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Barrus Shire Identification


Troyg

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Hoping someone can help or point out what I'm missing....

 

I am trying to identify what type of Barrus Shire engine I have. The number on the brass plate on top simply reads 2002 0201977. There is nothing else on it! The boat is a Liverpool 60ft boat built around 2003. I suspect its around 45hp. Looking at the Barrus Shire manual it explains how to identify the number but the format just doesn't seem to match with mine. They talk of a 14 50 E xxxx type format (where xxxx is the serial number). As you can see mine has no letters and the numbers don't even seem to match a model. If there was a 35, 40, 50 etc. in there it may make sense..... The only thing I can assume is the 2002 is the year of manufacture and perhaps the number after is the serial number meaning there is no model reference?? It has a PRM150 gearbox attached.

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My friend may have the same engine as his is a 45hp, looking at his manual it says the engine identification number can be found engraved on the brass plate on the engine crankcase adjacent to the starter motor, so it look like there may be two brass plates on the 2002 engines. The one shown below and one by the starter.

69E4E46B-1BA7-4437-B2C3-DE1C6AC2A8AE.jpeg

Edited by PD1964
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Yes but if like the newer  Barrus Shire engines, they all have the same base engine the 40,45 & 50. Barrus just tuned them up and put the relevant model & horsepower on their own brass identification plate, if the plate is missing it can sometimes be confusing to identify the actual modified engine.

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Model 2002 was produced from 1999 to 2003 inc and was based on the Yanmar 4TNE88-BME engine of 2190cc. There was also a model 2200 produced from 1998 to 2000 inc based on the same engine and available as either 45 or 50 hp. My Barrus training notes include most of the sales leaflets for those years, except of course the model 2002! It would be a reasonable guess that the 2002 was initially available as a 40 hp during the period that both were in production. Later production models saw the water-cooled exhaust restricted to the 50 hp models.

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19 hours ago, Tacet said:

I'll hazard a guess at a 4TNE84 as that was around in 2002. 

The model number and year aren't meant to be the same, it's just unfortunate that it looks that way.

The 4TNE84-BME engine of 1995cc was, according to the handouts received during my course, used on the models 2000, 2001 and 2003. The model 2002 has hand written noted added during the course that suggest that latter ones used the larger 4TNE88-BME. The seven digit number after the model number suggests, along with the age of the boat, that this is the larger engine.

The fuel filter is often a CAV type fitted by the installer. The air filter as listed is a Yanmar pt No 119808-12520, but may again be an installation specific part. The oil filter is however a constant between the two engine types; its been superseded a few times over the years, so Yanmar pt No 129150-35151, 129150-35152 or 129150-35153 should find a suitable alternative. The current listing is an entirely different No which I believe was essentially part of a housekeeping exercise to remove multiple numbers from the same filter fitted to many other engine types.

Edited by Eeyore
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Interesting comments. Do these numbers correspond to the more simpler models people refer to 35, 40 etc. or is that referring to HP?

 

I am away at the moment so can't check the engine. As I mentioned I am not even sure what HP is it. It seems to have plenty of power. 1000-1100 rpm pushes 60ft of boat plenty fast enough. 800 rpm idle almost seems too fast passing moored boats.

 

But seeing there are a few on here with good knowledge - one more question....

 

I think I may have a duff thermostat. What is the normal running temp of these engines? I tend to only get 60-70c and I reckon I can feel heat getting pushed to the skin tank pretty quick after start up. I feel it should be up the 80c mark as a normal temp.  Calorifier heats ok. Any one changed thermostats in these before? It is the standard skin/calorifier dual setup. I suspect the skin tank thermostat is stuck open? Are both thermostats located in the black sqaure housing where the radiator/coolant cap is? Seen on the first photo above. Where is best place to get thermostats from?

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The "black block" replaces the normal thermostat cover; so the lower temperature stat sits in the standard position in the head, accessed by removing the domed nuts either side of the filler cap. The higher temperature stat is under the cover on the side of the "black block"; behind the lifting bracket in the photo, where the hose to the skin tank connects. It sounds as though the higher temperature stat has failed, so slightly less to remove; side mounted stats may need a little grease to hold them in place whilst fitting the cover (although some may be held with a spring clip of some sort).

 

Edited by Eeyore
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20 minutes ago, Eeyore said:

The "black block" replaces the normal thermostat cover; so the lower temperature stat sits in the standard position in the head, accessed by removing the domed nuts either side of the filler cap. The higher temperature stat is under the cover on the side of the "black block"; behind the lifting bracket in the photo, where the hose to the skin tank connects. It sounds as though the higher temperature stat has failed, so slightly less to remove; side mounted stats may need a little grease to hold them in place whilst fitting the cover (although some may be held with a spring clip of some sort).

 

You seem to know your stuff! My sold to me as a 65 hp had the bress plate missing it turned out it was a 50 hp because of the airfilter size, in the end to make it usable I re pitched the propeller and it had enough power to cope

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Thanks everyone one - how does the 4TNE84-BME 4TNE88-BME number translate to the numbers on the Barrus Shire website https://www.barrus.co.uk/divisions/marine/diesel/shire/downloads/shire-parts/?p=2

 

Or do they simply not have the old manuals from 2002 online anymore?

 

Best place to buy thermostat? I assume all dual thermostat engines old and new use the same 71c and 88c thermostats? Surprisingly a google for Barrus Shire Thermostats doesn't reveal much at all?

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3 hours ago, Troyg said:

Thanks everyone one - how does the 4TNE84-BME 4TNE88-BME number translate to the numbers on the Barrus Shire website https://www.barrus.co.uk/divisions/marine/diesel/shire/downloads/shire-parts/?p=2

 

Or do they simply not have the old manuals from 2002 online anymore?

 

Best place to buy thermostat? I assume all dual thermostat engines old and new use the same 71c and 88c thermostats? Surprisingly a google for Barrus Shire Thermostats doesn't reveal much at all?

I'm not sure that parts lists for the earlier engines were ever online; there are significant differences between your TNE engine and the current TNV range.

Just take the old thermostat and cover to your local car parts shop, they'll usually find a match. The old one may have a bleed hole (you can drill your own if the replacement is the same in all other respects) which needs to be at the top (12 o'clock position) when refitting.

You may as well speak to Barrus to determine which thermostat they now recommend for your particular engine. Be sure to be seated when you ask about prices ?

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17 hours ago, Troyg said:

 

I am away at the moment so can't check the engine. As I mentioned I am not even sure what HP is it. It seems to have plenty of power. 1000-1100 rpm pushes 60ft of boat plenty fast enough. 800 rpm idle almost seems too fast passing moored boats.

 

You might wish to start a new thread on this subject as your figures indicate a setup at the extreme end of the "normal" range.

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1 hour ago, Nobag said:

I think this one is the correct item.                   "129155-49800 Thermostat" 

Anything with a Yanmar part number is likely to be the one fitted in the head. The higher temperature ones used in the side of the black block usually have numbers in a different format. Happy to be corrected, but is this the higher temperature thermostat used in the single (standard) stat setup?   

Edited by Eeyore
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20 hours ago, peterboat said:

You seem to know your stuff! My sold to me as a 65 hp had the bress plate missing it turned out it was a 50 hp because of the airfilter size, in the end to make it usable I re pitched the propeller and it had enough power to cope

You may have a 40, as the air filter, fuel and oil were all the same on the 40,45 and 50hp.

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3 hours ago, PD1964 said:

You may have a 40, as the air filter, fuel and oil were all the same on the 40,45 and 50hp.

I had the Yanmar plate on the engine the Barrus shire was missing from that plate and the engine number it was worked out to be a 50hp also I thought the smaller engines didnt have water cooled manifolds? Nevs 40 hp didnt anyway

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50 minutes ago, peterboat said:

I had the Yanmar plate on the engine the Barrus shire was missing from that plate and the engine number it was worked out to be a 50hp also I thought the smaller engines didnt have water cooled manifolds? Nevs 40 hp didnt anyway

  You said you identified your 50 from the air filter size, this is not the case as they are the same on each engine, as you now say the way you can identify them is by larger exhaust manifold used on the 50 and not the smaller engines. The Yanmar plate is the same on every engine that's why Barrus put their own plate on once they tune them up.

Edited by PD1964
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My initial id was from the air filter I then went into further detail, the 65 air filter was longer if i remember rightly and it was a real surprise when it didnt fit!! I am sure when I gave Barrus Shire the detail of the Yanmar plate they told me it was a 50, all this was in 2010 ish and the engine has been sold as a 50 which it is

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