Fishing

[Sea Dog]

18 minutes ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

On the other hand, they spend a great deal on schemes that primarily benefit walkers and cyclists.  

The reality is, of course, those schemes come with grant money.

[Jerra]

59 minutes ago, mark99 said:

Many places advertise day tickets available on the bank but the bailiff is never seen to collect. Most of my local gu was like that before I left Cart waters. These are the same waters that as a kid every weekend the bailiff came round on his bike and took a shilling off us kids. Their web site says pay on bank.

 

Now on Wey the same largely applies. Never seen the Guildford bailiff who sells day tickets on the bank. Nor Wey Navigation Amalgamation bailiff who sells tickets too on the bank.

So if there is no Bailiff to buy from you don't fish.   Just as if there is no shop keeper in sight you can't shop, if you do its called stealing.

[howardang]

52 minutes ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Crt spend a load of cash on providing facilities/ services for the likes of cyclists, walkers, dog walkers. These groups are not expected to pay. Just because a system exists that charges some groups but not others, and has existed for some time, does not automatically mean the system is morally correct. I'll suggest CRT spend nothing on 'managing their fishery', other than having information on their website about it. Certainly, they haven't gone to the trouble of erecting signs on the waters to advertise that they own the fishing rights, and how folk may purchase permits. On the other hand, they spend a great deal on schemes that primarily benefit walkers and cyclists.  

You are welcome to your opinion of course; we will just have to differ. 

 

Howard

[Sea Dog]

14 minutes ago, Jerra said:

So if there is no Bailiff to buy from you don't fish.   Just as if there is no shop keeper in sight you can't shop, if you do its called stealing.

Let's not get too polarised. If the sign says day tickets are available on the bank, it's not unreasonable to fish and pay if/when the vendor arrives.  I've certainly been to fisheries where that is exactly how it works.  If no-one charges you, you haven't caused the club any material loss: rather they've not taken the opportunity to collect the revenue, but the sign gives fair warning that a payment can be expected.  Permit only signs, however, do not imply any right to fish without first obtaining one.

[mark99]

4 hours ago, Jerra said:

So if there is no Bailiff to buy from you don't fish.   Just as if there is no shop keeper in sight you can't shop, if you do its called stealing.

 

I can tell you know nothing about this subject.

[Jerra]

33 minutes ago, mark99 said:

 

I can tell you know nothing about this subject.

You don't need to know a lot to realise that if a notice says day tickets are needed you shouldn't be fishing without one.  At least back in the days when I fished that was the case.

[WotEver]

2 minutes ago, Jerra said:

You don't need to know a lot to realise that if a notice says day tickets are needed you shouldn't be fishing without one.  At least back in the days when I fished that was the case.

See post #29

[Jerra]

2 minutes ago, WotEver said:

See post #29

I don't however agree with post #29.     Using that logic if a notice says tickets are available on the door and you arrive before the box office opens it is reasonable to go in and enjoy the performance until somebody comes round and asks you to show your ticket.  Which won't happen as they expected you to obtain your ticket before you start to enjoy the performance.

[WotEver]

Just now, Jerra said:

I don't however agree with post #29.     Using that logic if a notice says tickets are available on the door and you arrive before the box office opens it is reasonable to go in and enjoy the performance until somebody comes round and asks you to show your ticket.  Which won't happen as they expected you to obtain your ticket before you start to enjoy the performance.

Poor example.

 

The fishing notice doesn’t say that tickets are available on the door. It says they’ll be collected by a man walking down the towpath. It’s therefore perfectly reasonable for you to expect a man to walk down the towpath. If he doesn’t it’s not because of any failing of yours. 

[mark99]

1 minute ago, Jerra said:

I don't however agree with post #29.     Using that logic if a notice says tickets are available on the door and you arrive before the box office opens it is reasonable to go in and enjoy the performance until somebody comes round and asks you to show your ticket.  Which won't happen as they expected you to obtain your ticket before you start to enjoy the performance.

 

You are struggling now to justify your initial position with ridiculous analogies.

[Jerra]

2 minutes ago, WotEver said:

Poor example.

 

The fishing notice doesn’t say that tickets are available on the door. It says they’ll be collected by a man walking down the towpath. It’s therefore perfectly reasonable for you to expect a man to walk down the towpath. If he doesn’t it’s not because of any failing of yours. 

Which part of "available on the bank" or from the Bailiff" says start fishing before you find him.   Note IMO it is up to you to find him not the other way round.

[WotEver]

8 minutes ago, Jerra said:

Note IMO it is up to you to find him not the other way round.

That’s the problem. Your opinion is wrong. That isn’t how it works. 

[Jerra]

7 minutes ago, WotEver said:

That’s the problem. Your opinion is wrong. That isn’t how it works. 

Perhaps that is how people expect it to go, but I can't think of any other situation where you sit back knowing you should pay, make no attempt to pay and then just shrug at the end and walk away.   Can you think of any?

 

Follow that by do you consider it morally right to use a clubs water and perhaps the fish it has paid to stock and make no attempt to pay your dues?

[Machpoint005]

6 hours ago, The Welsh Cruiser said:

Crt spend a load of cash on providing facilities/ services for the likes of cyclists, walkers, dog walkers. These groups are not expected to pay. Just because a system exists that charges some groups but not others, and has existed for some time, does not automatically mean the system is morally correct. I'll suggest CRT spend nothing on 'managing their fishery', other than having information on their website about it. Certainly, they haven't gone to the trouble of erecting signs on the waters to advertise that they own the fishing rights, and how folk may purchase permits. On the other hand, they spend a great deal on schemes that primarily benefit walkers and cyclists.  

 

I think you'll find that CRT provides the water the fish swim in, but perhaps you know better?

[WotEver]

35 minutes ago, Jerra said:

Can you think of any?

Nope, but I don’t need to as we’re not discussing anything else, just fishing. I’m not a fishist myself but a mate of mine is and if he’s fishing anywhere that he’s not a member of the club he just sets up and pays the bailiff when he walks by. If the bailiff doesn’t turn up then my mate has cost the club nowt, so no harm done. 

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, Jerra said:

You don't need to know a lot to realise that if a notice says day tickets are needed you shouldn't be fishing without one.  At least back in the days when I fished that was the case.

And a lot say "No day Tickets" so you cant fish

[Mike Todd]

58 minutes ago, Jerra said:

Perhaps that is how people expect it to go, but I can't think of any other situation where you sit back knowing you should pay, make no attempt to pay and then just shrug at the end and walk away.   Can you think of any?

 

Follow that by do you consider it morally right to use a clubs water and perhaps the fish it has paid to stock and make no attempt to pay your dues?

Perhaps comes into the same category as when you spot that a shopkeeper has undercharged you. You may not have an obligation to point it out (it could be implied that by stating a different price it counts as an offer to trade) but is it morally expected?

 

Not all things in life are entirely regulated by specific laws.

[mark99]

Most anglers turn up and fish at the best time which is often dawn.

 

When it says day ticket on the bank, the bailiff is not there at dawn - he will amble along and collect the money from anglers whom have started. If one sat on ones fishing box waiting for the bailiff to collect your money before you fished, one would be regarded as "odd" at best!

 

Other dayticket waters (mainly small water commercials with one way in and out) may insist on paying before you fish but it's made clear.

 

London Underground was a bit like that before automation. Ticket office closed - you pay at other end or on the train. You did not just walk home because the ticket office was closed.

Edited March 21, 2019 by mark99

[Arthur Marshall]

Not being a fisherbod, I struggle to see the problem,or the costs involved in maintaining fish in a canal or river. Fish largely make more fish, and while fishermen seem to kill a few, most get chucked back. Again, I always thought of it as a casual hobby, especially for boaters. I'd imagine hardly any have a licence of any sort. I presume the fishing rights owners use the money they raise for competition prizes rather than improving the towpath or medical schemes for trout, or whatever it is swimming about down there. 

[Sea Dog]

4 hours ago, Jerra said:

Which part of "available on the bank" or from the Bailiff" says start fishing before you find him.   Note IMO it is up to you to find him not the other way round.

That's very practical!  So, for example, you turn up to fish a 5 mile stretch of canal at 0900 and walk the entire length before you start looking for a guy who pitches up about 1500? Best travel light... and carry a torch in winter!

 

In case that doesn't make it clear enough - the Bailiff doesn't turn up each day at a fixed time with a stall and await business - he pitches up as and when and checks the water, collecting revenue if there's an opportunity to do so.

[mark99]

One of the best day ticket bailiffs I ever met is Stuart the full time one on the LAA stretch of the Hants Avon. He walks up to 12 miles a day covering all the river and carriers including the canalised stretch. He will text you if the river is good condition and grab beginners gear and take them to easy stretches if they are struggling. In addition he nets out floating debris, clears any land litter and operates the multitudes of sluices. He always collects the £8 day fee for the club. You cannot predict when he turns up but turn up he does.

 

Edited March 21, 2019 by mark99

[ditchcrawler]

On 21/03/2019 at 15:04, ditchcrawler said:

And a lot say "No day Tickets" so you cant fish

 

[mark99]

34 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

 

Indeed. These days a simple web search gives you the info you need. Ie day tickets on bank. Day ticket before you fish or no day tickets. Or free fishing in some cases only need a rod licence. 

[Jim Riley]

On 20/03/2019 at 21:52, Jerra said:

It may be terribly old fashioned but if you find yourself in a position where you can't get the required permits there is a very easy solution.

 

 

 

 

Don't fish!

Not fishing, just drowning this maggot, m'lud.