Will new bill save red diesel?

[Midnight]

 

From the Queen's speech,  "..........the bill will also enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court."
Would that mean good news or has the fate of red diesel tax already been decided?

[WotEver]

31 minutes ago, Midnight said:

 

From the Queen's speech,  "..........the bill will also enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court."
Would that mean good news or has the fate of red diesel tax already been decided?

I suspect that the government may have a few more pressing issues at present. 

[dmr]

I suspect Mr Barnier and Co will say that we must meet most EEC standards and regulations if we want a good trade deal, and although Boris will negotiate many exceptions the EEC will probably win this one, it will just slip through.....unless somebody can find written proof that red diesel for boats really was  granted by Winson Churchill.

 

..............Dave

[mrsmelly]

56 minutes ago, Midnight said:

 

From the Queen's speech,  "..........the bill will also enable more British judges to depart from previous rulings of the EU's top court."
Would that mean good news or has the fate of red diesel tax already been decided?

As others have said I doubt such trivia will be even known by most of the peeps with any clout. Its the future and being a sovereign government that counts and that will have to be negotiated over a long period of time. much like chemotherapy can be ongoing over a period of years to eradicate disease. I spose this and other matters could be challenged over a period of years?

[peterboat]

Why? the government is committed to reduce carbon so why would they want us to use cheap red diesel? They also want us to have zero carbon/NOX/SOX emissions for inland waterways and diesel does not in any way achieve that

[Chewbacka]

My understanding, and I am often confused, is that the current law allows the current situation, so no problem with it continuing if we are out of the EU.

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, peterboat said:

Why? the government is committed to reduce carbon so why would they want us to use cheap red diesel? They also want us to have zero carbon/NOX/SOX emissions for inland waterways and diesel does not in any way achieve that

Diesel of any 'flavour' will be banned by 2050 and no new vehicles / engines by 2035.

[Chewbacka]

Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

Diesel of any 'flavour' will be banned by 2050 and no new vehicles / engines by 2035.

I won't be boating much after 2035 (assuming I live that long) so it doesn't bother me.

 

 

[Sea Dog]

35 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Diesel of any 'flavour' will be banned by 2050 and no new vehicles / engines by 2035.

This may well be true, but there is a growing realisation that there is a vast difference between old and new diesel engines. It's daft to tar all diesels with the same dirty brush, particularly when they can be so much better than petrol in terms of CO2 output.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Sea Dog said:

This may well be true, but there is a growing realisation that there is a vast difference between old and new diesel engines. It's daft to tar all diesels with the same dirty brush, particularly when they can be so much better than petrol in terms of CO2 output.

But ……………..

Petrol will be banned within the same period.

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Will new bill save red diesel?

 

I don't know about CWDF topic titles, but when a newspaper headline ends with a question mark the answer is almost always no!

[nb Innisfree]

Once ICE's are consigned to history it will be announced  'co- incidentally' that the climate 'emergency' is over. 

[john6767]

51 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Why? the government is committed to reduce carbon so why would they want us to use cheap red diesel? They also want us to have zero carbon/NOX/SOX emissions for inland waterways and diesel does not in any way achieve that

If we believe that red deisel is just DERV with red dye added, then I don’t see it makes any difference to emissions, just to the amount of tax revenue raised.

[Sea Dog]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

But ……………..

Petrol will be banned within the same period.

Yeah, that may be true too.... unless we realise we can't manage without it.  A noble aim and possibly essential, but human civilisation at the current population is utterly dependent upon hydrocarbons in its many forms.  The greatest plans of mice and men and all that.

 

[peterboat]

11 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

This may well be true, but there is a growing realisation that there is a vast difference between old and new diesel engines. It's daft to tar all diesels with the same dirty brush, particularly when they can be so much better than petrol in terms of CO2 output.

As fast as a new diesel comes out, fiddles to delete the emissions eqpt and give it more performance come out, plus new diesel sales are dropping monthly, and boats dont meet any real emission requirement they are totally filthy

[tree monkey]

3 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said:

Once ICE's are consigned to history it will be announced  'co- incidentally' that the climate 'emergency' is over. 

Just curious, what would be the reasons to ban ICE's then, I know some people think global climate change is a scam, if that's the case what would be the advantage to ban ICE.

[peterboat]

4 minutes ago, john6767 said:

If we believe that red deisel is just DERV with red dye added, then I don’t see it makes any difference to emissions, just to the amount of tax revenue raised.

Cost will reduce use and so emissions it will also force cleaner methods of propulsion upon us. My boat is electric propulsion powered by solar it does what I want it to do

[frangar]

1 minute ago, peterboat said:

Cost will reduce use and so emissions it will also force cleaner methods of propulsion upon us. My boat is electric propulsion powered by solar it does what I want it to do

But it’s heated by coal & kerosene as I recall....and ok if you want to move an hour a day when it’s sunny......so pretty unsuitable for most of us! 

[Richard10002]

1 hour ago, mrsmelly said:

As others have said I doubt such trivia will be even known by most of the peeps with any clout. Its the future and being a sovereign government that counts and that will have to be negotiated over a long period of time. much like chemotherapy can be ongoing over a period of years to eradicate disease. I spose this and other matters could be challenged over a period of years?

So.... having been almost the only disastrous thing to have affected anyone here, as a result of EU law, rules and regulations, it is now something that no-one is bothered about, and several here see it as a good thing.

 

Hypocritical as it will be, presumably this will be the subject of another of your, "as long as it is OUR government" excuse.... just like the much more serious judiciary one?  

[Sea Dog]

7 minutes ago, peterboat said:

new diesel sales are dropping monthly

In terms of private vehicle registrations, perhaps (based on the dirty diesel issue, which was about old diesel) but how about commercial vehicles?  For distance driving, economic modern diesel is probably about as good as it gets at the moment.  I know you love electric propulsion, but how does the family in a terraced Street plug in their EV?  Can the grid cope with everyone having an EV?  I too hope for a better solution - it just isn't here yet and I'm not sure that whatever we do with private road vehicles will reduce our hydrocarbon dependency by much at all.

[peterboat]

2 minutes ago, frangar said:

But it’s heated by coal & kerosene as I recall....and ok if you want to move an hour a day when it’s sunny......so pretty unsuitable for most of us! 

And wood, plus it can go 10 hours on battery power and when its sunny all day as well, but dont worry when diesel is £1.60 a litre will people still be as keen to cruise all day every day? or will they choose a more relaxing cruising pattern, like it or not change is happening, me I will stick with solar and the VAWT plus the occasional use of kero when the sun dont shine and the wind dont blow for the production of lecce

[Richard10002]

4 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

In terms of private vehicle registrations, perhaps (based on the dirty diesel issue, which was about old diesel) but how about commercial vehicles?  For distance driving, economic modern diesel is probably about as good as it gets at the moment.  I know you love electric propulsion, but how does the family in a terraced Street plug in their EV?  Can the grid cope with everyone having an EV?  I too hope for a better solution - it just isn't here yet and I'm not sure that whatever we do with private road vehicles will reduce our hydrocarbon dependency by much at all.

I still struggle with the fact that electricity still has to be made somehow, and somewhere, and there will be some kind of environmental price to pay, such that all we are doing is moving the location, and possibly the timing, of the pollution.

 

As for nuclear, unless I have missed something, this is merely storing up a major environmental problem for the future.

 

 

[peterboat]

3 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

In terms of private vehicle registrations, perhaps (based on the dirty diesel issue, which was about old diesel) but how about commercial vehicles?  For distance driving, economic modern diesel is probably about as good as it gets at the moment.  I know you love electric propulsion, but how does the family in a terraced Street plug in their EV?  Can the grid cope with everyone having an EV?  I too hope for a better solution - it just isn't here yet and I'm not sure that whatever we do with private road vehicles will reduce our hydrocarbon dependency by much at all.

I agree. have a quick google though and you will see that the truck makers are making lecce trucks as town/city centers will be a no go for diesel. as for on street charging we had this discussion before and pop up charging points are a reality already so who knows what the future holds no flying, no boating? I for one think its to late without massive change and people would rather die than change

Just now, Richard10002 said:

I still struggle with the fact that electricity still has to be made somehow, and somewhere, and there will be some kind of environmental price to pay, such that all we are doing is moving the location, and possibly the timing, of the pollution.

 

As for nuclear, unless I have missed something, this is merely storing up a major environmental problem for the future.

 

 

Wind turbines Richard google how electricity is being produced today and carbon based production is dropping all the time, I still think its to little to late though

[nb Innisfree]

20 minutes ago, tree monkey said:

Just curious, what would be the reasons to ban ICE's then, I know some people think global climate change is a scam, if that's the case what would be the advantage to ban ICE.

To reduce unhealthy  pollutants, I don't think global climate change is a scam, just the emergency bit. 

[nb Innisfree]

14 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

In terms of private vehicle registrations, perhaps (based on the dirty diesel issue, which was about old diesel) but how about commercial vehicles?  For distance driving, economic modern diesel is probably about as good as it gets at the moment.  I know you love electric propulsion, but how does the family in a terraced Street plug in their EV?  Can the grid cope with everyone having an EV?  I too hope for a better solution - it just isn't here yet and I'm not sure that whatever we do with private road vehicles will reduce our hydrocarbon dependency by much at all.

Kerbside charge points are viable and the grid already has enough capacity to cope with EVs, just needs reorganising.