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32 minutes ago, zenataomm said:

 

 

 

 

So although it could appear Miss Thunderbird and her ilk are to be the way forward, the big difference is they feel absolved of any responsibility to be part of the problem.  Strangely that leaves them comfortable merely complaining, pointing blame with not a single suggestion or idea of a workable solution.  

 

Most of it will come to pass ... eventually .... but not in the time frames being spouted today.

If only that were true. Speaking as an 'ilk' I certainly do not feel absolved of responsibility for damage caused and being caused. I have been banging on about 'ecology' 'the greenhouse effect' and nowadays 'climate change' for 50 years or so. For 40 of those years hardly anybody listened or took it seriously. Now they do apart from a few remaining idiots. So I reckon complaining, pointing out, not blame, but the problems has at least done something positive and worthwhile. Workable solutions? Sorry, been a bit too busy to save the world singlehanded. As for feeling comfortable because 'we' are now being proved horribly right I think you might just be venting some sort of unjustified anger. It is sometimes nice to be proved right but not about environmental stuff, its much, much too serious and the time frame being spouted today is way too long.

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32 minutes ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Easily done, through the road tax system, which could be based on weight. I'm no fan of Gordon Brown but to be fair to him he had this idea well back, before the climate was an issue. Unfortunately he bottled it, being unable to stand up to the might of the car industry.   

In fact the car tax changed a few years ago to change it exactly the other way.  Many cars including SUVs are now £145, where you were paying, I think, £460 previously for an SUV.

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40 minutes ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Unfortunately he bottled it, being unable to stand up to the might of the car industry.   

Perhaps that is why government isn't bothered by the pending disappearance of the car industry, (whatever the reason). It will be free to penalise cars with gay abandon.......

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9 minutes ago, john6767 said:

Many cars including SUVs are now £145, where you were paying, I think, £460 previously for an SUV.

Only if it’s a low-emmision SUV. Road Fund is now calculated against emissions. 


It should simply be abolished and a couple of pence added to fuel duty. Far fairer for all concerned. But the haulage companies would be up in arms. 

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1 hour ago, WotEver said:

Only if it’s a low-emmision SUV. Road Fund is now calculated against emissions. 


It should simply be abolished and a couple of pence added to fuel duty. Far fairer for all concerned. But the haulage companies would be up in arms. 

It is now, but I don’t think it used to be.  The point though is right now there is nothing to discourage the use of SUVs.

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7 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

The percentage of diesel used by pleasure boats (remember that farmers etc as well as commercial boats will continue to use red) compared to road use is tiny, the extra money raised will be of no consequence to the country.  As to reducing red in road vehicles, I suspect most of that is diesel from farming, commercial and industrial use and not boat yards, so again no difference.

No a member on here over in Manchester was saying 9 litres to the bank to one litre in boats! That's a huge loss in revenue.  Farmers have been filling logs in for years so difficult to fiddle and if caught the problems they will be in arnt worth the hassle 

2 hours ago, john6767 said:

In fact the car tax changed a few years ago to change it exactly the other way.  Many cars including SUVs are now £145, where you were paying, I think, £460 previously for an SUV.

Some suvs are paying thousands in the first year a hundreds for the first 5 years still not enough though 

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58 minutes ago, john6767 said:

It is now, but I don’t think it used to be.  The point though is right now there is nothing to discourage the use of SUVs.

But why should there be if they’re low-emission?  A little Porsche 911 is far less efficient than a Jag E-Pace so what has size got to do with it?

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1 hour ago, WotEver said:

>> A little Porsche 911 is far less efficient than a Jag E-Pace so what has size got to do with it? <<

 

Fuel economy is just a part of the big picture. What is the total environmental impact of a huge electric SUV compared with that of (say) a small sports car with a potential 25-year service life? 

 

(I don't know the answer, by the way, but I suspect it is quite a close-run thing).

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1 hour ago, WotEver said:

But why should there be if they’re low-emission?  A little Porsche 911 is far less efficient than a Jag E-Pace so what has size got to do with it?

As I have an SUV nothing as far as I am concerned, but it’s a surprise that my diesel SUV is the same road tax as my wife’s petrol mini. Governments are not usually so generous.  Now if they can just sort out council tax and income tax that would be nice.

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What seems a bit short sighted to me is the fact that any vehicle over £40k new, inc any extras, and registered after 31/3/16 incurs VED of £352 per year for 5 years after the first year. I would have thought that HMRC might have exempted EVs, unless they are slowing down uptake of EVs. 

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38 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said:

What seems a bit short sighted to me is the fact that any vehicle over £40k new, inc any extras, and registered after 31/3/16 incurs VED of £352 per year for 5 years after the first year. I would have thought that HMRC might have exempted EVs, unless they are slowing down uptake of EVs. 

That's because they have made them a bargain for company car drivers! I think that the uptake because of zero BIK will more than compensate for the slight rise in VED 

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43 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said:

I would have thought that HMRC might have exempted EVs, unless they are slowing down uptake of EVs

 

 I think this is bound to be the case, given just a few years back the National Grid was crying out for more generating capacity as they were regularly running at almost 100%. And then those three power stations going down last year (or was it 2018?) illustrated the lack of spare capacity the grid has once again.

 

Adding in the generating capacity for 30 million electric cars is gonna be one helluva task they never say a peep about. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

 I think this is bound to be the case, given just a few years back the National Grid was crying out for more generating capacity as they were regularly running at almost 100%. And then those three power stations going down last year (or was it 2018?) illustrated the lack of spare capacity the grid has once again.

 

Adding in the generating capacity for 30 million electric cars is gonna be one helluva task they never say a peep about. 

 

 

They constantly say its not a problem as most will be charging at night when demand is at its lowest 

Just now, nb Innisfree said:

BIK? 

Benefit in kind which can be a lot of dosh for a company car driver Google the new rules from  April and how they favour EVs 

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1 minute ago, peterboat said:

They constantly say its not a problem as most will be charging at night when demand is at its lowest 

 

Which of course is correct for 300,000 of them, but obviously not 30m, if you you do some figures comparing the number of street lamps in a road then imagine every car parked in the same road is electric and all of them are trying to charge at the same time. (I.e. overnight)

 

 

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1 minute ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Which of course is correct for 300,000 of them, but obviously not 30m, if you you do some figures comparing the number of street lamps in a road then imagine every car parked in the same road is electric and all of them are trying to charge at the same time. (I.e. overnight)

 

 

Mike the biggest offshore wind farm is going in up here in Yorkshire to join the previous biggest in the world in Lincolnshire, then plans are in place to build an even bigger one at dogger bank! They are planning for the excess power to be used for hydrogen production the planned output is huge as I said they aren't concerned the future is green electric and no ICE vehicles 

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2 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Mike the biggest offshore wind farm is going in up here in Yorkshire to join the previous biggest in the world in Lincolnshire, then plans are in place to build an even bigger one at dogger bank! They are planning for the excess power to be used for hydrogen production the planned output is huge as I said they aren't concerned the future is green electric and no ICE vehicles 

 

Which loops back to what I said. The govt are trying to slow down the uptake of electric cars until generating capacity can cope. 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Mike the biggest offshore wind farm is going in up here in Yorkshire to join the previous biggest in the world in Lincolnshire, then plans are in place to build an even bigger one at dogger bank! They are planning for the excess power to be used for hydrogen production the planned output is huge as I said they aren't concerned the future is green electric and no ICE vehicles 

When you say the planned output is”huge”..... what is the planned output?

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3 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

When you say the planned output is”huge”..... what is the planned output?

 

And just as pertinently, when is it all coming on line?

 

My perception actually, is all it does is replace the generating capacity of all the gas fired power stations currently being closed down.

 

 

 

 

 

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Not to mention the ever growing use of electric trains as diesel power is gradually phased out. There are still of course many unelectrified lines which mainly diesel hauled freight liner trains have to use to get to docks and certain large factories and what not.  The Western region from London to the west country is nearly all electrified now as is the NE from Kings X. There are many hybrid loco's and multiple units about now though which can use on electrified or non electrifide lines.

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1 minute ago, bizzard said:

The Western region from London to the west country is nearly all electrified now

 

Is it? 

 

The line through here to the west country is electrified as far west as Newbury, then the trains switch over to diesel for the journey to Penzance and back.

 

Or do they have batteries on board? THis seems unlikely. 

 

 

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23 minutes ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

 I think this is bound to be the case, given just a few years back the National Grid was crying out for more generating capacity as they were regularly running at almost 100%. And then those three power stations going down last year (or was it 2018?) illustrated the lack of spare capacity the grid has once again.

 

Adding in the generating capacity for 30 million electric cars is gonna be one helluva task they never say a peep about. 

 

 

Yes and of course all those 30 million electric cars have to be recharged using green renewable energy, good luck with that.

My 76 year old uncle has just sold his electric Jag and brought a hybrid Lexus, the current infrastructure for electric vehicles does not even meet his lifestyle and as he said he'll be dead before it does.

 

Ken

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