Replaced battery but boat still won't start: advice?

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, Sir Nibble said:

I assure you that we auto electricians are entirely familiar with two pole systems. It doesn't come as a surprise and is well inside the comfort zone.

I'm sure you are, but would a 'random' auto-electrician in London, who has possibly never seen a boat, be aware of the requirements ?

[Tony Brooks]

33 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Is it acceptable to hit the solenoid though? 

Possibly as long as you don't dent it because that might cause a short circuit and you do not shatter or displace the plastic end cap. Using a mooring stake with its round profile would not be a bright idea in my view.

[rusty69]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

Possibly not, he might have something like Asparagus or some such.

Did you mean aspergers Tony?

Edited September 27, 2019 by rusty69

[Tony Brooks]

4 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Did you mean aspergers Tony?

Yes, spellchucker

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

Yes, spellchucker

Half the time I love them and half the time I hate them

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Half the time I love them and half the time I hate them

Gets on my tips too! 

[Murflynn]

4 hours ago, rusty69 said:

Or a flat battery and no Internet connection. 

the OP said he was visiting the boat on Thursday, so it seems he is not on the boat. 

 

I really don't understand how someone can get to own a boat but apparently be totally unable to manage an apparently fairly straightforward matter like this.  We all had to learn how to run our boats, but there must be better ways of resolving the problem than this.

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, Murflynn said:

 

I really don't understand how someone can get to own a boat but apparently be totally unable to manage an apparently fairly straightforward matter like this

I am not sure how straight forward a problem it is, it could be something simple. Equally, it could be more involved. 

 

2 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

We all had to learn how to run our boats, but there must be better ways of resolving the problem than this.

Agreed, I am still learning. I suspect the "better way" is to get someone in to fix it, but getting the right person in, especially in London may be easier said than done. 

 

Having said that, if the Ops son could access this site and is open to learning, there is a lot to be learnt here. 

[The Dreamer]

3 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

Did you mean aspergers Tony?

When I was at uni, one of my tutor group wrote a first class (literally) essay, on Asparagus Syndrome, yep every written reference to the subject was to the veg, not the medical condition, thus not making it first class after all.  Auto correct is such a wonderful thing!

[PaulD]

57 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

the OP said he was visiting the boat on Thursday, so it seems he is not on the boat. 

 

I really don't understand how someone can get to own a boat but apparently be totally unable to manage an apparently fairly straightforward matter like this.  We all had to learn how to run our boats, but there must be better ways of resolving the problem than this.

Like most boys we had a motorbike. If we didn't fix it we didn't go anywhere. Dad had a toolbox. Grew up and got married then fixed the cooker, electric wiring, gas cooker! brickwork, door locks etc. Then bought a shell and fitted out a boat - every 70 year old boy needs a project! Have my own toolbox now.

 

Something has gone wrong in today's UK I think. If you can't fix anything a boat must be a living nightmare.

 

 

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, PaulD said:

Like most boys we had a motorbike. If we didn't fix it we didn't go anywhere. Dad had a toolbox. Grew up and got married then fixed the cooker, electric wiring, gas cooker! brickwork, door locks etc. Then bought a shell and fitted out a boat - every 70 year old boy needs a project! Have my own toolbox now.

 

Something has gone wrong in today's UK I think. If you can't fix anything a boat must be a living nightmare.

 

 

Dads are great, well mine is. I learnt a lot from him. Not all people are that lucky. Thank gawd for youtube. 

Edited September 27, 2019 by rusty69

[Tony Brooks]

1 minute ago, PaulD said:

Like most boys we had a motorbike. If we didn't fix it we didn't go anywhere. Dad had a toolbox. Grew up and got married then fixed the cooker, electric wiring, gas cooker! brickwork, door locks etc. Then bought a shell and fitted out a boat - every 70 year old boy needs a project! Have my own toolbox now.

 

Something has gone wrong in today's UK I think. If you can't fix anything a boat must be a living nightmare.

 

 

Trouble is the trade bodies have coerced the government to legislate to stop perfectly competent householders doing their own work so now have to rely on what are far too often cowboys.

[Sir Nibble]

10 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I'm sure you are, but would a 'random' auto-electrician in London, who has possibly never seen a boat, be aware of the requirements ?

Yes. He will. Buses and coaches together with HGVs carrying hazardous cargo (tankers) are earth free two pole systems. 

[Alan de Enfield]

5 hours ago, Sir Nibble said:

Yes. He will. Buses and coaches together with HGVs carrying hazardous cargo (tankers) are earth free two pole systems. 

Ok, fair enough, unless he is a 'back street 'car electrician' he will have a knowledge of 2-wire systems.

 

As it happens, the OP actually ended up with a 'domestic' electrician, who, understandably was a 'waste of money'.

[Sir Nibble]

10 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Ok, fair enough, unless he is a 'back street 'car electrician' he will have a knowledge of 2-wire systems.

 

As it happens, the OP actually ended up with a 'domestic' electrician, who, understandably was a 'waste of money'.

I have known jobs where navy electricians have disemboweled a car applying inappropriate techniques to systems they don't understand for what should be half an hour job. A 500V test voltage from an insulation tester is not good for electronics. There are a few people on this forum that could finger this problem before the kettle boils if they were on the spot.

[Alan de Enfield]

7 minutes ago, Sir Nibble said:

I have known jobs where navy electricians have disemboweled a car applying inappropriate techniques to systems they don't understand for what should be half an hour job. A 500V test voltage from an insulation tester is not good for electronics. There are a few people on this forum that could finger this problem before the kettle boils if they were on the spot.

 

You admirably make my point.

 

Use the 'right tool for the job'. It may be more expensive initially but it will do the job.

 

Do it right 1st time - the OP has now had two electricians to the boat and is still left with a non-working boat.

[Sir Nibble]

2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You admirably make my point.

 

Use the 'right tool for the job'. It may be more expensive initially but it will do the job.

 

Do it right 1st time - the OP has now had two electricians to the boat and is still left with a non-working boat.

Quite. I can quote theory 'till I'm blue in the face, calculate impedance or tell you how to get 3 phase from 1, but I'm not a 17th edition electrician and couldn't attempt his job. Knowing ohms law isn't a pass key to all aspects of electrical engineering.

[Murflynn]

50 minutes ago, Sir Nibble said:

 Knowing ohms law isn't a pass key to all aspects of electrical engineering.

it is also necessary to be able to apply ohms law.

I recall a British electrical technician working for Shell who thought that when the lights dimmed because of a 'brown-out' caused by low voltage (a daily occurrence) it was dangerous to leave lights switched on 'because a light bulb has a fixed wattage rating' and therefore would be drawing a bigger current.   

[MtB]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You admirably make my point.

 

Use the 'right tool for the job'. It may be more expensive initially but it will do the job.

 

Do it right 1st time - the OP has now had two electricians to the boat and is still left with a non-working boat.

 

Or as put succinctly by Red Adair, the famous freelance oil well engineer:

 

If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur.

 

Red Adair

 

 

 

 

[Sir Nibble]

2 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

it is also necessary to be able to apply ohms law.

I recall a British electrical technician working for Shell who thought that when the lights dimmed because of a 'brown-out' caused by low voltage (a daily occurrence) it was dangerous to leave lights switched on 'because a light bulb has a fixed wattage rating' and therefore would be drawing a bigger current.   

A good example. My experience of low voltage on vehicle bulbs is silvering of the glass. Thinking about it if a constant power were being dissipated across the filament then it would be glowing as bright as ever. The colder filament will have a lower resistance so maybe that's where the confusion arises.

[Chewbacka]

18 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

it is also necessary to be able to apply ohms law.

I recall a British electrical technician working for Shell who thought that when the lights dimmed because of a 'brown-out' caused by low voltage (a daily occurrence) it was dangerous to leave lights switched on 'because a light bulb has a fixed wattage rating' and therefore would be drawing a bigger current.   

Basically the same comment as Sir Nibble, but worded differently.  With a resistor the relationship between current and voltage is a straight line, but with a filament bulb is reasonably straight at low voltages but becomes a curve with current rising a lot slower than voltage as it gets hotter, maybe that is what was confusing him.

Edited September 28, 2019 by Chewbacka

[Murflynn]

2 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

Basically the same comment as Sir Nibble, but worded differently.  With a resistor the relationship between current and voltage is a straight line, but with a filament bulb is reasonably straight at low voltages but becomes a curve with current rising a lot slower than voltage as it gets hotter, maybe that is what was confusing him.

you are over-thinking it.   A 100 watt light bulb consumes 500mA at 200v, therefore it consumes 2000mA at 50v.   ........................  according to him.

[Alan de Enfield]

43 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

you are over-thinking it.   A 100 watt light bulb consumes 500mA at 200v, therefore it consumes 2000mA at 50v.   ........................  according to him.

Of course it does -

 

Watts = amps x volts.

 

Simple.

 

Forget all this I = V/R stuff it just there to confuse.

[Chewbacka]

1 hour ago, Murflynn said:

you are over-thinking it.   A 100 watt light bulb consumes 500mA at 200v, therefore it consumes 2000mA at 50v.   ........................  according to him.

Ahhh, I see what you mean.

[WotEver]

On 28/09/2019 at 09:23, Sir Nibble said:

My experience of low voltage on vehicle bulbs is silvering of the glass.

I’ve just learned something

 

A mate had a mini back in my youth that kept slivering one rear light bulb but only now do I know why. Thanks.