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Tumshie

Mental Health Awareness Week

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11 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

It would appear that it's also National Foster Care Fortnight  and also Neurodiversity Celebration Week 🎉

 

May in America is Zombie Awareness Month 🧟‍♂️ :rolleyes:

 

And irony of irony not only is it Coeliac Awareness Week it's also National Doughnut Week. 😞

http://nationaldoughnutweek.org

National Doughnut Week was formed to raise money for The Children's Trust. 

 

 

 

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There's not enough weeks in the year, need to raise a Petition to increase it to 100

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Chap in a Rolls Royce got a puncture outside a mental hospital.  While he was changing the wheel he dropped all the wheEL nut down a drain. Up sidled a chap and suggested that if he took one wheel nut off from the other three wheels and used those instead it would get him home alright. What a brilliant idea said the Rolls owner, but excuse me are you a patient at the hospital there,  I am replied the patient. Well said the Rolls owner suggesting a brilliant thing like that I don't think there's much wrong with you and I shall write to the governors of that hospital and tell them so,  ooh thank you said the patient.   As the Rolls was moving off a brick came crashing through the rear window,  DON'T FORGET!!!. 

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55 minutes ago, LadyG said:

There's not enough weeks in the year, need to raise a Petition to increase it to 100

NO! Not more blasted metrication!

 

Tumshie, I didn't think "Here she goes again" at all. It's am important part of our lives - especially as, I would think, just about everybody thinks that they are sane and normal.

 

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At least Jeremy Kyle has made a contribution to mental health week by b******** off.

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4 hours ago, Tumshie said:

You are probbly thinking 'oh god here she goes again' but I just wanted to point out that it is also Mental Health Awareness Week this week. 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/48218327

 

https://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/campaigns/mental-health-awareness-week

 

https://www.mind.org.uk/get-involved/mental-health-awareness-week-2019

 

Our mental health is something we just don't talk openly about enough and a think we are all the worse off for that. But I understand that it is not something a lot of people, perhaps especially men, are comfortable talking about so I won't be pushing this thread as much as the other one, though I do feel a little guilty about that because out mental health is no less important than our physical health, so I may give it a little bump from time to time because it is such an important topic and shouldn't be missed. 

 

If any body feels they want to talk or just hear what others with mental health issues are saying then there is a mental health forum available. 

 

https://www.mentalhealthforum.net/forum/

 

 

 

At least you tried even if some of the replies were not what you were expecting.

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1 hour ago, Athy said:

NO! Not more blasted metrication!

 

Tumshie, I didn't think "Here she goes again" at all. It's am important part of our lives - especially as, I would think, just about everybody thinks that they are sane and normal.

 

 

It is an important part of our lives, though more immediate with some than others. It's interesting that you say "just about everybody thinks that they are sane and normal". I would have said the opposite. I certainly know that I am neither sane, nor normal, though the latter particularly isn't so important to me. Perhaps it is the setting and environment I grew up in, as well as my social group which makes me think this.

I wouldn't class anyone I know as normal or completely sane and I'm sure most of them wouldn't either. Though sane itself is a relative term anyway, usually meaning "normal relative to one's society". I think there is certainly a more healthy way to be, psychologically, than that.

Edited by eid
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32 minutes ago, eid said:

 

It is an important part of our lives, though more immediate with some than others. It's interesting that you say "just about everybody thinks that they are sane and normal". I would have said the opposite. I certainly know that I am neither sane, nor normal, though the latter particularly isn't so important to me. Perhaps it is the setting and environment I grew up in, as well as my social group which makes me think this.

I wouldn't class anyone I know as normal or completely sane and I'm sure most of them wouldn't either. Though sane itself is a relative term anyway, usually meaning "normal relative to one's society". I think there is certainly a more healthy way to be, psychologically, than that.

A carefully reasoned post, thank you.

I quite frequently say that narrowboaters (self included) are not "normal", as when you step back and look at it, narrowboating is a rather odd thing to do.

 

In reply to your comment about my previous post, I have read that many people with extreme views - flat-earthers, adherents of peculiar religious cults, loony lefties, etc. - believe that the silent majority agrees with them but won't say so. Although, come to think of it, some such people think that they're in step and everyone else is out of step, which rather contradicts the previous idea!

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41 minutes ago, Athy said:

A carefully reasoned post, thank you.

I quite frequently say that narrowboaters (self included) are not "normal", as when you step back and look at it, narrowboating is a rather odd thing to do.

 

In reply to your comment about my previous post, I have read that many people with extreme views - flat-earthers, adherents of peculiar religious cults, loony lefties, etc. - believe that the silent majority agrees with them but won't say so. Although, come to think of it, some such people think that they're in step and everyone else is out of step, which rather contradicts the previous idea!

 

You're right of course that some people who are far from sane have no perception of this at all, including those who suffer the most from mental illness. Sadly for them, having this kind of self-knowledge is the beginning of a journey towards well-being.

Edited by eid

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9 hours ago, Tumshie said:

You are probbly thinking 'oh god here she goes again' but I just wanted to point out that it is also Mental Health Awareness Week this week. 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/48218327

 

https://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/campaigns/mental-health-awareness-week

 

https://www.mind.org.uk/get-involved/mental-health-awareness-week-2019

 

Our mental health is something we just don't talk openly about enough and a think we are all the worse off for that. But I understand that it is not something a lot of people, perhaps especially men, are comfortable talking about so I won't be pushing this thread as much as the other one, though I do feel a little guilty about that because out mental health is no less important than our physical health, so I may give it a little bump from time to time because it is such an important topic and shouldn't be missed. 

 

If any body feels they want to talk or just hear what others with mental health issues are saying then there is a mental health forum available. 

 

https://www.mentalhealthforum.net/forum/

 

 

 

It is an area that has been a source of irritation to me over the years for a variety of reasons, the lack of parity of esteem between mental and physical health. Your comment about mental health being no less important than our physical health, I would rather tend to turn on it's head and claim that mental health is far more important than your physical health, it just isn't perceived that way. If someone is suffering from acute depression contracts a serious physical illness, the odds of dying are dramatically increased whereas someone with a mentally healthy outlook being diagnosed with a terminal illness, Rachel Bland immediately coming to mind, will often survive longer than expected.

 

You would never say to someone with cancer,"Oh come on, just pull yourself together", but that is the oft refrain towards people suffering from clinical depression along with that other favourite,"What have you got to be depressed about, look at how lucky you are job, family etc.etc". Even the mental health services have some pretty dismal opinions having personally been told that someone we had taken in after a suicide attempt was just 'attention seeking'.

 

It is all very well raising the awareness of mental health if the support is there for those who cry out for it, sadly in a lot of cases it simply isn't. There are a lot of people in prison suffering from serious mental illness but the view then becomes 'but they are just criminals' whereas the actual reason that they are there is because there is nowhere else for them. Whenever there is one of these awareness weeks the regular figure of 1 in 4 of us will suffer from mental illness at some time in our lives is trotted out, the trouble is that most people consider that it is something that is going to happen to someone else, until it happens to them and they find out the support they are likely to get is patchy at best.

Edited by Wanderer Vagabond
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7 hours ago, Athy said:

 - especially as, I would think, just about everybody thinks that they are sane and normal.

 

Not me, I've never been shy about discussing my own mental health.

In 20 years I've been admitted as an in-patient three times and expect to be on mood stabilisers for the rest of my life.

Being diagnosed with Bi-Polar was a fight in itself. 

Twenty years ago the belief was "No Labels" so I had to fight to get a diagnosis that I could understand, look up and do research on. 

That enabled me to predict cycles and prepare for triggers, not to mention avoiding situations that might threaten me.

Also getting the right meds and taking them as per instruction is essential.

 

if anyone wants to pm me I'm happy to discuss all and any of my own experiences.

 

Anyway ….. what does sane and normal mean?

I don't like the expression Bi-Polar as it is followed by the word "disorder" I much prefer "Manic Depression" …… if it was good enough for Spike then it's good enough for me.

Edited by zenataomm
That noise in the cellar started again
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26 minutes ago, zenataomm said:

Not me, I've never been shy about discussing my own mental health.

In 20 years I've been admitted as an in-patient three times and expect to be on mood stabilisers for the rest of my life.

Being diagnosed with Bi-Polar was a fight in itself. 

Twenty years ago the belief was "No Labels" so I had to fight to get a diagnosis that I could understand, look up and do research on. 

That enabled me to predict cycles and prepare for triggers, not to mention avoiding situations that might threaten me.

Also getting the right meds and taking them as per instruction is essential.

 

if anyone wants to pm me I'm happy to discuss all and any of my own experiences.

 

Anyway ….. what does sane and normal mean?

I don't like the expression Bi-Polar as it is followed by the word "disorder" I much prefer "Manic Depression" …… if it was good enough for Spike then it's good enough for me.

I seem to recall Stephen Fry's documentary on the subject of Manic Depression, he said he's keep the manic side of things since that was when he was at his most creative, if he could only lose the depressive side. Not sure why they decided to rename the condition, manic depressive was far more descriptive of it, bi-polar sounds like someone who swings both ways:huh:

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12 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

I seem to recall Stephen Fry's documentary on the subject of Manic Depression, he said he's keep the manic side of things since that was when he was at his most creative, if he could only lose the depressive side. Not sure why they decided to rename the condition, manic depressive was far more descriptive of it, bi-polar sounds like someone who swings both ways:huh:

I'm not sure about the "swinging both ways" bit.

However I most certainly agree with keep the manic and lose the depression, but …... and it's a massive BUT. Everyone who knows me would say the opposite as it's the mania they find horrible to be close to.

When I'm depressed I'm quiet, sleepy, and keep myself to myself (so far as they can see) whereas when I'm up I'm often described as a nightmare with few restraints on what I'll say or do next.  Great fun for me, but not others. 

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When someone we love has a mental health problem we find ourselves desperately trying to find that one thing that we can say to them that will make make a difference to how they feel or how they cope. Well, here's the thing that helps me cope - and it's probbly not what you might expect. 

 

It's a Bullet Journal. :D Whether like me you have the memory of your average goldfish, find it difficult to get motivated when you feel depressed, or difficult to stay on track when you're manic a bullet journal can adapt to and help you with that. Like most things it won't work miracles but it is well worth a little research. It does seem strange and a little over complicated to begin with but once you get the hang of the basic principle it's quite easy and a bit of a game changer. 

 

https://bulletjournal.com

 

It was developed quite by accident really by a chap who had/has ADHD to help him cope with his schooling and university, he introduced it to friends to help them cope with situations in their life and because they liked it and found it helpful he fine tuned it to what you get today. It's not just for school and university. Some online research onto the bullet journal will show you that there's a whole community of people who have developed this into a real art form but you don't have to do this you can keep it as basic and minimalist as suits you. 

 

This is a nice calm video explaining the basics of setting up a bullet journal by Rider Carroll the guy who developed it. 

 

 

 

 

I've included these videos too because I think they are informative on the subject but they are aimed at a slightly different audience than might be more common here, but all the same they might be helpful to someone. But this video while straight to the point and concise is possibly not calm. 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 15/05/2019 at 23:27, Wanderer Vagabond said:

I seem to recall Stephen Fry's documentary on the subject of Manic Depression, he said he's keep the manic side of things since that was when he was at his most creative, if he could only lose the depressive side. Not sure why they decided to rename the condition, manic depressive was far more descriptive of it, bi-polar sounds like someone who swings both ways:huh:

Totaly agree with the esteemed Mr Fry I use to love the manic phase, once wrote a detailed and very technical report of the top of my head in one frenzied evening session and presented it to my manager the next  morning who said "How the he*l did you do that l wish I could do it" and I thought to myself you probably wouldn't wish it if you knew what comes next. 

 

Fortunately, for me, those days are gone. 

Edited by reg
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1 hour ago, zenataomm said:

…….. which all goes to prove it's not only those of us on meds that need help and understanding, but also those undiagnosed and who are probably self medicating, however we also forget/ignore those who live with or care for those with poor mental health.

Without that support it's a slippery slope for one and all.

Society owes a great deal to unpaid carers as shown in this 

https://www.england.nhs.uk/commissioning/comm-carers/carer-facts/

To take one quote

"Carers make a major contribution to society. Estimates show that the care provided by friends and family members to ill, frail or disabled relatives is equivalent to £119 billion every year" 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, reg said:

Totaly agree with the esteemed Mr Fry I use to love the manic phase, once wrote a detailed and very technical report of the top of my head in one frenzied evening session and presented it to my manager the next  morning who said "How the he*l did you do that l wish I could do it" and I thought to myself you probably wouldn't wish it if you knew what comes next. 

 

Fortunately, for me, those days are gone. 

Without asking for any personal info, was that achieved through CBT or drugs? I have personal experience (although not of myself) of a depression sufferer and it was CBT that was the eventual gateway out of it, I don't know if that works for Manic Depression/Bi-Polar (whatever you want to call it).

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4 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

CBT

DBT - is also a very good process to try though it is not open to every one, it very much depends on your diagnosis whether or not you get a referral. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_behavior_therapy

 

But A big part of DBT is the practice of mindfulness.

 

 

Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction

 

There is an eight week mindfulness course, which I found very helpful, it takes eight weeks to cover all the aspects of the course but then you practice it regularly on your own after that. The course is often taught in private classes but can be accessed through the NHS, those placements are few and far between though I think. You can learn the technique at home and it's exactly the same course but you buy a book to teach you the why's and how's and practice the techniques listening to a downloadable podcast. The course is called Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction and the book and podcast are called Mindfulness in Eight Weeks and both are by Michael Chaskalson.

 

Michael Chaskalson developed the course and technique through / with the Psychology department at Bangor University. 

 

https://www.bangor.ac.uk/mindfulness/8weekcourse.php.en

 

Below is a link to the book at amazon. 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mindfulness-Eight-Weeks-revolutionary-clear/dp/0007591438/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=mindfulness+in+eight+weeks&qid=1558126145&s=gateway&sr=8-1

 

You can buy the book in audio book format and at the moment it's cheapest in apple iTunes. 

 

 

And the podcast with the practical mindfulness techniques. 

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/mindfulness-in-8-weeks-40-minutes-a-day-program/id1124468146

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/mindfulness-in-8-weeks-20-minutes-a-day-program/id1119607860

 

 

What Bangor say mindfulness can be used to help. 

 

People do also come to mindfulness courses to gain skills in dealing with particular conditions. We have worked with people with a range of problems including:

  • Heart disease
  • Chronic pain
  • High blood pressure
  • Headaches
  • Anxiety and panic
  • Depression
  • Sleep disturbance
  • Fatigue
  • Cancer and other long term illnesses
  • Skin disorders.

 

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14 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Without asking for any personal info, was that achieved through CBT or drugs? I have personal experience (although not of myself) of a depression sufferer and it was CBT that was the eventual gateway out of it, I don't know if that works for Manic Depression/Bi-Polar (whatever you want to call it).

In my case the clinical depression was just a side effect of more serious medical and neurological conditions so CBT would of been ineffective. Whilst CBT can be of use to some, and I believe many have benefited from it, our blessed government have to my mind adopted its use a bit to readily. A classic example is that the World Health Authority have for a long time recognised that  ME is a neurological condition and have indicated treatment paths for this condition which were largely taken up world wide. however our government decided that it would be cheaper to not accept the WHO findings and , largely because they were setting up CBT for other reasons and conditions, decided to offer CBT as the preferred treatment. 

As I have already said I believe CBT may well benefit many but If the underlying condition that causes the clinical depression  is not being dealt with then I see it as being of limited benefit in those such cases. 

Here is a conclusion from a BMJ article from 2012

"Given the historical perspective, that many neurological conditions are often misdiagnosed as mental health disorders, it is perhaps a wiser course of action to continue to demarcate the boundaries between psychological disorders and neurological disorders; if for no other reason than to minimise the potential for bias and illness misdiagnosis"

https://www.bmj.com/content/344/bmj.e3454/rr/586569

 

I have recently purchased a book called 

The Inflamed Mind by Proffesor Edward Bulmore

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/39899586-the-inflamed-mind

 

Who challenges much of the current thinking on mental health and makes assertions that many mental health issues may have their roots in the immune system. I have largely, through personal experience, come to the same conclusion and look forward to digesting the contents of  this book, however it isn't a light read and Warrants a line by line analysis with pencil and hilighter  in hand. 

 I am not yet in a position to say whether I agree with him or not but I do welcome his commitment to challenging  existing thinking. 

 

Edited by reg

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10 hours ago, reg said:

In my case the clinical depression was just a side effect of more serious medical and neurological conditions so CBT would of been ineffective. Whilst CBT can be of use to some, and I believe many have benefited from it, our blessed government have to my mind adopted its use a bit to readily. A classic example is that the World Health Authority have for a long time recognised that  ME is a neurological condition and have indicated treatment paths for this condition which were largely taken up world wide. however our government decided that it would be cheaper to not accept the WHO findings and , largely because they were setting up CBT for other reasons and conditions, decided to offer CBT as the preferred treatment. 

As I have already said I believe CBT may well benefit many but If the underlying condition that causes the clinical depression  is not being dealt with then I see it as being of limited benefit in those such cases. 

Here is a conclusion from a BMJ article from 2012

"Given the historical perspective, that many neurological conditions are often misdiagnosed as mental health disorders, it is perhaps a wiser course of action to continue to demarcate the boundaries between psychological disorders and neurological disorders; if for no other reason than to minimise the potential for bias and illness misdiagnosis"

https://www.bmj.com/content/344/bmj.e3454/rr/586569

 

I have recently purchased a book called 

The Inflamed Mind by Proffesor Edward Bulmore

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/39899586-the-inflamed-mind

 

Who challenges much of the current thinking on mental health and makes assertions that many mental health issues may have their roots in the immune system. I have largely, through personal experience, come to the same conclusion and look forward to digesting the contents of  this book, however it isn't a light read and Warrants a line by line analysis with pencil and hilighter  in hand. 

 I am not yet in a position to say whether I agree with him or not but I do welcome his commitment to challenging  existing thinking. 

 

Sounds an interesting theory, let us know whether it all makes sense once you've read the book. I lean towards the belief that the immune system is a significant factor in a lot, possibly a majority of illnesses so cannot see any reason why it should not be of similar relevance in mental illnesses since they are, after all, just another illness. Medical opinion is in agreement that the likes of Rheumatoid Arthritis is an immune system failure as the body attacks it's own joints and of course the likes of AIDS is a failure of the immune system. I can see cancer being a failure of the immune system since we generally have mutations occurring at the cellular level on a fairly regular basis and the body deals with them, when the body stops dealing with them the tumours then grow. Dementia caused by Lewy bodies is a result of the body failing to deal with a protein build up in the brain so if Bulmore is proposing that other forms of mental illness is also caused by immune system failure, why not? Sounds a plausible theory.

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