Narrowboat engine rooms...

[TheBiscuits]

My non-historic has a 6ft engine room with no back cabin, and a Beta engine.  And a doorway through into the main cabin.  And two spiral staircases! 

 

It's great ... easy access to service the engine and loads of racking for mancave stuff.

[Tumshie]

17 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

My non-historic has a 6ft engine room with no back cabin, and a Beta engine.  And a doorway through into the main cabin.  And two spiral staircases! 

 

It's great ... easy access to service the engine and loads of racking for mancave stuff.

Well that all sounds very intriguing. ?

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, Tumshie said:

Well that all sounds very intriguing. ?

@RLWP hadn't seen anything quite like it before, but did like the idea you can just sit on the floor and get both hands on the oil filter.  I do too, especially as I have to do it!

[Chris Williams]

On ‎16‎/‎06‎/‎2019 at 19:49, mrsmelly said:

However a good friend of mine did want an old knacker of an engine and had a gardner fitted in an engine room at the very rear of the boat as you went down the steps from the trad stern

'Kimberley' aka 'Enterprise' had this layout.

[TheBiscuits]

18 minutes ago, Tumshie said:

Well that all sounds very intriguing. ?

 

[alan_fincher]

8 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

5’ 6” is still on the small side for an engine room. Any of those boats actually got bigger cabins and/or engine rooms than the original?

 

JP

Why do you think 5' 6" is on the small side for an engine room?

 

Only if you want to fit an engine that is much larger than you actually need, surely?

 

I'm not aware of many genuine "Grand Union" motors that have had things at the back made larger, though that is not to say there are not one or two.

 

One that is unusual it "Sutton" that has its engine room set further forward, and apparently incorporates a small loo/washroom between that and the back cabin.  You would think it should look glaringly wrong from outside, but actually it looks much less wrong than you might imagine.

 

Some of the butty conversions have undoubtedly been given more generous back cabins.  I would say "Dodona" (front end of) currently for sale is one of these, but I suspect it also applies to others.

8 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

'Kimberley' aka 'Enterprise' had this layout.

It has a "conventional" layout now, but (from memory) I think it now sports an extension cabin forward of the engine room.

 

No

 

It's not a boat I seem to see very often any more.

[Captain Pegg]

14 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

Why do you think 5' 6" is on the small side for an engine room?

 

Only if you want to fit an engine that is much larger than you actually need, surely?

 

I'm not aware of many genuine "Grand Union" motors that have had things at the back made larger, though that is not to say there are not one or two.

 

One that is unusual it "Sutton" that has its engine room set further forward, and apparently incorporates a small loo/washroom between that and the back cabin.  You would think it should look glaringly wrong from outside, but actually it looks much less wrong than you might imagine.

 

Some of the butty conversions have undoubtedly been given more generous back cabins.  I would say "Dodona" (front end of) currently for sale is one of these, but I suspect it also applies to others.

It has a "conventional" layout now, but (from memory) I think it now sports an extension cabin forward of the engine room.

The types of boats that the OP is talking about are likely to be purpose built modern boats not ex-working boats and I made the comment out of the general belief that the engine rooms on such boats are generally larger than 5’ 6”. 

 

So taking the selection of seven boats with engine rooms currently on sale with ABNB five of them have engine rooms between 6’0” and 7’ 2” although there are two that are smaller than 5’ 6”.

 

The back cabins are a mixed bunch though as a couple of them don’t even bother with a cross bed and one has a lengthways double with a combined back bedroom/engine room set up of over 20’. Only three of them have the full stove, table cupboard, cross bed set up and they are 8’ 2”, 8’ 6” and 9’ 0” respectively.

 

So not 18’ but mostly a bit bigger than an original GU set up. The reality of buying a real boat is that looking for something with a very specific set up will severely limit choices.

 

JP

[alan_fincher]

You have explained that a lot of modern boats are built with engine rooms that are more than 5' 6" long, but you have not explained why "5' 6" is on the small side for an engine room".

 

Perhaps the additional space is to allow a crowd to assemble inside to look at all the polished pipes on the Gardner, or whatever else is fitted.

 

I still don't see why it is needed if the purpose is just to house a sensible engine and gearbox.

[Athy]

Just now, alan_fincher said:

You have explained that a lot of modern boats are built with engine rooms that are more than 5' 6" long, but you have not explained why "5' 6" is on the small side for an engine room".

 

Perhaps the additional space is to allow a crowd to assemble inside to look at all the polished pipes on the Gardner, or whatever else is fitted.

 

 

Don't be daft - that's what the side doors are for.

 

I haven't recently measured our engine room but I think it's between 5'0" and 5'6".

[Rob-M]

I find the engine room on Scorpio very tight trying to get past the engine to go from one side to the other and the is only took to get by at one end so it would benefit from being longer.

My earlier post was estimations on the space used in a modern boat not based on the dimensions of ex working boats as I felt that was more likely what the OP was considering.

[Captain Pegg]

15 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

You have explained that a lot of modern boats are built with engine rooms that are more than 5' 6" long, but you have not explained why "5' 6" is on the small side for an engine room".

 

Perhaps the additional space is to allow a crowd to assemble inside to look at all the polished pipes on the Gardner, or whatever else is fitted.

 

I still don't see why it is needed if the purpose is just to house a sensible engine and gearbox.

Go back to the first post I made on this thread and note that my reference was to the actual size of cabin and engine room as they are constructed; the context being the sort of boats the OP is likely to consider buying.

 

You pointed out that it could all be done in 13’ 6”, my point is that it generally isn’t. I’m not suggesting that an engine room should be longer than 5’ 6”, just that the majority on boats the OP might buy are longer than 5’ 6”.

 

I will however however say that if you want a back cabin with a regular use double bed then 8’ and a bit is definitely on the small side.

 

JP

[Athy]

2 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

.

 

I will however however say that if you want a back cabin with a regular use double bed then 8’ and a bit is definitely on the small side.

 

JP

If you want a traditionally arranged one, yes. In a modern interpretation of a back cabin, eight feet is enough. Our back cabin is about 8'0" long. It has a 4'6" crossways bed, but no stove or side bench - there are wardrobes where these would have been. 

[alan_fincher]

3 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

I will however however say that if you want a back cabin with a regular use double bed then 8’ and a bit is definitely on the small side.

On this point we agree!

 

You mentioned 3' 6" as a double bed width, but 3' 6" would be pure luxury in either of ours.

 

Both have just 3 feet, so in truth, a single by domestic standards!

 

Undoubtedly why most modern interpretations of the back cabin are a foot or more longer than the genuine article.

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

On this point we agree!

 

You mentioned 3' 6" as a double bed width, but 3' 6" would be pure luxury in either of ours.

 

Both have just 3 feet, so in truth, a single by domestic standards!

 

Undoubtedly why most modern interpretations of the back cabin are a foot or more longer than the genuine article.

As you know I am not an lover of old knacker boats but I thought ( wrongly I suppose ) It was just a cabin? Not back cabin? Was it called different things by different people back in the day?

Thanks

[Athy]

5 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

As you know I am not an lover of old knacker boats but I thought ( wrongly I suppose ) It was just a cabin? Not back cabin? Was it called different things by different people back in the day?

Thanks

On the majority of old boats it would have been the only cabin (though some had a smaller forecabin), so "cabin" is entirely appropriate and unambiguous. But on modern boats or conversions of old boats, there will be cabin space further forward, so the precision "back cabin" makes sense.

   The most commonly used term (though often deplored in these pages) is "boatman's cabin". Its abbreviation "BMC" is, to these eyes, more deplorable, as it could be referring to a living space or to a four-cylinder diesel engine.

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, Athy said:

On the majority of old boats it would have been the only cabin (though some had a smaller forecabin), so "cabin" is entirely appropriate and unambiguous. But on modern boats or conversions of old boats, there will be cabin space further forward, so the precision "back cabin" makes sense.

   The most commonly used term (though often deplored in these pages) is "boatman's cabin". Its abbreviation "BMC" is, to these eyes, more deplorable, as it could be referring to a living space or to a four-cylinder diesel engine.

Ahh thanks, so I am sort of correct innitt 

[Athy]

1 minute ago, mrsmelly said:

Ahh thanks, so I am sort of correct innitt 

Don't sound so surprised; it has been known before.

[Chris Williams]

6 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

14 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

'Kimberley' aka 'Enterprise' had this layout.

It has a "conventional" layout now, but (from memory) I think it now sports an extension cabin forward of the engine room.

Originally a butty, it was motorised with a Bolinder.  The thought of that thing thumping away at your feet is frightening.  I believe the extra cabin was fitted when she was working as the trip boat 'Enterprise' on the Kennet.  Alec Purcell told me something of her history.  She has certainly been hacked about over the years.

[Chris Williams]

5 hours ago, Chris Williams said:

Originally a butty, it was motorised with a Bolinder.  The thought of that thing thumping away at your feet is frightening.  I believe the extra cabin was fitted when she was working as the trip boat 'Enterprise' on the Kennet.  Alec Purcell told me something of her history.  She has certainly been hacked about over the years.

The engine was put at the back to eliminate the prop shaft and lower the cabin so that she could get under the girders that were supposed to be holding up Bridge Street bridge in Reading.

[cuthound]

On 17/06/2019 at 09:09, Athy said:

Gosh, how enterprising!

This reminds me of the day, last year, when I was carrying a "Buckby" can of water from tap to boat, and another boater remarked that he'd never seen one being used for that purpose before. Er, the name "water can" does offer a clue....

 

Personally I find a hose to be a quicker and easier way to fill the water tank, but each to their own ?

[MtB]

10 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

Personally I find a hose to be a quicker and easier way to fill the water tank, but each to their own ?

 

Teacher, innit....

 

[Athy]

1 hour ago, Mike the Boilerman said:

 

Teacher, innit....

 

That's right: they are intelligent enough to realise that a hosepipe would not reach the 300 yards from their mooring to the boat.