Rochdale Canal- Scowcroft and Punchbowl lock

[PaulJ]

Can anyone on here give me some info on the current state of-

Scowcroft Lock 61 which is shown as 'both gates not being fully operational'

and Punchbowl lock 40 which is shown as only having one gate working (this notice was dated 14/06/18) and I had hoped this had been sorted by now. Optimism rules ?

Have tried  phoning CRT but they cant tell me how wide 'not fully operational' actually is and I wanted to get a 10ft beam through. To be fair Im not expecting to get through lock 40 but you never know...

Thanks in advance

[dmr]

Lock 61 might have a big problem. I have heard that the failure is a movement of the lock structure rather than just a gate failure, I think the bottom has deformed or bulged up. I suspect that unless something is planned for this winter it might be next winter before it gets fixed. Only a very small number of widebeams travel from the Manchester end each year so as long as a narrowboat can pass this repair might not be on the top of the list.

 

..............Dave

[Mike Todd]

My photos show that in August this lock was labelled 'Single boats only' and I think was similarly labelled as far back as 2011. So no chance of much change in the near future! We also passed through Lock 61 that day and I cannot recall any difficulty - indeed our log gives that it took us ten minutes so cannot have been much to impede us. Hence any issue there now is recent.

[Mac of Cygnet]

There's a big difference between 'single boats only' (there are a couple at the other end of the Rochdale)  and one gate not opening at all.  Especially for a 10ft wide boat that the OP has.

[PaulJ]

19 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

We also passed through Lock 61 that day and I cannot recall any difficulty - indeed our log gives that it took us ten minutes so cannot have been much to impede us. Hence any issue there now is recent.

The restriction notice was dated 15/05/19 on Scowcroft 61- I last passed through there about a year ago on a narrowboat (sharing the lock) and seemed  to remember it opening about halfway on the side I was on. But my memory is crap to be honest.

Punchbowl lock 40 I have no recollection of..

[Jim Riley]

I live near the summit of the Rochdale, don't recall seeing any problems on lock 40, if I can find time I'll pop over and have a look. 

[PaulJ]

5 minutes ago, Jim Riley said:

I live near the summit of the Rochdale, don't recall seeing any problems on lock 40, if I can find time I'll pop over and have a look. 

Thanks Jim. Restriction notice (14/06/18) says-

The offside tailgate has dropped and cannot be operated.  Unfortunately this means that broad beam boats cannot navigate the lock.

We are arranging for investigations to be carried out and a plan for works to repair the gate.

[matty40s]

39 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

My photos show that in August this lock was labelled 'Single boats only' and I think was similarly labelled as far back as 2011. So no chance of much change in the near future! We also passed through Lock 61 that day and I cannot recall any difficulty - indeed our log gives that it took us ten minutes so cannot have been much to impede us. Hence any issue there now is recent.

Here's from Alan and Cath Finchers blog from the Summer...

 

. Then we got to Scowcroft Lock No 61. One of the gates wouldn't open. I was completely puzzled, it didn't seem to be jammed in any way, there was nothing on the bottom of the lock, along the cill, which might have stopped the gate moving. I have never seen a lock gate so firmly fixed before.
 

Until Lock 61 decided to completely halt our progress.

Only having one gate isn't a problem. One boat goes in, then pushes over to the other side, then the second boat goes in. However, once Tasmania was in the lock, and Flamingo tried to enter the lock she wedged firmly in the gates, just behind her bow. She was completely stuck.
 

This exerts huge forces, but still the gate didn't move at all.

We couldn't go in, and we tried reversing out, but couldn't move. We got everyone tugging on the fixed gate - it wouldn't move. We tried 'bouncing' the other gate - pushing rhythmically on the balance beam so that the gate bounces. Sometimes it's possible to dislodge a bit of rubbish that is caught behind the gate and get another centimetre or so of width.

Then we tried a 'Spanish windlass' to open the fixed gate a bit. Then on the open gate. Nothing we did made the gates move at all and nothing gave us any more width. 

 

Moving again.

I went back to the lock behind us, where Daphne and Swan were coming up, and explained the situation. "Oh, that lock's been broken for ages," they said, "it's supposed to be being fixed sometime

[dmr]

We went down the day before the working boats came up. The gate was stuck then and CRT were there and I got the impression that it had only just failed.

The Rochdale is a bit different to other canals as in some ways its not fully restored. Other restorations are done bit by bit and take lifetimes to open. The Rochdale was made "just navigable" along its entire length which I think was the much better approach, but it could really do with a second wave of funding to get it finished. A number of locks have subsided and are "single boat only" and I can't see these getting sorted for many years, though you can get two narrowboats through some of them if you are brave and careful .

 

................Dave

[PaulJ]

Thanks everyone. Thats a resounding NO then ?

To be fair the restriction does say so in a roundabout way-

Unfortunately, an issue with Lock 61 offside gate hinge is preventing both gates from being fully operable. 

Customer to only use the towpath side bottom gate and if they encounter any difficulties to contact the office for assistance.

 The lock is restricted due to this and can only be used by one narrowboat at a time. Our engineers are planning a repair to the gate, and we will be able to provide further details when they have finished their investigations.

[David Mack]

You won't get through the M62 culvert with a wide boat as the hydraulics on the floating towpath are broken and it can't be moved.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/notices/15669-m62-tunnel-crossing-rochdale-canal

 

[PaulJ]

4 minutes ago, David Mack said:

You won't get through the M62 culvert with a wide boat as the hydraulics on the floating towpath are broken and it can't be moved.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/notices/15669-m62-tunnel-crossing-rochdale-canal

 

Thanks David-have given up on that one now as undoable. 

[magpie patrick]

13 hours ago, David Mack said:

You won't get through the M62 culvert with a wide boat as the hydraulics on the floating towpath are broken and it can't be moved.

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/notices/15669-m62-tunnel-crossing-rochdale-canal

 

Okay - I'm intrigued, how does the floating towpath thingy work? Clearly it isn't just a pontoon secured with ropes that can be pulled out of the way.

 

I recall some of the works on the HNC were over-engineered - hydraulic pumps for gates that later were replaced with cranked balance beams for example

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, magpie patrick said:

Okay - I'm intrigued, how does the floating towpath thingy work? Clearly it isn't just a pontoon secured with ropes that can be pulled out of the way.

 

I recall some of the works on the HNC were over-engineered - hydraulic pumps for gates that later were replaced with cranked balance beams for example

Yes it is over engineered. It has a series of jacks which are presumably deployed to stop it rocking. There is a special mooring bay in the towpath for it to be stored in when moved to allow a wide boat through. I also think it has an outboard motor bracket on the end so it can be propelled the few yards between the tunnel and the mooring. A simple pontoon with ropes, and perhaps a padlock and chain would have been simpler, cheaper and more reliable.

Pictures from Pennine Waterways.