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Thames through London.


Bee

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We were in London yesterday, not boating, just visiting, had a walk along the embankment mid afternoon and the river was really busy, tugs with  rubbish barges, sand barge, those terrible RIB's, a big square thing with a crane on it powering along and trip boats tearing about all over the place. We have ventured onto all sorts of busy waterways and tidal bits but I would have been really quite nervous in any small boat and unsure of a narrowboat in the wash from all the traffic. The point being that if you are using that bit of the river from Limehouse up to Brentford or Teddington it really is wise to catch an early tide to avoid the chaos. 

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2 minutes ago, mark99 said:

Yes Bee.

Its fab when its busy and keeps yer on yer toes innitt. The diverse craft on any of our big rivers is what makes them more interesting than the ditch system. I remember on a couple of occasions years ago getting it a tad wrong and nearly being ploughed into by 600 ton barges ont Trent lol.

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OK, last year we went out from Limehouse at 9.30 on a Wednesday. Belting sunny day and absolutely no problems.

 

As we were leaving Limehouse there was one of those huge gravel barges went passed and created some wash, after that it is just a case of keeping your eyes open and not hogging the main channel. Most of the commercial boats are mindful of the smaller craft and, as I found, don't play silly sods.

 

I took the car Sat-nav with me but hardly referred to it - the Nicholson's that covers the Thames is so good. There is a lot of reading to be done before planning the journey.

 

Just do it, it is one of the best boating memories I now have, to the point that I am thinking of doing it again in a couple of years.

 

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Soo many folk get put off  "doing the tidal Thames" - but it's a fabulous trip.

All / what you need to do is Boy Scout's - Be Prepared.

To avoid / minimize interference fro large fast moving craft - keep closer in to the bank and if you see a lot of wash steer into it.

Leave on an early tide

Go with other boats

Do a bit more research

 

Don't go in an air cooled boat (unless you block the air intakes)

 

 

Edited by OldGoat
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The one's that you mention, tugs with barges, are actually extremely competent and, provided you know what the sound signals mean, they indicate their moves very clearly and in good time. The muppets you have to look out for are the amateurs driving the trip boats full of people, they do anything since they seem to think, despite their lack of competence, they own the river.

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Just going back to the OP, some of the points here explain why VHF radio is so handy on the tideway. You can hear the other boats talking to each other, and explaining what they are about to do, and also call them up if you need to.

 

For example last year a trip boat wanted to overtake me and then turn around to starboard in front of me and  moor up to Westminster pier. I said I was happy to move out (to the left) once they had gone past and go around their stern. Result: lower stress for everyone.

Edited by Scholar Gypsy
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St Pancras Cruising Club organise regular convoys on the tidal Thames (open to non members). Join them and you benefit from their experience and organisation, together with the knowledge that there will be other boats around in case if any problems.

http://www.stpancrascc.co.uk/?q=cruising

 

Edited by David Mack
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1 minute ago, David Mack said:

St Pancras Cruising Club organise regular convoys on the tidal Thames (open to non members). Join them and you benefit from their experience and organisation, together with the knowledge that there will be other boats around in case if any problems.

A few photos of our convoy this year:  https://nbsg.wordpress.com/2019/05/19/spcc-tideway-trip-limehouse-to-teddington-via-dagenham/

 

And here's an (unofficial) website that gives you plenty to read (to pick up DaveR's point above): http://thamescruising.co.uk/

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I fancy doing Limehouse to Teddington sometime in July. I would plan to take an early morning tide (6am ish). My partner has been persuaded that it would be an interesting trip but she says we can't go unless we travel in the company of another boat for a bit of a backup if things go wrong. Is anyone planning such a trip sometime in July who would fancy a bit of company?

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Be aware that Brentford is only accessible at near High Tide, easy run from Teddington, I have done it several times with a loaded narrowboat.  Steer into the wash from other craft. 

Never used VHF, but it sounds a very good idea.  Shouting 'Mayday' is not much good.

 

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Limehouse to Teddington is not too scary. It is doubtful if you would ever be the only boat going out, but you can liaise with the lock keeper and other boats. The staff know the best times to leave, and will usually put you out on arising tide so your trip will be a lot quicker than you think. It is easy to keep out of others way, and if you see a wash, steer into it. There is much literature available which is essential reading, and also a useful navigation aid. Once you have passed the 'sights', it can become quite boring.

Brentford to Limehouse is another story and can be quite daunting as the lock levels mean you will be travelling on a falling tide which makes a narrowboat more difficult to handle.

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15 hours ago, OldGoat said:

Go with other boats

 

10 hours ago, Alway Swilby said:

I fancy doing Limehouse to Teddington sometime in July. I would plan to take an early morning tide (6am ish). My partner has been persuaded that it would be an interesting trip but she says we can't go unless we travel in the company of another boat for a bit of a backup if things go wrong. Is anyone planning such a trip sometime in July who would fancy a bit of company?


The "go with other boats" idea doesn't always work out.

One time we did it, we could see 2 other narrow boats were going out of Limehouse at the same time, but the lock keepers put them in the lock, then a much bigger river cruiser, and we were excluded.

By the time we went through a second operation of the lock on our own, of course thy were long gone, and we never saw them again.  In fact both times we  have gone out of Limehouse we have been the only boat in the lock

 

We were novices at this, but I'm not to sure how useful the advice is.  I would imagine that if one narrow boat did suffer engine failure or a foul prop, it could be very hard for another one to assist in any way.  Perhaps I'm wrong, but I wouldn't like to try it.

 

 

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I did Teddington to Brentford a few years ago on a falling high spring tide and the amount of rubbish in the river, bits of plastic and lord only knows what else was worrying, it seemed to gather together in areas and to lessen the chances of picking it up on the prop I drifted through the worst of it out of gear, I guess this is really only a problem with very high tides that pick up more debris. To and from Limehouse though is a fantastic trip but I have only done it before the worst of the chaos begins. When we were watching the river on Wednesday there was a work boat about our size tied up to a lighter and it was leaping about all over the place, if anyone had been on it they would have struggled to hold on to a cup of tea.

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35 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 


The "go with other boats" idea doesn't always work out.

One time we did it, we could see 2 other narrow boats were going out of Limehouse at the same time, but the lock keepers put them in the lock, then a much bigger river cruiser, and we were excluded.

By the time we went through a second operation of the lock on our own, of course thy were long gone, and we never saw them again.  In fact both times we  have gone out of Limehouse we have been the only boat in the lock

 

We were novices at this, but I'm not to sure how useful the advice is.  I would imagine that if one narrow boat did suffer engine failure or a foul prop, it could be very hard for another one to assist in any way.  Perhaps I'm wrong, but I wouldn't like to try it.

 

 

A bit of a catch22 to my mind - if I spend ages putting together a detailed - and to my mind a considered  post, it either gets rubbished by other or the OP moves away because there's too much detail!

 

Thus now I put the bare bones in  - just to paint an outline of the picture.

 

OK - go with others if you can- by searching here / facebook / whatever.

Is that better??

 

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15 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

The one's that you mention, tugs with barges, are actually extremely competent and, provided you know what the sound signals mean, they indicate their moves very clearly and in good time. The muppets you have to look out for are the amateurs driving the trip boats full of people, they do anything since they seem to think, despite their lack of competence, they own the river.

We met a tug and rubbish barges after going out from Brentford with a loaded pair upstream to Teddington. as soon as he saw us he slowed right down to leave less wash. The tug captains will all be time served lightmen / watermen hence they really do know what they are doing. If you can get a copy then " Men of the Tideway is a good read"

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1 hour ago, alan_fincher said:

 


The "go with other boats" idea doesn't always work out.

One time we did it, we could see 2 other narrow boats were going out of Limehouse at the same time, but the lock keepers put them in the lock, then a much bigger river cruiser, and we were excluded.

By the time we went through a second operation of the lock on our own, of course thy were long gone, and we never saw them again.  In fact both times we  have gone out of Limehouse we have been the only boat in the lock

 

We were novices at this, but I'm not to sure how useful the advice is.  I would imagine that if one narrow boat did suffer engine failure or a foul prop, it could be very hard for another one to assist in any way.  Perhaps I'm wrong, but I wouldn't like to try it.

 

 

 

I have been on at least four Thames Tideway trips when one of the accompanying narrowboats has broken down, on two of the occasions they were 'rescued' by other narrowboats so it can be done.

 

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1 hour ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

I have been on at least four Thames Tideway trips when one of the accompanying narrowboats has broken down, on two of the occasions they were 'rescued' by other narrowboats so it can be done.

 

I haven't done the Thames, but I am fairly sure I would render assistance if I was in a position to do so. 

 

All you need to do in the first instance is get close enough to the distressed boat to get a line thrown from one boat to the other at matched speeds.   Once the boats are close together with a line between them you can then tidy up by arranging them for towing or breast them up.

 

I'd certainly hope someone would do the same for me if I was the boat having difficulties. 

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Rubbish in the river is unpredictable, and can be quite disconcerting if you encounter it. Usually it is most worrying if you are going downstream on a falling tide. Going upstream gives you better control and manoeuvrability as the tide cancels out the flow to a large extent. When we've gone out with other boats we've often been left behind. A lot of breakdowns occur because the boat is pushed to the limit by the steerer who revels in so much water. This is not necessary; just because other craft go fast does not mean you have to. If you adopt normal operations, keep well to the side,then you should be fine. Obviously, I'm assuming you have a well serviced boat and do the usual checks before starting.

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6 hours ago, barry adams said:

We met a tug and rubbish barges after going out from Brentford with a loaded pair upstream to Teddington. as soon as he saw us he slowed right down to leave less wash. The tug captains will all be time served lightmen / watermen hence they really do know what they are doing. If you can get a copy then " Men of the Tideway is a good read"

I can only second that, we came across a similar tug and pair of rubbish barges coming down against a flooding tide. After the appropriate sound signal (4 blasts and then a single blast, not to be confused with 5 blasts) he turned the whole lot around to starboard and didn't seem to go sideways very much at all, try that on  a flooding tide with a narrowboat (and butty:() .

 

I think this MAIB report gives something of a flavour of the abilities of the trip boat masters (https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/collision-between-passenger-vessel-millennium-time-and-motor-tug-redoubt  ), several recommendations for the trip boat, no mention of any criticism of the tug skipper.

Edited by Wanderer Vagabond
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3 hours ago, Ex Brummie said:

A lot of breakdowns occur because the boat is pushed to the limit by the steerer who revels in so much water.

Very true, I ran Jaguar at normal engine speed on the river.  She just went a lot faster than in the ditches. 

I have to admit that I did wind her up a bit passing the Conservancy offices in Reading.  Just for the Hell of it.

  • Horror 1
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