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Tiller/rudder seized


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Newbie lee, I’m a novice boater ,56y, a carpenter from 16, in need of a new project/life venture. So I’ve just returned from a 5 day road trip hunt, racking up 1500 miles touring our canals looking for a narrow boat. On our finale leg near Bath on the k&A I found her,may be ? she’s a 47 footer,  but has a seized rudder problem, I’m quite handy but I’ve no idea ,they’ve  said it’s the glan seal baring thingy, where the tiller meets the barge has popped out? Any advice is welcome. ?‍♂️

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Just wrote a longish reply to this and it's all disappeared.  Have a couple of pictures instead which shows how it's all held together. Someone will be along to explain it

 

rudder.jpg

rudder 2.jpg

rudder 3.jpg

rudder 4.jpg

Edited by pete.i
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1 hour ago, Wotzit said:

Newbie lee, I’m a novice boater ,56y, a carpenter from 16, in need of a new project/life venture. So I’ve just returned from a 5 day road trip hunt, racking up 1500 miles touring our canals looking for a narrow boat. On our finale leg near Bath on the k&A I found her,may be ? she’s a 47 footer,  but has a seized rudder problem, I’m quite handy but I’ve no idea ,they’ve  said it’s the glan seal baring thingy, where the tiller meets the barge has popped out? Any advice is welcome. ?‍♂️

It might indicate that the boat hasn't been moved much and is poorly maintained.  If it's just the top bearing siezed it might free up after soaking in penetrating oil or WD 40.

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This is a very small problem on the grand scheme of things. A good boat yard will fix it in a day or less and with a few big tools you can maybe do it yourself. For example, removing swan neck and rudder, grinding off rudder bearing cup, machining new components, and putting it all back together, is a moderately routine operation.

 

Over plating a thin rusty shell, or refitting a crap interior are MUCH bigger jobs.

 

..............Dave

 

 

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Trouble is until we know the design of the rudder, stock and swan neck we rally can't answer. Some have no bearings and the stock just fits the rudder tube, some have a ball top bearing while others have a rubber or "plastic" top bush.

 

If its the first type then it may just be rust but on the other hand the rudder tube may be gently rusting through. Ones with ball top bearings may well just be seized top bearings and renewing it will cure the problem. The same might apply to the third type.

 

Bear in mind the sitting the rudder on a lock cill has been known to bend the stock on any design so it binds in the tube.

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The only part that you can get at is that big top bearing held on with 4 bolts.  They are pretty hefty things and the leverage that you can exert with the tiller ought to show some movement there. Does the tiller and what you can see of the rudder line up?  Have a look down the weedhatch and see/feel if anything is out of line, bent, jammed, knocked sideways and then have a cup of tea and a think.

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Top bearing is either a big ball race held by bolts as in the picture, or a plastic insert in an aluminium cup bolted on, or on a good old shell a phosphor bronze sleeve in a steel carrier that is knocked into the top of the rudder shaft tube going through the fuel tank usually.

Unless it is an external rudder shaft on the stern or in a groove in the stern, common on hire boats so the rudder is removable in the water.

The bottom bearing on the skeg that stick out of the back of the base plate under the prop could be a bush in a cup, or a nylon/stainless composite bearing ( these are known to seize if not moved for a long while ) 

 

A bit more detail and a photo or two will assist everyone in helping you.  Do you have a name for the boat fabricator, like Evans, Liverpool, Colecraft Springer?

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  • 2 months later...

Just went astern at a water point and there was a clunk, a grind and I couldn’t move the tiller.

 

Transpires something solid and metallic found its way between the prop and the rudder cup and forced the rudder Out of the cup. There’s a first for everything. A nice chap helped me dislodge the offending metallic something, never to be seen and the rudder was successfully relocated in the aforementioned cup. Thoughts of drydock, welding and crowbars came to mind. None of which were not required. Phew.

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50 minutes ago, Nightwatch said:

Just went astern at a water point and there was a clunk, a grind and I couldn’t move the tiller.

 

Transpires something solid and metallic found its way between the prop and the rudder cup and forced the rudder Out of the cup. There’s a first for everything. A nice chap helped me dislodge the offending metallic something, never to be seen and the rudder was successfully relocated in the aforementioned cup. Thoughts of drydock, welding and crowbars came to mind. None of which were not required. Phew.

I hope your prop wasn't damaged.

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5 hours ago, Ex Brummie said:

Have I missed the answer?

Probably not!  I think it was my mistake seeing Nightwatch's reply in post #12.

Does rather underline my comment though as the OP's first post was their last,  over two months ago.

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