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Old Barge & RCD


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26 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

Probably RCD as ISTR something to do with major alterations to an existing boat falling under it now. 

I think you are probably correct the 2017 RCD changes would appear to apply.

 

I may depend on what you mean by 'fit-out'. How far are you going ? Is the engine being changed ? etc etc

If it has been stripped out and you are basically starting with a 'sail away' then it will apply.

 

‘Major Craft Conversion’ would be applicable to the fit out of the majority of sailaway boats, and needs to be factored in when planning your fit out. Once you have completed the fit out of your sailway boat, the boat would require a Post Construction Assessment and the documentation, builders plate and CE markings all need to be updated. Although a self assessment is possible, it is not recommended as the fitter would resume all responsibility as the manufacturer and it is also a lengthy and involved process. In the worse case scenario, it could mean you are held criminally responsible if the boat sank and there was loss of life. It is recommended that you appoint a professional to complete the post construction assessment, this would be at of cost of around £2000.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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The OP might do well the bear in mind if he says nothing to anyone about any recent 'fit-out' that may or may not have happened, then the RCD definitely no longer applies.

 

If he gets my drift....

 

Oh and it also depends on where the boat is and if it needs a licence.

 

 

 

Edited by Mike the Boilerman
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  • Greenie 1
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The RCD was introduced in connection with the certification of boats as safe in many different respects to protect the purchaser.  It is not needed if you are doing any work on your own boat which you intend to keep for 5 years or more.  AFAIK the RCD is only required if you are planning to sell the boat.  Has this changed?

 

If that is still the case, and you have no plans to sell the boat, you only need the BSC.

  • Greenie 1
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6 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

The RCD was introduced in connection with the certification of boats as safe in many different respects to protect the purchaser.  It is not needed if you are doing any work on your own boat which you intend to keep for 5 years or more.  AFAIK the RCD is only required if you are planning to sell the boat.  Has this changed?

 

If that is still the case, and you have no plans to sell the boat, you only need the BSC.

 

That was the case with the old RCD, but AIUI the scope of the new RCD in 2017 extended to cover alterations to existing boats regardless of whether you plan to sell them.

 

Hopefully I'm wrong but ISTR satisfying myself that the new RCD prevented me installing a vintage engine in any boat I might own, regardless of my future plans for the boat. 

 

The OP would be well advised to read the RCD for himself rather than rely on guesses on internet forums. 

 

 

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An opinion from the irresponsible side. You only need to comply with the RCD if you get caught. The RCD is, as Murflyn says, a device to protect the purchaser, and, in fact more than that, it is a device to protect manufacturers from sub standard vessels competing with home produced items. If you re fit an old vessel then feel the urge to confess to trading standards that you did not go through the whole RCD process then I very much doubt that they would welcome your honesty or want to pursue it. There is though ,stuff that does apply if your boat is over 20 metres and you take it back to the EU. For this I would recommend the Dutch Barge Association as the people on there know more about it.

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Thanks for the replys. This is taken from the RCD website.

 

a conversion of a watercraft which changes the means of propulsion of the watercraft, involves a major engine modification, or alters the watercraft to such an extent that it may not meet the applicable essential safety and environmental requirements laid down in this Directive.

 

The first part is clear to me that im exempt however the second part is not. I bought the boat with BSC certificate however im doing the work on a hard stand in essex so do not need to keep it up to date untill relaunch. I am unsure where the boat will be kept once finished so at a minimum i am working to BSC regs.

10 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I think you are probably correct the 2017 RCD changes would appear to apply.

 

I may depend on what you mean by 'fit-out'. How far are you going ? Is the engine being changed ? etc etc

If it has been stripped out and you are basically starting with a 'sail away' then it will apply.

 

‘Major Craft Conversion’ would be applicable to the fit out of the majority of sailaway boats, and needs to be factored in when planning your fit out. Once you have completed the fit out of your sailway boat, the boat would require a Post Construction Assessment and the documentation, builders plate and CE markings all need to be updated. Although a self assessment is possible, it is not recommended as the fitter would resume all responsibility as the manufacturer and it is also a lengthy and involved process. In the worse case scenario, it could mean you are held criminally responsible if the boat sank and there was loss of life. It is recommended that you appoint a professional to complete the post construction assessment, this would be at of cost of around £2000.

My boat is not CE marked.

Edited by Greenhorn
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36 minutes ago, Greenhorn said:

My boat is not CE marked.

It won't be, it was not required when it was built, however, since the 2017 changes it would appear that all (even old boats) need to have a post construction assesment if they have had 'major work' done to them.

 

Are you simply putting a new wall in the bathroom, or, are you taking up the floors and altering the ballast etc etc

 

As has been said, the chance of you being 'caught & prosecuted' is very slight, but if you do intend to take it into Europe than they are far more zealous over 'paperwork'.

 

The BMF are advising members :

 

However we would currently advise all companies that purchase, or are involved in the selling or modifying of second hand vessels to as a minimum:

1.  1. Carry out the procedure for verification/checking of documentation as set out in the Recreational Craft Directive for distributors. (see guidance for distributors); and

2.  2. Ensure the owners of the vessel are aware of their responsibilities under the directive with reference to “Major Craft Conversion”.

There are discussions continuing at the European Union Recreational Craft Sectoral Group to further clarify when a vessel is considered to have undergone Major Craft Conversion and the extent to which a Post Construction Assessment must be carried out, these will be advised upon when clarification has been agreed.

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3 hours ago, Greenhorn said:

I bought the boat with BSC certificate however im doing the work on a hard stand in essex so do not need to keep it up to date untill relaunch. I am unsure where the boat will be kept once finished so at a minimum i am working to BSC regs.

 

BSC requirements and RCD are completely different things. You don't need a BSC while the boat is out of the water, so if the current one expires you don't need to renew it until your are ready to put the boat back in waters where the navigation authority requires you to have a BSC (not all do). That said, it makes sense to do all your refitting compliant with the BSS - it's not onerous for new work, and while some will question the absolute necessity of some of the requirements, they are mostly pretty sensible and easy to comply with.

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13 minutes ago, David Mack said:

 

BSC requirements and RCD are completely different things. You don't need a BSC while the boat is out of the water, so if the current one expires you don't need to renew it until your are ready to put the boat back in waters where the navigation authority requires you to have a BSC (not all do). That said, it makes sense to do all your refitting compliant with the BSS - it's not onerous for new work, and while some will question the absolute necessity of some of the requirements, they are mostly pretty sensible and easy to comply with.

 

Also worth remembering that it is very easy to invalidate your BSSC - particularly is stripping out and re-fitting a boat, if your 'systems' (electrics, gas, fuel etc) have changed are the new installations fully compliant ?

 

BSS T&Cs

 

Please note: the BSS Examination findings, and examination report, relate only to the facts observed at the time of the BSS Examination. It is not evidence of compliance with the navigation authorities' requirements at any other time.

The owner's on-going responsibility: it is crucial to maintain the vessel in good condition in accordance with the safety requirements; and, any other licensing, registration or mooring conditions of the relevant navigation or harbour authority.  The validity of a BSS pass result may be affected and can be cancelled if the vessel is not properly maintained; and/or non-compliant alterations are made;

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