Hot water

[Paolo Reale]

Hi,

I'm new to narowboat ownership and have a basic question about hot water.  Our boat has a duel coil calorifier and Eberspacher heater.  Up until now hot water has been created via cruising - so the engine produces the hot water or by the central heating being on and hot water created that way.  Now it's summer (ish), and we're currently in our marina is there an obvious way to heat domestic hot water without running the engine for an hour each day or indeed putting the heating on?  Is it just as simple as turning the radiators off and running the Eberspacher?  A possible related  issue is that  I have a small control unit/thermostat at the foot of our bed that is wired into the calorifier which is located under the bed.  It doesn't work (never has since owing her) and I wondered if this was a means of heating water without turning on the heater or engine?  I attach a photo of the unit - any help would be gratefully received.

[Tony Brooks]

Yes, Eber on and rads off. That is exactly what I do apart from the fact the boiler is an Alde gas one.  Check that you do not have valve somewhere that isolates the rads with just one valve but leaves the calorifier in circuit.

 

Think about installing a mains immersion heater for future use when you have shore power. it's cheaper, quieter and has no tendency to carbon up the Eber. You may well have a heater boss hidden under the insulation.

 

 

[philjw]

Googling " Dixell Prime " which is written on the unit in the photo suggests that it is a control for a freezer. Do you have a freezer under the bed?

 

http://www.dixell.de/images/manuals/xr60d_en.pdf

 

If not it is probably acting as a tank thermostat and may be controlling the eber remotely

Edited June 3, 2019 by philjw
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[Paolo Reale]

Thanks Tony, it's good to know that I'm not stupidly missing something obvious. And thanks for the advice re. isolation taps - I have found taps seemingly leading from the Eber' to the first rad' in the bedroom and wondered what they were for.  Perhaps one will isolate the rads' while keeping the calorifier in the loop as you suggest.  Finally what's a "heater boss" under the insulation?

 

Also thanks to Phil for googling my image - why didn't I think of that? !!  There's no freezer on board, so I assume it's a now a defunct thermostat for the Eber as you suggest.

[Johny London]

I think the heater boss Tony refers to would be the element (or where an element can go) in the tank. If there is already an element all you need to do is see how/if it is wired - but be carefull not to let it get switched on unless you are confident you have enough power (which would be shoreline, basically).

 

It also sounds like you can turn your rads off. If you do so, the Ebersplutter will heat the water quickly but may start to "cycle" ie go into a low power burn - potentially causing its burner to soot up over time, and fail. There seems to be divided opinion on here about it actually, so you will have to pay your money and take your chances. (Or the other way round in this case!). I have been using a Webasto successfully for a couple of winters now for heating and hot water, just recently I turned off most of the rads - the idea is to leave one on so as to help dissipate heat - the pump is small in these type of heaters and they cannot transfer all heat output to the calorifier effectively enough to avoid going into low burn mode. Now, with two rads still on, my Webasto starts to cycle before the water is hot - so we will see.

[Tony Brooks]

22 minutes ago, Paolo Reale said:

Thanks Tony, it's good to know that I'm not stupidly missing something obvious. And thanks for the advice re. isolation taps - I have found taps seemingly leading from the Eber' to the first rad' in the bedroom and wondered what they were for.  Perhaps one will isolate the rads' while keeping the calorifier in the loop as you suggest.  Finally what's a "heater boss" under the insulation?

 

Also thanks to Phil for googling my image - why didn't I think of that? !!  There's no freezer on board, so I assume it's a now a defunct thermostat for the Eber as you suggest.

 

Exactly as JL describes. Its a blanking plug screwed into a large thread that you can (hopefully) remove and fit an immersion heater element. If the element was already in place either the insulation would have a big bump in it or the heater top would be exposed. I think it is only the higher priced calorifiers that might have the element in place already.

[Alan de Enfield]

39 minutes ago, Paolo Reale said:

Thanks Tony, it's good to know that I'm not stupidly missing something obvious. And thanks for the advice re. isolation taps - I have found taps seemingly leading from the Eber' to the first rad' in the bedroom and wondered what they were for.  Perhaps one will isolate the rads' while keeping the calorifier in the loop as you suggest.  Finally what's a "heater boss" under the insulation?

 

Also thanks to Phil for googling my image - why didn't I think of that? !!  There's no freezer on board, so I assume it's a now a defunct thermostat for the Eber as you suggest.

Your "Hot-Water Tank" (Calorifier) be lying 'horizontally', or it may be 'vertical', it may be covered in a 'yellowy dense foam' or it may be covered in a 'blanket'.

 

Mine is a vertical calorifier covered in a 'blanket'

 

The immersion heater is fitted beneath the 'black cap' with the white wire connecting it to the mains supply.

 

1) If you have an immersion heater fitted it will look similar to the photo.

2) If you don't have an immersion heater fitted you may have either a big-brass nut blanking off the hole, or, you may not have a 'hole' (Heater Boss) at all in which case you cannot fit an immersion heater.

 

 

 

Edited June 3, 2019 by Alan de Enfield

[Johny London]

Mine came with an element already fitted. The boat fitter said it was £100 extra as an option so I said I didn't want it, but it was there anyway cos I guess they all just come like that. 

No one has mentioned yet - you'll need an element spanner if you have to fit it (Wickes sell them) and be really careful - copper cylinders are strong only up to a point. Don't over tighten. 

[ditchcrawler]

The brass hexagon bit in the right hand side of this calorifier, You unscrew it and screw the immersion heater element in its place.

  

[Paolo Reale]

Thanks to all who have replied to my post so quickly - it's been really helpful.  I'll check to see if I have or can fit an immersion heater to my calorifier - sounds like a good idea when hooked up.  Two final questions (I hope) - when fitting the element - I think I could do this myself -  I assume you need to drain the calorifier first - then get someone to wire it to the mains electric circuit?  Also, I assume you then have to fit a switch, much like an immersion heater at home that you can use to just heat up the water when needed?

[Bee]

1 hour ago, philjw said:

Googling " Dixell Prime " which is written on the unit in the photo suggests that it is a control for a freezer. Do you have a freezer under the bed?

 

http://www.dixell.de/images/manuals/xr60d_en.pdf

 

If not it is probably acting as a tank thermostat and may be controlling the eber remotely

Just a thought, its not some sort of frost setting is it? comes on when it gets really cold to prevent freezing?

[mrsmelly]

5 minutes ago, Paolo Reale said:

Thanks to all who have replied to my post so quickly - it's been really helpful.  I'll check to see if I have or can fit an immersion heater to my calorifier - sounds like a good idea when hooked up.  Two final questions (I hope) - when fitting the element - I think I could do this myself -  I assume you need to drain the calorifier first - then get someone to wire it to the mains electric circuit?  Also, I assume you then have to fit a switch, much like an immersion heater at home that you can use to just heat up the water when needed?

I am on mains at present and always use the immersion, its on 24/7 365 and costs peanuts to run. I ran a piece of lectric string to my immersion after I fitted it into a new cauliflower. Then put a standard 13 amp plug on the end of it and plug it into one of my mains sockets. My boat MOT tester when I showed him said it was fine.

[David Mack]

18 minutes ago, Paolo Reale said:

 I assume you need to drain the calorifier first 

General advice when removing an immersion heater element or blanking plug is to keep the calorifier full while you crack the thread - the water will reduce the chances of the calorifier distorting when you apply torque to the heater/plug. There may be a little dribbling from the thread after you have done this. Then drain it down to below the level of the fitting before removing fully.

[Onewheeler]

If you don't have an immersion heater or blanking plug, it may be feasible to fit an external immersion (also known as a Belfast or Willis immersion) close to the calorifier.

 

If you do fit an immersion heater, remember that many shore power outlets are only 6 amp so 1500 Watts max. Allow for miscellaneous other items drawing power (battery charger?) and you might conclude that a 1 kW heater is what is needed. It will take longer to get hot water. Alternatively fit a power controller.

[Captain Fizz]

17 hours ago, David Mack said:

General advice when removing an immersion heater element or blanking plug is to keep the calorifier full while you crack the thread - the water will reduce the chances of the calorifier distorting when you apply torque to the heater/plug. There may be a little dribbling from the thread after you have done this. Then drain it down to below the level of the fitting before removing fully.

beat me to it!

[mrsmelly]

Just to help you with the costing side of things. I paid my leccy hook up bill today for three months, 91 days and it worked out at £1.89 pence per day. Absolutely peanuts and incudes lots of leccy stuff, a fridge a seperate freezer a tv two computers leccy kettle leccy grill large washing machine and immersion on 24/7  etc etc etc etc If you are ever going to use mains hook up its a no brainer to have an immersion.

[Paolo Reale]

Thanks to to all. Your responses have been really helpful.