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Yorkshire circuit - two routes


Philip

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Just thinking ahead for a trip in Spring/Summer (ie. long days), starting from Nantwich how long would it take to do either the Leeds and Liverpool route or the Huddersfield Narrow route to Sowerby Bridge and then back to Nantwich along the Rochdale and Bridgewater?

 

I'd probably be single-handed and in a GRP, so any further things I'd need to take note of with these in mind?

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Firstly, you can't take a GRP through Standedge tunnel, so the Huddersfield Narrow is a no go.

 

Secondly, your route on the Leeds/Liverpool to Skipton has a few problem bridges for a single handed boater, but they are do-able, however, after Skipton there are 39 swing bridges most of which have the opening gear on the non towpath side and, whilst it is fun and a challenge to do 1 or 2, 39 gets a bit tedious, so much so that I rang a friend who came up to help me to Leeds.

 

There are also I think 2 bridges on the Rochdale which are impossible to do on your own, although for them, you could just sit and wait for another boat.

 

Hope that is some use.

 

Kevin

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Thanks for that! A shame about Standedge then, as that sounds like the easiest of the three routes and would have been an experience going through. Is the GRP ban for good reason or just to cover all extremities? How long would it take to do the L&L to Leeds and then back to Nantwich the same route? Swing bridges galore and doing Wigan twice might be tiring but it'd at least be do-able.

Edited by Philip
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According to 'Canalplan' Nantwich to Leeds is 119 miles with 141 locks and would take 10 days at 7 hours per day

 

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/places-to-visit/standedge-tunnel-and-visitor-centre/boating-through-standedge-tunnel

 

https://canalplan.org.uk/cgi-bin/canal.cgi

 

How about Nantwich to Leeds to Castleford to Rochdale canal to Ashton canal to Macclesfield canal back to Nantwich.

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37 minutes ago, Kendorr said:

There are also I think 2 bridges on the Rochdale which are impossible to do on your own, although for them, you could just sit and wait for another boat.

Which ones are you thinking of?  I don't remember any that would be impossible to do singlehanded.

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27 minutes ago, Philip said:

Is the GRP ban for good reason or just to cover all extremities?

The tunnel isn't lined through long stretches, just blasted through the rock. There are sticky out bits of rock below water level that might hole a GRP hull. Steel and wooden hulls only.

 

Jen

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25 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

Which ones are you thinking of?  I don't remember any that would be impossible to do singlehanded.

There was one which the entire bridge lifts with the mechanism on the non towpath side, can't remember exactly where as I've only done the route once myself.

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34 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

Which ones are you thinking of?  I don't remember any that would be impossible to do singlehanded.

Theres the vertical lift bridge, and two swing bridges between Rochdale and Smithy bridge. All have the landings on the towpath side but are operated from the offside.

However in a deeper drafted narrowboat some of the towpath side landings are pretty much impossible too  :) . The swing bridges can sometimes be hard work and need more than one person to swing them, other times they are easy. I don't know why.

More importantly sections of the Rochdale through outer Manchester are heavily locked and grim and really need a crew of three to get through in reasonable time without doing an overnight stop in a non ideal place, though people do do it singlehanded.

 

.................Dave

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One lift bridge and three (I think) swing bridges on the Rochdale, all of them operated from the offside. Grimshaw Lane lift bridge carries a busy road and is power operated and was installed as part of the restoration. It is surprising that the operating console wasn't installed on the towpath side, as it would make operation easier. That said I think it can be done single handed - you just have to moor (or at least take a rope ashore) on the offside either side of the bridge, while you raise and lower the bridge. Similarly with the swing bridges.

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3 minutes ago, David Mack said:

That said I think it can be done single handed - you just have to moor (or at least take a rope ashore) on the offside either side of the bridge, while you raise and lower the bridge. Similarly with the swing bridges.

That's my recollection of them.  

 

They require a bit of faffing with lines but they are not impossible to singlehand.  

 

7 minutes ago, dmr said:

More importantly sections of the Rochdale through outer Manchester are heavily locked and grim and really need a crew of three to get through in reasonable time without doing an overnight stop in a non ideal place, though people do do it singlehanded.

Yeah, more bodies certainly help on the locks!

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4 minutes ago, dmr said:

Theres the vertical lift bridge, and two swing bridges between Rochdale and Smithy bridge. 

Lift bridge is at Middleton, between the Boat & Horses and the Rose of Lancaster. Third swing bridge is on the Yorkshire/Lancashire border just east of the summit.

4 minutes ago, dmr said:

 

More importantly sections of the Rochdale through outer Manchester are heavily locked and grim and really need a crew of three to get through in reasonable time without doing an overnight stop in a non ideal place, though people do do it singlehanded.

 

Heavily locked and urban, but not really grim.  Came up a month ago with just two of us, on a full length deep drafted boat and made it from 3 locks up the Ashton to the River Irk aqueduct in a day,  and then to Littleborough the next day, although single handing would be quite hard.

 

CRT may be able to organise volunteer assistance on the ''Manchester 18' if you give them a but of notice.

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4 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Lift bridge is at Middleton, between the Boat & Horses and the Rose of Lancaster. Third swing bridge is on the Yorkshire/Lancashire border just east of the summit.

 

Heavily locked and urban, but not really grim.  Came up a month ago with just two of us, on a full length deep drafted boat and made it from 3 locks up the Ashton to the River Irk aqueduct in a day,  and then to Littleborough the next day, although single handing would be quite hard.

 

CRT may be able to organise volunteer assistance on the ''Manchester 18' if you give them a but of notice.

 

Newton Heath is pretty grim, and the recently raised major security fencing round the pub gives some idea of what to expect from some of the locals, though as always most are pleased to see boats. We have had no trouble here but other boaters have, and ideally the boat should not be left unattended whilst you are setting a lock. Lads on motorbikes can take stuff off the roof and get away very quickly :) .

 

The Warland swing bridge would be easy for a single hander as it right next to a lock.

 

The lock volunteers from CRT are a huge help, we did New Islington to the Boat and Horses so quickly that we all decided to carry on up the Slattocks flight and still had time for several beers in the Ship before it even got dark.

 

............Dave

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1 hour ago, Philip said:

Just thinking ahead for a trip in Spring/Summer (ie. long days), starting from Nantwich how long would it take to do either the Leeds and Liverpool route or the Huddersfield Narrow route to Sowerby Bridge and then back to Nantwich along the Rochdale and Bridgewater?

 

I'd probably be single-handed and in a GRP, so any further things I'd need to take note of with these in mind?

Experience tells me from Nantwich you could do the circuit via the L&L & Rochdale in about 18 days but that wouldn't be enjoyable as those daily distances are based on when I've been moving the boat to get somewhere or to get back to base. There's the Wigan flight crew who may help you there. As there's not too many landing stages I think it would be an ordeal single-handed. The L&L swing bridges will slow you down but there's usually plenty of friendly boats moving so you should be able to team up for many of those. A few of the electric ones have had the control panel moved to the towpath side. The Rochdale is tough by yourself but as the locks are doubled you may get lucky there too. I haven't been over that way for a couple of years so there may be help from Volunteers now. There was a really good one on the descent into Manchester helping the single handed boat in front of us all the way from lock 65 last time I was down there. There's usually a few boats moving off from the Rose of Lancaster pub to Manchester around the same time so if you leave with them Grimshaw Lane lift bridge shouldn't be too much of an issue either. 

 

Both the L&L and the Rochdale are very spectacular waterways with some great places to stop so you really need time to enjoy them.

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39 minutes ago, dmr said:

Theres the vertical lift bridge, and two swing bridges between Rochdale and Smithy bridge. All have the landings on the towpath side but are operated from the offside.

However in a deeper drafted narrowboat some of the towpath side landings are pretty much impossible too  :) . The swing bridges can sometimes be hard work and need more than one person to swing them, other times they are easy. I don't know why.

More importantly sections of the Rochdale through outer Manchester are heavily locked and grim and really need a crew of three to get through in reasonable time without doing an overnight stop in a non ideal place, though people do do it singlehanded.

 

.................Dave

The 'grim' is now rather dated. yes, it is urban and shares the same characteristics as many others that pass through former industrial areas and there are a few specific issues arising from its history, but I would want to avoid putting people off: it is not that bad! (and will get better the more it is used)

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21 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

The 'grim' is now rather dated. yes, it is urban and shares the same characteristics as many others that pass through former industrial areas and there are a few specific issues arising from its history, but I would want to avoid putting people off: it is not that bad! (and will get better the more it is used)

The Rochdale up through Manchester is the worse bit of canal on the entire system, its even worse than the Walsall canal. Its fine to do with a bit of preparation, in particular early starts, doing it in easy stages, and suitable tools to get stuff off the prop. We have met a few boats who have tackled it without knowing what to expect and as a result have hated it and vowed never to do the Rochdale again. The rest of the Rohdale is possibly the best canal anywhere so I don't want Manchester to put people off.

I note the K&A is similar in some ways and we have met so many "never again" boaters. The trip up the Kennet when its flowing hard (without knowing what to expect) puts some boaters into such a negative frame of mind that they turn back before they even get to the best bits.

 

...............Dave

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13 minutes ago, dmr said:

The Rochdale up through Manchester is the worse bit of canal on the entire system, its even worse than the Walsall canal. Its fine to do with a bit of preparation, in particular early starts, doing it in easy stages, and suitable tools to get stuff off the prop. We have met a few boats who have tackled it without knowing what to expect and as a result have hated it and vowed never to do the Rochdale again. The rest of the Rohdale is possibly the best canal anywhere so I don't want Manchester to put people off.

I note the K&A is similar in some ways and we have met so many "never again" boaters. The trip up the Kennet when its flowing hard (without knowing what to expect) puts some boaters into such a negative frame of mind that they turn back before they even get to the best bits.

 

...............Dave

But I'm guessing the eastern end of the K&A is in more pleasant surroundings than the run into Manchester on the Rochdale?

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3 hours ago, dmr said:

The Rochdale up through Manchester is the worse bit of canal on the entire system, its even worse than the Walsall canal. Its fine to do with a bit of preparation, in particular early starts, doing it in easy stages, and suitable tools to get stuff off the prop. We have met a few boats who have tackled it without knowing what to expect and as a result have hated it and vowed never to do the Rochdale again. The rest of the Rohdale is possibly the best canal anywhere so I don't want Manchester to put people off.

I note the K&A is similar in some ways and we have met so many "never again" boaters. The trip up the Kennet when its flowing hard (without knowing what to expect) puts some boaters into such a negative frame of mind that they turn back before they even get to the best bits.

 

...............Dave

I still do not recognise that description - we last worked up from New Islington to Irk Aqueduct in August - see http://nbalchemy.blogspot.com/2019/08/irk-aqueduct.html

 

The only comments we made then that relate to the description were that one section is very shallow, possibly as a result of inadequate work during restoration and also that one passerby commented that an adjacent area was a 'problem estate'. You will also note that at the time we did not feel that this had any impact on our journey and that local folk were just like anywhere else, the vast majority happy to chat.

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I moor near the Warland swing bridge, east of summit. My wife has Narcolepsy with Cataplexy so often it means I am single handing. (ooer missus), mostly on the Eastern side but I have done the bridges solo.

It just takes a bit of time but all do able. Just carry a big stick to keep the summit pass wolves at bay. Once you are through to Rose of Lancaster it's lovely, then Rochdale is a bit grim from Castleton to the first swing Bridge. There's a often a bible study group at Oldham Road who will share their Communion Stella with you. Once past there it's great. I started with grp up and down there. 

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When we went up the Rochdale we found even the Manchester section less horrible than the Ashton, and had no problems with vandals or stuff on the prop. Quite a few bridge trolls emitting sweet-smelling smoke but they were friendly ?

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39 minutes ago, IanD said:

When we went up the Rochdale we found even the Manchester section less horrible than the Ashton, and had no problems with vandals or stuff on the prop. Quite a few bridge trolls emitting sweet-smelling smoke but they were friendly ?

Again, we cruised up the Ashton this summer (see http://nbalchemy.blogspot.com/2019/07/fairfield.html) and our experience was very different.  There is now very little industry close to the canal between Ducie Street and Fairfield. Again, we had a warning about one area between Fairfield  and Dukinfield but no adverse experience ourselves. Were it not for knowing that in the past this canal has had a very difficult reputation, I would not even think of advising anyone against coming this way.

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58 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

Again, we cruised up the Ashton this summer (see http://nbalchemy.blogspot.com/2019/07/fairfield.html) and our experience was very different.  There is now very little industry close to the canal between Ducie Street and Fairfield. Again, we had a warning about one area between Fairfield  and Dukinfield but no adverse experience ourselves. Were it not for knowing that in the past this canal has had a very difficult reputation, I would not even think of advising anyone against coming this way.

I didn't mean there were any problems with the Ashton, same for us as the Rochdale (none), I meant the Ashton is not a pleasant canal to travel along. Neither posed us any real problems, unless you count the tiny police-taped-off section on the Rochdale where apparently somebody had been stabbed the previous night... (which was only a problem in that we worried a bit).

 

Same as all the warnings about Stoke or Manchester or [fill in your area of choice], we've never had any problems. Except once where the boat was untied overnight, after we'd almost won the best pumpkin competition at the pub (we wuz robbed) and then left it on top of the boat overnight, which was probably taken as provocative by the (Boat Inn, Stockton) pub locals...

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On 18/11/2019 at 18:22, Jim Riley said:

There's a often a bible study group at Oldham Road who will share their Communion Stella with you.

I've met these wonderful chaps three times. Always friendly, pick up their own litter, help you through the lock and offer a swig of whatever is in the bottle in the brown paper bag. They should be given a civic honour of some kind. Unlike the Mayor of Rochdale who should be given a certificate for the scruffiest canal in Britain and made to clean up all the fast food packaging and mattresses that usually wrap around the passing boater's propeller. 

Edited by Midnight
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On 18/11/2019 at 11:13, Jen-in-Wellies said:

The tunnel isn't lined through long stretches, just blasted through the rock. There are sticky out bits of rock below water level that might hole a GRP hull. Steel and wooden hulls only.

 

Jen

As can be seen on Canal Boat Diaries  - broadcast yesterday on BBC1

 

The order these are being broadcast makes no sense to me: today it was Shardlow to Stoke on Trent

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On 18/11/2019 at 13:08, dmr said:

The Rochdale up through Manchester is the worse bit of canal on the entire system, its even worse than the Walsall canal. Its fine to do with a bit of preparation, in particular early starts, doing it in easy stages, and suitable tools to get stuff off the prop. We have met a few boats who have tackled it without knowing what to expect and as a result have hated it and vowed never to do the Rochdale again. The rest of the Rohdale is possibly the best canal anywhere so I don't want Manchester to put people off.

I note the K&A is similar in some ways and we have met so many "never again" boaters. The trip up the Kennet when its flowing hard (without knowing what to expect) puts some boaters into such a negative frame of mind that they turn back before they even get to the best bits.

 

...............Dave

I can't believe anyone seriously compares the K&A to the Rochdale?!? I wouldn't have thought the type of boaters that turn back before the summit of the K&A would even make it to the start of the Rochdale ??‍♂️

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3 hours ago, Dave123 said:

I can't believe anyone seriously compares the K&A to the Rochdale?!? I wouldn't have thought the type of boaters that turn back before the summit of the K&A would even make it to the start of the Rochdale ??‍♂️

Perhaps that's as well. Let the wolves go hungry. 

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