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Life of domestic Antifreeze


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There have been a couple of threads about the life of the antifreeze that is used in the engine cooling system, but what about the domestic central heating system?

 

My system has an old Ellis gas boiler to warm the water that circulates through the radiators. It is several years since it was changed, and I can remember adding an antifreeze & corrosion inhibitor (possibly Fernox) at the time. So, my question is, should I think about draining & refilling it or should I just leave it well alone?

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If you are using car antifreeze in the Coolant,  the glycol antifreeze part lasts for ever, if it doesn't leak out.  The corrosion inhibitors do  wear out.  I Tip some Screwfix inhibitor in every couple of years.

A simple test is to draw off a sample into a glass jar and tip in 3 or 4 steel wire nails.  If they go rusty after a couple of weeks you need more inhibitor. Draw another sample into a yoghurt pot and put it in the freezer compartment of the fridge.  If it sets add more antifreeze.

N

 

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My understanding is that most domestic inhibitors don't have antifreeze properties. Some do. I use this on my boat for the back boiler central heating and for the solar thermal hot water system, which does. Also uses propylene glycol, which is non toxic. Useful if you leave your boat unheated in winter to avoid having to drain the system.

Jen

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7 hours ago, BEngo said:

If you are using car antifreeze in the Coolant,  the glycol antifreeze part lasts for ever, if it doesn't leak out.  The corrosion inhibitors do  wear out.  I Tip some Screwfix inhibitor in every couple of years.

A simple test is to draw off a sample into a glass jar and tip in 3 or 4 steel wire nails.  If they go rusty after a couple of weeks you need more inhibitor. Draw another sample into a yoghurt pot and put it in the freezer compartment of the fridge.  If it sets add more antifreeze.

N

 

seems a good test

 

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Most of my blue antifreeze is several years old.  However I do add some Screwfix corrosion inhibitor every couple of years.

 Particularly relevant as my boiler has an aluminium heat exchanger. No problems after twelve years.

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12 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

My understanding is that most domestic inhibitors don't have antifreeze properties. Some do. I use this on my boat for the back boiler central heating and for the solar thermal hot water system, which does. Also uses propylene glycol, which is non toxic. Useful if you leave your boat unheated in winter to avoid having to drain the system.

Jen

Jen-in-Wellies,

I use the flomasta Inhibitied antifreeze that you have referred to. On draining my system recently to do some changes, the water/antifreeze mixture is distinctly brown (like dilute black coffee) so I am not convinced the inhibitor is adequate. Do you have any long term experience of using this product?

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9 hours ago, jonesthenuke said:

Jen-in-Wellies,

I use the flomasta Inhibitied antifreeze that you have referred to. On draining my system recently to do some changes, the water/antifreeze mixture is distinctly brown (like dilute black coffee) so I am not convinced the inhibitor is adequate. Do you have any long term experience of using this product?

It has been in around two years or so. I've not checked it thus far. Perhaps I will. Thanks for the feedback. How long was your antifreeze/inhibitor in for? What sort of central heating system is it in?

Jen

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23 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

It has been in around two years or so. I've not checked it thus far. Perhaps I will. Thanks for the feedback. How long was your antifreeze/inhibitor in for? What sort of central heating system is it in?

Jen

The central heating system has a Hurricane diesel heater, two radiators and a towel rail plus calorifier. The Flomasta has been in there for about 4 years. I think I will look for some inhibitor that is compatible with the antifreeze.

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  • 9 months later...
On 15/01/2020 at 10:14, Jen-in-Wellies said:

My understanding is that most domestic inhibitors don't have antifreeze properties. Some do. I use this on my boat for the back boiler central heating and for the solar thermal hot water system, which does. Also uses propylene glycol, which is non toxic. Useful if you leave your boat unheated in winter to avoid having to drain the system.

Jen

Hi guys, 

Bit of a simpleton Q

The back boiler connects to caloriflower OK?

The Webasto has a top up tank Non pressurised OK?

The Isuzu is water jacket cooled and it heats water in calorifier. OK?

Both  central heating radiators seemed to work Ok last year but not today, very hot water circulating (engine running concurrently), but only warm and lukewarm in bedrom radiator. This is aceptable, though obviously not desirable, but not willing to mess about when not near a boatyard.

I have a container of Halfords Antifreze, is this likely to be in both engine and central heating. Obviously want to have everything ready for a Big Freeze, any tips ?

PS fire wnt out two hours after loading fire with Aldi smokeless nuts and closing up air vents, so I just left it as I need to top up batteries using engine today, solar limited this week.

PS I'm short of water in my tank  do I need to worry if stove on, and if CH on etc .....

 

Edited by LadyG
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I by your tank you mean the domestic water tank then it shoudl have no effect on the stove or central heating as long as the stove system (if it has a back boiler) and the Webasto header tanks have liquid in them.

 

Are you saying the bedroom radiator is only warm with just the engine running, the Webasto running, or both. If the former you are using the calorifier as  a heat exchanger so well done it frailly normal. If its either the last two options then as long as the header tank has liquid in it then as the first step I would suggest you need to bleed that radiator, topping up the header tank as required.

 

One can never be 100% sure but it is likely that the same antifreeze is in both systems, especially if you can see the colour in the liquid (not the rusty brown) and they are similar. remember to mix antifreeze with water BEFORE pouring into the haeder tank.

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35 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I by your tank you mean the domestic water tank then it shoudl have no effect on the stove or central heating as long as the stove system (if it has a back boiler) and the Webasto header tanks have liquid in them.

 

Are you saying the bedroom radiator is only warm with just the engine running, the Webasto running, or both. If the former you are using the calorifier as  a heat exchanger so well done it frailly normal. If its either the last two options then as long as the header tank has liquid in it then as the first step I would suggest you need to bleed that radiator, topping up the header tank as required.

 

One can never be 100% sure but it is likely that the same antifreeze is in both systems, especially if you can see the colour in the liquid (not the rusty brown) and they are similar. remember to mix antifreeze with water BEFORE pouring into the haeder tank.

@Tony Brooks I put the engine on and the Webasto early this a.m., (not in an area where it could annoy anyone) because I need to get batteries topped up , and heat the cabin.

The fridge is gobbling energy, so batteries not getting enough day to day. My cc winter plan was to travel twice a week  but cabin fever soon takes hold.

I can see the Webasto reservoir, and the engine cooling tank, but I don't see the back boiler reservoir

The stove back boiler, goes to one small radiator in loo and it also heats water in calorifier, tbere is a pressure relief valve, but it is quiescent.

I don't think the engine cooling system is connected to the radiators, or I would have noticed before.

I have switched engine off, and kept Webasto running to se if the bedroom rad heats up properly (I know there should be no difference): and there is no difference.

I will sample both engine and webasto coolant to test antifreeze, but I don't see any colour 

 

So there is no danger of expo,sion if I don't have a lot of water in domestic water tank. I checked back boiler pipes,stove off all night, pipes cold

Edited by LadyG
Domestic water tank
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11 minutes ago, LadyG said:

@Tony Brooks I put the engine on and the Webasto early this a.m., (not in an area where it could annoy anyone) because I need to get batteries topped up , and heat the cabin.

The fridge is gobbling energy, so batteries not getting enough day to day. My cc winter plan was to travel twice a week  but cabin fever soon takes hold.

I can see the Webasto reservoir, and the engine cooling tank, but I don't see the back boiler reservoir, there is one small radiator in loo and it heats water in calorifier, tbere is a pressure relief valve, but it is quiescent.

I don't think the engine cooling system is connected to the radiators, or I would have noticed before.

I have switched engine off, and kept Webasto running to se if the bedroom rad heats up properly (I know there should be no difference)

I will sample both engine and webasto coolant to test antifreeze, but I don't see any colour 

It is possible that the Webasto header tank is also header tank for the back boiler. Does your cauliflower have two heating coils? One heated by the engine loop and one by the webasto and back boiler? If so it is likely that it is a single header tank for the webasto and back boiler.

The engine loop doesn't need to be connected to the radiators to heat them. If the engine loop is heating the cauliflower, then that can become a heat source. Even with any pump off it is possible for the radiators to thermal syphon round the backboiler loop, removing heat from the hot water in the calorifer. All depends on the layout if this is possible, or not.

Do you have to turn a electric pump on when the stove is lit to circulate coolant through the back boiler?

Jen

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8 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

It is possible that the Webasto header tank is also header tank for the back boiler. Does your cauliflower have two heating coils? One heated by the engine loop and one by the webasto and back boiler? If so it is likely that it is a single header tank for the webasto and back boiler.

The engine loop doesn't need to be connected to the radiators to heat them. If the engine loop is heating the cauliflower, then that can become a heat source. Even with any pump off it is possible for the radiators to thermal syphon round the backboiler loop, removing heat from the hot water in the calorifer. All depends on the layout if this is possible, or not.

Do you have to turn a electric pump on when the stove is lit to circulate coolant through the back boiler?

Jen

I think you may be correct that the SF and Wbsto share a reservoir, though I am not sure    .

No electric pump for stove, the stove back boiler gravity feeds to loo rad, and to calorifier. I don't think the engine loops to the main rads, the circulation to the rads is with the Webasto. I think.

Two coils, I think.

Edited by LadyG
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Can the webasto provide hot water via the cauliflower too? Does the calorifier only have two coils? If so, then the webasto and backboiler circuits are connected and will probably only have one header tank.

6 minutes ago, LadyG said:

don't think the engine loops to the main rads, the circulation to the rads is with the Webasto. I think.

The engine doesn't need to be directly connected to the rads for the rads to get warm just with the engine running. Engine coolant heats calorifier water. The hot water in the calorifier then becomes a heat source and can slowly gravity circulate the coolant in the rads, even with the webasto off. Depends on if the pipe runs allow gravity circ. 

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