ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Do you have a view regarding my questions? 

You have without challenge or prompting, yourself stated that your views fly in the face of the facts. So what price credibility? Yes you are in a minority. There can be few subjects outside religion where such irrationality can be found so how can you expect people to engage with you in debate when you yourself state that your opinions are factually incorrect? What's the point?

[doratheexplorer]

1 hour ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

My feelings regarding vaccinations are certainly a minority one. Mind you, this country prides itself on being welcoming to minorities, does it not? Or is this perhaps not accurate, the truth being that it's welcoming to a clearly defined list of minorities with all other minorities (there are plenty) being excluded from the privilege of exercising their beliefs and instead, forced to adopt the practices resulting from the mind set of the majority?  

Erm, I think it depends on the shared value of the minority group.  I mean, a minority of people are serial killers, are we supposed to welcome them?

I wouldn't shun you because you're part of a minority, but if your practices cause the needless deaths of many people, then I'd rightly have an issue with that.

Edited May 14, 2020 by doratheexplorer

[sirweste]

Just popped back in to see if there was any new update...we're on to anti-vax with a hint of brexit... love this place, never known another forum veer so wildly off topic with such regularity.

 

My emails from CRT are a bit haphazard e.g. I never received the one telling me to stay put, I'd decided to do it anyway as it seemed logical, then I noticed a post on here.

There's been no update on yesterday's announcement I assume?

 

I also assume there's quite a bit of anecdotal evidence for increased boat movements now? That's my experience anyhow

[peterboat]

3 hours ago, Richard10002 said:

You are not the most observant, are you?   

 

You call it twaddle because you know it's correct, and you have no rational response.

 

Again, let me make it easy for you - You, and I, and anyone, are free to continue to "Stay At Home".... but the guidance/advice/rules have changed, and we are now free to "Leave Our Homes For As Long As We Like", as long as we "Stay Alert", (and go home each night). We can even go Cruising if we like  

 

 

Next month if I read the email correctly 

[mrsmelly]

2 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Next month if I read the email correctly 

The email is weird it seems to be a two tier system with things slightly different to hobby boaters and liveaboards. The bit Richard doesnt understand is the bit that says " common sense approach would be to remain tied up for the moment " Strangely we havnt had any boats about again today so most people must realise whats the best thing to do. I have been fettling the motorhome today ready for the off. The beauty of that bit of kit is that we can get in it and drive to a site without going anywhere near anybody and when we get there go to the allocated pitch and keep well clear of any body at all times. Boating is safe but not as safe is it as you have to handle locks and pass closely on the towpath etc.

The deaths of course will now rise again but if not by a huge amount we are hoping to be able to boat again or go off in the motorhome sometime after 4th of July. Be great if it was before but we doubt it here.

[Momac]

2 hours ago, mrsmelly said:

Same eeejuts that pile up on blind bends on country roads because they are thick enough to think 60mph is a target they have to achieve.

As a thread  drift ....I did the speed awareness course  a couple of years ago.

I specifically asked about driving well under the speed limit as a response to being caught by a speed camera  and the instructor was horrified.   This is how people are taught to drive .......up to the speed limit and not under or over it .  It's the ''where it is safe to do so'' bit that may not be well taught.

I have been overtaken by cars dong 70mph on snow settled on the road)/in dense fog/in torrential rain  on motorways when it is clearly not safe.

.