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max size boat for all network


umpire111

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am sure this will have been raised many times but cannot find any references to it. Intending to have a new build and have set in my mind that 57ft was the max length that can navigate the whole network. My builder assures me a 58ft can manage all locks, may mean going at an angle in some? What about the buttons at front and rear? can some one tell me max. size for this network please and where are shortest locks.

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17 minutes ago, umpire111 said:

am sure this will have been raised many times but cannot find any references to it. Intending to have a new build and have set in my mind that 57ft was the max length that can navigate the whole network. My builder assures me a 58ft can manage all locks, may mean going at an angle in some? What about the buttons at front and rear? can some one tell me max. size for this network please and where are shortest locks.

The lock in Brandon is the shortest one I know

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With 57ft on the L&L, we managed every lock, but got very wet/full foredeck and were unable to escape leaking gates. With a 60 ft boat you can make most diagonally, but you would have to single lock, and have no leeway to escape leakage. For the sake of 3ft, err on the side of caution.

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1 minute ago, Ex Brummie said:

With 57ft on the L&L, we managed every lock, but got very wet/full foredeck and were unable to escape leaking gates. With a 60 ft boat you can make most diagonally, but you would have to single lock, and have no leeway to escape leakage. For the sake of 3ft, err on the side of caution.

I took my 57 footer across the full length of the L and L paired with a sixty footer, we did every lock together. It does get damp but a sixty footer has no problem on the L and L. 62 foot will go diagonaly. 57 foot on its own rattles around with room to spare. The only thing my mate had to do was lift his button on his sixty footer. It does get a bit damp.

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21 minutes ago, Ex Brummie said:

With a 60 ft boat you can make most diagonally, but you would have to single lock, and have no leeway to escape leakage.

 

17 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

62 foot will go diagonaly.

No. All the short locks on the L&L will take a 62ft boat with no problems, if the boat can shed water front and back.

 

I would happily (if slowly!) take a 64ft boat across the full length of the L&L, and I could share all except 1 lock with a boat of 45ft or less.

 

ETA:

For what it's worth, I live on the L&L except when I am playing out on other waterways.   You can choose to believe occasional visitors if you want though.  They are not exactly wrong, but they are used to them soft easy shallow narrow Midlands locks :D

 

Edited by TheBiscuits
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We are 58ft 6ins, without bow and stern fenders. ( we got the odd 6 inches gratis!)

A few years ago we did the Leeds Liverpool,  Calder and Hebble and Rochdale clockwise. Going Katie corner going up was interesting in the shorter Calder and hebble locks, but we did not have to lift the fenders.

But we did get moist coming down some of the leaky locks on the L&L, particularly on the five rise.

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6 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

I thought there was a 40' lock somewhere on the Middle Levels?

Brandon lock on the Little Ouse.  I think there is only something like half a mile navigable past the lock, so not a big deal if you can’t get through it.

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Depends what you mean by go anywhere - but anything longer than about  57 feet cuts out two of the three cross pennine routes, I'll leave others to discuss what the precise length is. Personally if I was planning to cruise these routes I would stick at 55 so as not to be stressing through the shorter locks - that said I took my then 62 footer (Ripple) to Lancaster via the 62 foot locks on the Rufford branch. I also took it to Huddersfield via the HNC both ways.

 

There is one very short lock on the little Ouse, but as others have said it only gives access to about half a mile or river. 

 

I should caveat that with the fact that the two boats I own are 45 foot and 23 foot, and my cruise plans currently involve the shorter one!

Edited by magpie patrick
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9 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

No. All the short locks on the L&L will take a 62ft boat with no problems, if the boat can shed water front and back.

 

I would happily (if slowly!) take a 64ft boat across the full length of the L&L, and I could share all except 1 lock with a boat of 45ft or less.

 

ETA:

For what it's worth, I live on the L&L except when I am playing out on other waterways.   You can choose to believe occasional visitors if you want though.  They are not exactly wrong, but they are used to them soft easy shallow narrow Midlands locks :D

 

I think the problem is that many think they are filling the lock when they are not touching gates both ends. I took my seventy footer through Thorne lock which is supposed to be impossible. We did it very slowly and the steel shell was touching top gate and bottom gate. In fairness there may have been three eighths of an inch on occasion at either end due to water movement. Thats what I call a full lock.

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1 hour ago, mrsmelly said:

I think the problem is that many think they are filling the lock when they are not touching gates both ends. I took my seventy footer through Thorne lock which is supposed to be impossible. We did it very slowly and the steel shell was touching top gate and bottom gate. In fairness there may have been three eighths of an inch on occasion at either end due to water movement. Thats what I call a full lock.

Others have done this as well but still their is one on here that says it cant be done! I have watched a 68 footer go through Thorne interesting is what I will say

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3 hours ago, john6767 said:

Brandon lock on the Little Ouse.  I think there is only something like half a mile navigable past the lock, so not a big deal if you can’t get through it.

But if you could get through there would probably be more. The EA didn't build it any longer because no longer boats were going up there, they couldnt because of the short lock, now no one goes past Brandon because those that would can't get there. Chicken and egg

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This length issue has been argued.... at length. There's all sorts of ifs and buts, quite a few probables and possibles, and a smattering of definitely maybes.  End of the day though, there's loads of 57' boats which, rightly or wrongly, convention says is the "go anywhere" length. Why not go with the flow - even of there is a bit of margin, it's not a million miles out. There's lots to choose from in that bracket too.  Alternatively,  push the boundaries, explore the envelope and maybe even miss the odd spot off the list - in reality, few of us actually do go everywhere even if our boats can.

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Except for a few strange locks in odd corners of the system, the Salterhebble locks are the shortest. Many people have successfully taken 60' boats through them, with care and damp feet. All the other locks, 60' is fine. If you want the most internal space it doesn't seem sensible to go for 57' for the sake of a couple of locks that you might go through once a year, and can get through anyway with 60'. But as Sea Dog says, unless you're buying new there are a lot more 57' boats to choose from...

Edited by IanD
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9 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

This length issue has been argued.... at length. There's all sorts of ifs and buts, quite a few probables and possibles, and a smattering of definitely maybes.  End of the day though, there's loads of 57' boats which, rightly or wrongly, convention says is the "go anywhere" length. Why not go with the flow - even of there is a bit of margin, it's not a million miles out. There's lots to choose from in that bracket too.  Alternatively,  push the boundaries, explore the envelope and maybe even miss the odd spot off the list - in reality, few of us actually do go everywhere even if our boats can.

This is very true. I know of many and I mean many people who restricted themselves to 57 foot boats after doing research as to going anywhere. A lot of those people have owned boats now in excess of twenty years and often longer and have still never been north of Brum or Nottingham. A friend has owned his 57 footer for 10 years and is still at his first mooring on the Oxford and never ventures beyond the Thames or further north than Rugby.  There are many boaters like this. If you dont go where the short boat length is needed then dont restrict yourself to one unless its the only boat you like, which is doubtful.

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When I had a proper job I would sometimes get the train from Southampton and whilst waiting the sleeper to Ford William would go through. It made be feel good, maybe one day I could get that train,  but I knew I was getting the train to Birmingham for another work meeting.

 

I think many aspiring and real boaters are like that, they are going to live on their marina mooring and maybe do a few miles up the cut once a while, but they want to know that they could go "up North" if they ever wanted to.

 

................Dave

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2 minutes ago, Johny London said:

Don't forget this useful resource...

https://www.abnb.co.uk/submenupages/length.html

Its as much use as a chocolate fireguard. Just for one as a for instance Stainforth and Keadby states 65 foot by 17 foor odd, when in reality a 70 foot narrowboat can use the canal. A huge difference when narrowboating.

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