Tips on selecting good engine and gearbox and other useful specs for continually cruising 57 to 70 footer

[Saani]

Hi any advice as to specs to look for  much appreciated , thanks and sorry If i have   been bombarding you with lots of questions the pressure is on to get this right, as I know you’ll understand.

[Tony Brooks]

Just my view:

 

Engine:

 

Not one with a cam belt so that is modern Fords & Lombadini out of it.

Not one that has silly ideas about the price of spares so that is Vetus out of it and possibly Volvo-Penta

Not one where being out of production for many years makes spares problematical so that means may so called vintage engines.

Nothing air cooled because they are noisy and for hot water require a gas water heater.

 

Of the main stream marinisers that leaves Beta & Nanni, both based on Kubota engines, Barrus, modern Listers, higher powered Bukhs but I am notsure the normally aspirated one is powerfull enough for a longer boat on rivers, especially if you are new to boating.

While proven workhorses I am not sure I would go for BMC now because of my third item above although still OK at present.

 

Gearbox:

 

Anything hydraulic like PRM, preferably the larger ones.

If mechanical not Hurth and whatever mechanical boxed Vetus fit  or fitted. Both based on long term reliability.

 

Now what about the shaft coupling? An Aquadrive or very similar makes a massive reduction in vibrations and reduces maintenance on flexibly mounted engine instalations.

 

Having said all that I think you may have the wrong idea about boat hunting. There is very unlikely to be a boat that complies 100% with any list of requirements you may have and even if there is those requirements are almost certainly going to alter overtime so when you find a boat that is nearly compliant don't reject it just because it has a Vetus engine for example. I had never hear of Bukh before I started boat hunting but teh boat found us and as it turns out a designed from the ground up marine engine turned out to be the best I could have done.

 

[Stephen Jeavons]

Tony, what are your thoughts on the push for lower emission (electric or hybrid)? Do you think that diesel powered days are numbered?

 

[Tony Brooks]

6 hours ago, Stephen Jeavons said:

Tony, what are your thoughts on the push for lower emission (electric or hybrid)? Do you think that diesel powered days are numbered?

 

I think the government will pick off the weakest in an attempt to greenwash their conduct so private boaters, then private motorists will be hit long before aircraft have to pay VAT and sort out their emissions so I fear internal combustion engines in boats fays are numbered. This and a belief that the inland waterways will be virtually unusable in the next 10 to 20 years is why I am selling my boat.

 

Unless you have shore line charging totally from green sources I don't see how a hybrid system can be anything other that more polluting than a straight diesel to shaft drive because the inefficiencies in generation, battery charging, battery discharging and the electric motor must far outweigh the efficiency gains you get y running an IC engine at its most efficient speed. Again, greenwash in my view.

 

Yes electric drive, as long as the electricity is from green sources, will be a good thing and this is what the government will try to force on boaters but by the time the charging infrastructure has been put in, if t ever is, the cost of charging to pay for that infrastructure will be prohibitive for all but the rich or very rich.

 

I fear the future is far from bright for the majority of ordinary people.

[Jen-in-Wellies]

10 hours ago, Saani said:

Hi any advice as to specs to look for  much appreciated , thanks and sorry If i have   been bombarding you with lots of questions the pressure is on to get this right, as I know you’ll understand.

Of equal, if not greater importance, when buying a used boat is how well maintained the engine has been. Look for evidence of regular oil and filter changes and other service procedures in line with the manufacturers recommendations. A boat log book with these details, going back years is a good sign. Is the engine and surrounding compartment clean, with minimal rust, or signs of flooding?

 

Jen

Edited August 27, 2019 by Jen-in-Wellies

[Stephen Jeavons]

 

12 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I think the government will pick off the weakest in an attempt to greenwash their conduct so private boaters, then private motorists will be hit long before aircraft have to pay VAT and sort out their emissions so I fear internal combustion engines in boats fays are numbered. This and a belief that the inland waterways will be virtually unusable in the next 10 to 20 years is why I am selling my boat.

 

Unless you have shore line charging totally from green sources I don't see how a hybrid system can be anything other that more polluting than a straight diesel to shaft drive because the inefficiencies in generation, battery charging, battery discharging and the electric motor must far outweigh the efficiency gains you get y running an IC engine at its most efficient speed. Again, greenwash in my view.

 

Yes electric drive, as long as the electricity is from green sources, will be a good thing and this is what the government will try to force on boaters but by the time the charging infrastructure has been put in, if t ever is, the cost of charging to pay for that infrastructure will be prohibitive for all but the rich or very rich.

 

I fear the future is far from bright for the majority of ordinary people.

Interesting thoughts and it is a worry for anyone like me considering an engine swap sometime in the future. Should diesel be outlawed, it does beg the question how we heat our boats as no doubt multi-fuel stoves will also be banned. We'll all have to make do with electric heaters and the immersion for hot water. Great when on shore-power but impossible if cruising

Edited August 27, 2019 by Stephen Jeavons

[Saani]

Thanks for the brilliant advice 

[Alan de Enfield]

On ‎27‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 09:00, Stephen Jeavons said:

Tony, what are your thoughts on the push for lower emission (electric or hybrid)? Do you think that diesel powered days are numbered?

 

 

On ‎27‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 15:28, Tony Brooks said:

I think the government will pick off the weakest in an attempt to greenwash their conduct so private boaters, then private motorists will be hit long before aircraft have to pay VAT and sort out their emissions so I fear internal combustion engines in boats fays are numbered. This and a belief that the inland waterways will be virtually unusable in the next 10 to 20 years is why I am selling my boat.

Which is much of the reason we are leaving the Inland Waterways and returning to the Sea.

 

We have secured a nice sheltered berth in the Menai Straits - handy for Ireland, Iom or further afield.

Hoping to move there in October.

[Chewbacka]

On 27/08/2019 at 15:38, Stephen Jeavons said:

 

Interesting thoughts and it is a worry for anyone like me considering an engine swap sometime in the future. Should diesel be outlawed, it does beg the question how we heat our boats as no doubt multi-fuel stoves will also be banned. We'll all have to make do with electric heaters and the immersion for hot water. Great when on shore-power but impossible if cruising

I see two things happening in the future.  Firstly the main concern with Diesel engines in boats is not global warming but NOx in cities, so to enter a city without an engine emissions control system (equivalent to euro6 in cars) will initially be expensive and say 7 years later banned.  The second later change say 10 years from now, will be the requirement to be able to power the boat away from urban areas using a clean Diesel engine and in urban areas where establishing a charging infra structure would not be over expensive you must use electric propulsion.  By which point I will have become senile or worse.......

[WotEver]

7 hours ago, Chewbacka said:

Firstly the main concern with Diesel engines in boats is not global warming but NOx in cities...

... while the couple in the safety of their house have cooked a lovely romantic meal on their gas hob which they’re now enjoying by candle light, breathing in more NOx than if they were sat in the middle of the dual carriageway...

[jacko264]

Its quite funny how things are changing we are removing all the electric battery's , controllers etc and converting the buses we have to Diesel engine  and so is a lot of other bus company's just to give you an ideal the battery's cost about 30,000 pound a bus the controllers about the same per bus 

jacko

[Alan de Enfield]

10 minutes ago, jacko264 said:

Its quite funny how things are changing we are removing all the electric battery's , controllers etc and converting the buses we have to Diesel engine  and so is a lot of other bus company's just to give you an ideal the battery's cost about 30,000 pound a bus the controllers about the same per bus 

jacko

There you go - a little business on the side.

 

I'm sure you could find a ready market for some 'heavy duty deep cycle' batteries.

Will the bus company sell them off ?

[jacko264]

No sorry the battery's have already gone from our company  we used to get them from BA e systems if that helps

If we wanted to weld on the bus they had to come and disconnect the electrics we where not a loud to touch them 

[Saani]

On 27/08/2019 at 18:15, Tony Brooks said:

higher powered Bukhs but I am notsure the normally aspirated one is powerfull enough for a longer boat on rivers, especially if you are new to boating.

Thanks for that advice . Do you know if the Bukh DV36 is one that may have a problem with rivers. Unsure if it is normally aspirated. And was intending to cruise along river Wey to be near Guildford. 

[blackrose]

On 27/08/2019 at 15:38, Stephen Jeavons said:

 

 

Sorry wrong thread!

.

Edited September 2, 2019 by blackrose

[Tony Brooks]

8 hours ago, Saani said:

Thanks for that advice . Do you know if the Bukh DV36 is one that may have a problem with rivers. Unsure if it is normally aspirated. And was intending to cruise along river Wey to be near Guildford. 

The DV36 is naturally aspirated., the higher powered marine Bukhs are basically DV36s with a turbocharger.

 

I have had my 54ft narrowboat with a DV36 to Godalming and back twicw in summer and have been on the Thames on red boards without any lack of power problems but at those times watermanship and knowing when to tie up and wait is more important than engine power as long as the power is adequate

[Saani]

Thanks don’t know anything unfortunately about motors. Is it possible to add  power ,,turbo charge ...affordably  to DV36 if a 70 foot boat won’t handle rivers such as the Wey I’m avoiding tidal Thames as out my league . Maybe one day though.

[David Mack]

70 ft narrow boats have managed perfectly well on the tidal (and non-tidal) Thames with engines significantly less powerful than a DV36.