TheSaintlyOne Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 I'm looking at Marine Enterprises at some used engines as I feel it would be easier to replace the aging BMC 1500 to something more reliable and efficient. With a budget of £2500 which seems to give me a good range of choice. What would be a good replacement considering the following: 48ft Narrowboat HP requirements Keel cooled or Heat Exchanger in terms of providing additions like hot water etc (The BMC current set up uses an additional powered cooling fan much like a car with no external water intake) Brand including availability of spares, reliability etc Thanks in advance ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 Is £2500 just for the engine, or does it have to cover the installation costs as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheSaintlyOne said: With a budget of £2500 which seems to give me a good range of choice. Just remember that if you do not replace like-with-like you could need some considerable structural work doing to the hull to alter / cut out / replace the engine bearers. There will no doubt be modifications due to things like exhaust position, inlet manifold, wiring etc etc. In all likely hood you will also need a new gearbox (an engine does not normally include the gearbox) or at absolute best having an adapter plate made to convert the gearbox mounting bolts from 'BMC' spacing to whatever your new engine has. I would suggest spending no more than 50% of your budget on the engine (a recon gearbox could be approaching £1000) Edited January 14, 2020 by Alan de Enfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Brooks Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 Does your boat have a skin tank that is serviceable or is this to be fitted in the price for keel/tank cooling. If it has one is it large enough.Although I dislike them immensely for canal use it will probably be easer to fit a heat exchanger engine. My choice would be that Bukh DV36 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen-in-Wellies Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 Who is going to be doing the installation? If paying someone, then anything other than a direct replacement BMC 1500 is going to need a lot of fabrication work and alterations, which will get expensive. Or one of these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 minute ago, Jen-in-Wellies said: Who is going to be doing the installation? If paying someone, then anything other than a direct replacement BMC 1500 is going to need a lot of fabrication work and alterations, which will get expensive. Or one of these? But has the OP got a mast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSaintlyOne Posted January 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 £2500 for the engine which would normally include a gearbox 36 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said: Does your boat have a skin tank that is serviceable or is this to be fitted in the price for keel/tank cooling. If it has one is it large enough.Although I dislike them immensely for canal use it will probably be easer to fit a heat exchanger engine. My choice would be that Bukh DV36 Yes it does whether it's serviceable is questionable. I was leaning towards heat exchanger options tbf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 hour ago, TheSaintlyOne said: I'm looking at Marine Enterprises at some used engines as I feel it would be easier to replace the aging BMC 1500 to something more reliable and efficient. Is there anything actually wrong with the existing engine? Any replacement will not be noticeably more efficient, and if you are looking at a second hand engine, not necessarily more reliable either. If it is just generally worn out you can still get exchange reconditioned units, which would save all the alterations associated with a change of engine model. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSaintlyOne Posted January 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 It's smokes a hell of a lot!!!! And it's slow to start often taking a while I to get going In terms of direct replacement some of the options what are BMC direct replacements. Having come from sailboats is it not just a question of engine mounts and prop angles etc ????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Mack Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, TheSaintlyOne said: Having come from sailboats is it not just a question of engine mounts and prop angles etc ????? If you're lucky. But might involve changes to engine beds, possible replacement of sternshaft and prop, modification of cooling water arrangements, new exhaust, reconnecting engine controls and instruments, fuel line, engine electrics etc. And while you're at it and the old engine is out, you should take the opportunity to clean and repaint the engine bay. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, TheSaintlyOne said: Having come from sailboats is it not just a question of engine mounts and prop angles etc ????? They are certainly important characteristics, if they are different on your new engine that is when you will need steel fabrication work done if the existing engine bearers are (say) too narrow then they will have to be cut out to allow the engine to fit in between them, and new bearers welded into the hull at the correct width. The old exhaust manifold is unlikely to fit, a new exhaust manifold will probably need a new exhaust fabricating. Is the direction of rotation the same ? Lots more little things Edit to add David Mack has covered most of them. Edited January 14, 2020 by Alan de Enfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_fincher Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 12 minutes ago, TheSaintlyOne said: In terms of direct replacement some of the options what are BMC direct replacements. Another BMC, and probably not a lot else?? Find the right rebuilder, and I would have thought £2,500 would allow you to have a BMC rebuilt so it did start well, and didn't smoke much. (However much you spend though, I guarantee it will dribble some fluids into the bilge - if it doesn't do that, at least a little, it's probably not a BMC! ?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen-in-Wellies Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said: They are certainly important characteristics, if they are different on your new engine that is when you will need steel fabrication work done if the existing engine bearers are (say) too narrow then they will have to be cut out to allow the engine to fit in between them, and new bearers welded into the hull at the correct width. The old exhaust manifold is unlikely to fit, a new exhaust manifold will probably need a new exhaust fabricating. Is the direction of rotation the same ? Lots more little things Edit to add David Mack has covered most of them. And it is the little things that add up to lots of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSaintlyOne Posted January 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 http://marineenterprises.apolloduck.net/detail.phtml?id=386286 One option listed is the Thorneycroft that appears to be a BMC 1500D. I also know from experience that Betas tend to be drop in as they have adjustable feet designed for just that reason. What is the acceptable HP for a 48ft Narrowboat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 4 minutes ago, TheSaintlyOne said: What is the acceptable HP for a 48ft Narrowboat My 45 footer had a Lister LPWS4 which is rated at 39.5HP at WoT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onewheeler Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 Don't know about the BMC 1.5, but a Beta 38 was pretty much a drop-in replacement for our BMC1.8. The gearbox housing fitted, it just needed a new drive plate and some tweaks to the engine mounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmelly Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 5 minutes ago, TheSaintlyOne said: http://marineenterprises.apolloduck.net/detail.phtml?id=386286 One option listed is the Thorneycroft that appears to be a BMC 1500D. I also know from experience that Betas tend to be drop in as they have adjustable feet designed for just that reason. What is the acceptable HP for a 48ft Narrowboat 20 hp is more than enough unless you push a lot of flow with regular river use?. As Tony says the Bukh would be my first choice if I could find one for your price which I doubt. A superb, proper marine engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmelly Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 hour ago, Jen-in-Wellies said: Who is going to be doing the installation? If paying someone, then anything other than a direct replacement BMC 1500 is going to need a lot of fabrication work and alterations, which will get expensive. Or one of these? I dont think horses are allowed these days for general use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen-in-Wellies Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 2 minutes ago, mrsmelly said: I dont think horses are allowed these days for general use? You need to get the OK from CaRT for each trip, or regular service. See. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotEver Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 44 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said: You need to get the OK from CaRT for each trip, or regular service. Horses need a regular service? Who knew... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bee Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 Does the boat go OK? Are you looking for better shove or holding back power? If you are happy with its performance I would look at overhauling the present engine (And checking that the present propeller is a really good match for it as well, the propeller is the important thing, the engine is sort of secondary) Personally I would not choose a BMC 1.5 to go into a newbuild but if I had a boat and there was a running BMC in it I would happily live with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen-in-Wellies Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 1 hour ago, WotEver said: Horses need a regular service? Who knew... New shoes if they have less than 2mm of tread left and replenish the neatsfoot oil on their tack. ? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted January 14, 2020 Report Share Posted January 14, 2020 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said: New shoes if they have less than 2mm of tread left £75 every 5-6 weeks !!! (leisure use) Edited January 14, 2020 by Alan de Enfield 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boater Sam Posted January 15, 2020 Report Share Posted January 15, 2020 (edited) The Canaline engines are the same configuration as the BMC1.8D, not a lot different than the BMC1.5D, it is a drop in swap for the 1.8D. They are adaptable to fit your existing gearbox, that saves money. Now very popular with hire fleets. As I know that the 1.5D swap requires only the engine mount heights to be packed up I would suggest that this is the easiest and most straightforward swap However you will be very lucky to find a second hand one I would think and new will exceed your budget. Edited January 15, 2020 by Boater Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGoat Posted January 15, 2020 Report Share Posted January 15, 2020 15 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said: You need to get the OK from CaRT for each trip, or regular service. See. BW refused me permission many years ago - they said the canals weren't suitable for horses....... Just as well - a potty idea - Hire a boat borrow / build some cross trees Box my Irish Draught-cum hunter- failed showjumper all the way up from Sussex. The horse would have loved the job - he enjoyed working in harness....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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