Alde comfort 2920 Problem

[Bjarki06]

Hi all!

 

we recently had a problem with our Alde boiler where we felt a leak (although we didn’t think it was from the boiler at first) and then it started making gurgling noises. Eventually we heard a pop and fluid gushing out into our wardrobe. Looking at the boiler we saw that the expansion tank was empty and the circulation pump at the back had worked its way free of the copper pipe leading into the boiler. We were told by a plumber we called that the thermostat probably failed causing the problem.

 

we’re looking to fix this ourselves as we have very little money at the moment and I was told that what we need to get the pipe back into the pump and for it to stay is CT1 sealant. Does anyone know if this sounds right and if once this is done we can just fill the system back up from the top and run it again?

 

attached is a picture of the pump and the copper pipe it has come free from

[MtB]

 

Blimey!

 

I'd say that is a pump designed to be connected with flexible rubber 'heater' hose (probably 3/4") and Jubilee clips.

 

Looks to me as though someone has bodged copper pipe to the inside of the inlet and outlet spigots and I'm not surprised  one has come loose.  The pump tails are not designed to be connected to copper pipe. 

 

 

What is the make and model of that pump?

 

 

 

[bizzard]

Looks like a bit of the black top nozzle has a bit broken off.

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Looks like a bit of the black top nozzle has a bit broken off.

 

Not from here it doesn't, on a 21" screen!

 

 

 

[bizzard]

1 minute ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Not from here it doesn't, on a 21" screen!

 

 

 

Strange. Mines 15''

[MtB]

Just now, bizzard said:

Strange. Mines 15''

 

Blimey you have a big phone!

 

 

[bizzard]

Just now, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Blimey you have a big phone!

 

 

Same as Dom Joly' HELLO!!!!

[bizzard]

[MtB]

I'M IN THE CINEMA!!!!

[dor]

24 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Looks like a bit of the black top nozzle has a bit broken off.

I thought the same initially, but on a second look I think it just looks that way as the bit of copper pipe is in front of the rubber pipe, obscuring part of it.

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, dor said:

I thought the same initially, but on a second look I think it just looks that way as the bit of copper pipe is in front of the rubber pipe, obscuring part of it.

 

By Jove he's got it!!

 

 

[alan_fincher]

It's tempting to think that if you manage to sort out the separated joint to the left, there is a real danger of the same thing happening to the one at the bottom!

Was there nothing ever trying to hold either in?

 

It certainly doesn't look like it s intender jut to have copper shoved in it, and I'm not exactly surprised it has come apart.

[Tony Brooks]

That is not the normal 2xxx   Alde pump. The Alde pump sits inside the header tank at the top of the heater.  I think its an owner  fitment and I think it looks something of a bodge.

 

If the black stubs are hard plastic I would be looking to put a short length of rubber heater hose onto the pipe and over the stub secured with two hose clips so it would be far more difficult for the pipe to pull out.

 

On the bright side you have now probably learned that household tradesmen are usually no use on boat equipment. You will normally get far better advice here.

[Boater Sam]

I would guess that the roughened copper pipe has been superglued into the plastic pump originally, its a cock up.

[dmr]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

That is not the normal 2xxx   Alde pump. The Alde pump sits inside the header tank at the top of the heater.  I think its an owner  fitment and I think it looks something of a bodge.

 

If the black stubs are hard plastic I would be looking to put a short length of rubber heater hose onto the pipe and over the stub secured with two hose clips so it would be far more difficult for the pipe to pull out.

 

On the bright side you have now probably learned that household tradesmen are usually no use on boat equipment. You will normally get far better advice here.

The Alde pump is a little bit pathetic so this looks like a separate circulating pump fitted remotely, not inside the Alde.

 

...............Dave

[Bjarki06]

Thanks for your help everyone! I think the heater hose and jubilee clips is the long term solution but as we are completely skint at the moment we had to just use the sealant and some gorilla tape to hold it in place so we can get hot water for a few weeks at least. Unfortunately while the pump now works fine and is circulating water we’re not getting any hot water through the taps. Even with the engine running it only heats the water to lukewarm.

 

I’ve closed the isolation valve to the radiators but even with that closed and running the boiler and engine together for almost an hour we have just lukewarm water coming through the taps.

 

there are two switches on the wall marked ‘water pump’ and they are both on. One is for the domestic water pump and I think the other one is for the circulation pump.

 

as someone pointed out the pump isn’t broken, the pipe was just disconnected from it in that photo.

 

if anyone has any experience with this boiler (also comfort 2928) and how to get hot water out of it i’d Very much appreciate input!

 

thanks in advance

[Bjarki06]

On 14/10/2019 at 19:09, alan_fincher said:

It's tempting to think that if you manage to sort out the separated joint to the left, there is a real danger of the same thing happening to the one at the bottom!

Was there nothing ever trying to hold either in?

 

It certainly doesn't look like it s intender jut to have copper shoved in it, and I'm not exactly surprised it has come apart.

Nope! Nothing but super glue I think. No wonder it came apart a few months after we bought the boat. I’m hoping the sealant I used will be better but it seems heater hose should be the long term solution from yours and others suggestions here. As someone else mentioned I definitely got better advice here than from most plumbers!

[MtB]

2 hours ago, Bjarki06 said:

but as we are completely skint at the moment we had to just use the sealant and some gorilla tape to hold it in place

 

Boat + skint is never a good combination....

 

 

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Bjarki06 said:

Thanks for your help everyone! I think the heater hose and jubilee clips is the long term solution but as we are completely skint at the moment we had to just use the sealant and some gorilla tape to hold it in place so we can get hot water for a few weeks at least. Unfortunately while the pump now works fine and is circulating water we’re not getting any hot water through the taps. Even with the engine running it only heats the water to lukewarm.

 

I’ve closed the isolation valve to the radiators but even with that closed and running the boiler and engine together for almost an hour we have just lukewarm water coming through the taps.

 

there are two switches on the wall marked ‘water pump’ and they are both on. One is for the domestic water pump and I think the other one is for the circulation pump.

 

as someone pointed out the pump isn’t broken, the pipe was just disconnected from it in that photo.

 

if anyone has any experience with this boiler (also comfort 2928) and how to get hot water out of it i’d Very much appreciate input!

 

thanks in advance

I assume the Alde heats a calorifier (hot water tank), and that in turn feeds the hot taps. There should be a pipe running from the top of the boiler to the upper of two connections on the side (or end if horizontal) of the calorifier, and a return pipe from the lower connection to the bottom of the boiler. One of these pipes will be via the pump. The upper connection should get hot within a few minutes of firing up the boiler. Is it?

[Bjarki06]

1 hour ago, David Mack said:

I assume the Alde heats a calorifier (hot water tank), and that in turn feeds the hot taps. There should be a pipe running from the top of the boiler to the upper of two connections on the side (or end if horizontal) of the calorifier, and a return pipe from the lower connection to the bottom of the boiler. One of these pipes will be via the pump. The upper connection should get hot within a few minutes of firing up the boiler. Is it?

I actually felt it earlier when I had the boiler fired up and no it didn’t seem to be hot. I just assumed the pipe was very well insulated though. What I don’t understand is that the boiler heats the radiators just fine. 

 

I also dont understand how if the boiler is full of water and antifreeze that would provide any hot water that wasn’t toxic unless the boiler has a second tank that heats drinkable water and passes it through.

 

when we first got the boat in June we never seemed to have trouble getting hot water for a shower in the morning but maybe that was because we were travelling and running the engine more and now we’re in a marina. Even so when we run the engine on tickover for two hours the water is only lukewarm.

 

I was hoping to fix it myself as I’ve been able to get the boiler running again but i might just need to get a plumber to take a look at the whole system as I have a suspicion there may be air in the calorifier or something and I’m not sure where the calorifier is on this boat.

 

thanks for your help

[frangar]

5 hours ago, Bjarki06 said:

I actually felt it earlier when I had the boiler fired up and no it didn’t seem to be hot. I just assumed the pipe was very well insulated though. What I don’t understand is that the boiler heats the radiators just fine. 

 

I also dont understand how if the boiler is full of water and antifreeze that would provide any hot water that wasn’t toxic unless the boiler has a second tank that heats drinkable water and passes it through.

 

when we first got the boat in June we never seemed to have trouble getting hot water for a shower in the morning but maybe that was because we were travelling and running the engine more and now we’re in a marina. Even so when we run the engine on tickover for two hours the water is only lukewarm.

 

I was hoping to fix it myself as I’ve been able to get the boiler running again but i might just need to get a plumber to take a look at the whole system as I have a suspicion there may be air in the calorifier or something and I’m not sure where the calorifier is on this boat.

 

thanks for your help

If neither the engine or the Alde are heating the water then I suggest the immediate problem is calorifier related...sometimes they have a blender valve on the output which may be faulty or need adjusting. 
 

I suggest you find where it’s located and report back what pipes are hot etc. You are looking for a cylinder that looks like a domestic hot water tank...it might be mounted horizontally or vertically. 

[Tony Brooks]

I would suspect the calorifier is plumed in parallel with the radiators (as if it were just another radiator) and the boiler calorifier coil has air in it or there is a selector valve for hot water only or heat plus hot water that has got mis-set.

[frangar]

20 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I would suspect the calorifier is plumed in parallel with the radiators (as if it were just another radiator) and the boiler calorifier coil has air in it or there is a selector valve for hot water only or heat plus hot water that has got mis-set.

I’d agree with you Tony but if the engine isn’t heating the calorifier either it might be something else....or maybe the engine has a faulty stat or given how the pump was installed anything might be possible. 
 

I have to say I’ve never had a problem using the standard Alde pump...they might struggle tho if 15mm pipe has been used rather than 22mm I guess. 

[Tony Brooks]

15 minutes ago, frangar said:

I’d agree with you Tony but if the engine isn’t heating the calorifier either it might be something else....or maybe the engine has a faulty stat or given how the pump was installed anything might be possible. 
 

I have to say I’ve never had a problem using the standard Alde pump...they might struggle tho if 15mm pipe has been used rather than 22mm I guess. 

When I asked Alde for advice re 15 or 22mm main pipework on a 54ft boat they said either will do. I used 22mm but I suspect 15mm would be OK.

[frangar]

Just now, Tony Brooks said:

When I asked Alde for advice re 15 or 22mm main pipework on a 54ft boat they said either will do. I used 22mm but I suspect 15mm would be OK.

Mines 22mm  as well apart from the branch to the calorifier which is 15mm. The Alde is at the bow with the calorifier in the Mid engine room. 
 

One other thought is if you have added more antifreeze/water you did pre mix it? Otherwise it doesn’t always mix well and stays separate which disrupts the flow.