First volockie irritation of the year.

[MtB]

15 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

But this is still no reason to force volockies onto people who do actually know what they are doing!

Edited 13 minutes ago by nicknorman

 

And who would prefer to do it themselves than have it done to them. 

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

Right, I feel obliged to join in again.

 

I have spent years defending volunteer lock keepers against grumpy old boaters, with just cause.  For clarity, I consider many of my "local" vollies personal friends - I would buy all of them a beer, and some of them get invited to family parties..  Yesterday I came across a bad vollie, and I am launching a formal complaint to CRT about him.

 

We were coming up Grindley Brook Staircase on the Llangollen yesterday, and I was struggling with walking due to an injury to my knee caused by tripping over sticking out bolt threads on Hack Green locks.

 

The first vollie we came across was seemingly upset that I wasn't being fast enough to suit him.  I had to limp up the steps at the bottom of the staircase, and I pushed the lock gate open just before the (moving) boat hit it, and then limped back down to get on the boat before it disappeared into the lock.

 

This upset the vollie, presumably because I wasn't doing enough work at his speed.  He then asked if I was working on my own , and I answered yes - Mrs Biscuits was inside the boat looking after our toddler, so I was indeed working the locks singlehanded, but with very fragile passengers.

 

He then stomped up to the next set of gates and before I was in position wound up the paddles, slamming our boat forward and knocking our two-year old off his feet.  I chose to assume that he was merely careless in the first case, so gritted my teeth and continued into the next part of the staircase.

 

At the next set of gates, he had a word with another vollie, and they both slapped the paddles up before I was in position with my boat, and neither of them checked with me or even made eye contact.  This was repeated in the third lock, and they even managed to rip a holding line around the ladder out of my hands while I had my boat in emergency astern - 3000 rpm in reverse.  At no point did they ask me if I wanted any assistance, at no point did they check that I was in the correct position to open the paddles, and they worked the locks to suit themselves, not my boat. 

 

Our boat was slammed into the gates by the undertow from the upper lock chamber on every single lock on the staircase.  For clarity, we usually ride the bow up the plate on the head gates so the boat can never slam forward into the gate.

 

We have done over 500 locks this year, and those three were the only ones that flipped little Bob Biscuits off his feet, specifically including the ones on the BCN Challenge when we were racing and trying to work locks as fast as they can cycle. (under 4 minutes average across the whole BCN if it matters.)

 

Hotwash:  I should have leaned on the horn button until they stopped doing what they were doing in the bottom lock of the staircase, not trusted them to work "their" locks.  I should have formally refused them permission to "help" anymore going up the flight through the next sets of gates. 

 

It is not a mistake I will make on the way down the staircase, and I do not care how busy the staircase is.  I will formally and on video refuse their "help" on the paddles.  If they still want to push gate beams that is fantastic, but if they take the hump I will work the staircase singlehanded., and I won't care if that upsets the waiting boats.

 

It is the most unprofessional "assistance" we have ever had from CRT volunteers, and it put my child at risk.  I say that as a formerly keen supporter of CRT volunteers, who until yesterday was delighted to see a blue T-shirt at a lock.

[nicknorman]

This is the problem - inconsistency. Some volockies are fine, some are awful, with shades in between.  You should have just stopped your boat in the lock after the first event and refused to move until they cleared off. But that is the second problem - one is caught off guard and unprepared.

Edited August 9, 2019 by nicknorman

[ditchcrawler]

I had my first ever disagreement on the Stratford flight when he stopped Dian setting the lock below until I had started to drain the one above, he went off in a huff with another volockie who was with a boat 3 locks ahead. His reason was that he wanted the water from the lock above to fill the   lock below, the fact it would have gone over the spill weir was beyond him..

[frangar]

I’ve been known to ask the vollie to abstain from winding a paddle....I think the actual phrase was “Not f**king yet” as I too like to ride the gate having been shot down a lock before.....I thought they had got better this year but maybe there’s still a few rogue ones in the wild that haven’t been culled yet..

[Chris Williams]

I suspect the bad ones are wannabe boaters, who have never handled a boat in their lives, and have no idea of the effect on a boat of incorrect actions.   Perhaps you could use one as a bow fender.

[Chewbacka]

I was told last year by a volunteer that I must not have the front of the boat passed the cill marker line when going up in a lock as it is dangerous.  He did not know why, just told it was.

[Mike Tee]

5 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

I was told last year by a volunteer that I must not have the front of the boat passed the cill marker line when going up in a lock as it is dangerous.  He did not know why, just told it was.

I wonder if he thought it was OK to have the back past it going down........................

[pearley]

On 30/07/2019 at 22:53, TheBiscuits said:

 

There are 6 on Stanley Dock Flight, dozens on Wigan, 4 on Johnson's Hillock, 4 on Blackburn, 6 on Barrowford, none I have ever met on Greenberfield, 6 on Bank Newton and 4 on Gragrave ...  have you recently moved on the L&L?!!

Wish we had had some of those. Plenty at Wigan when we came up,  none at Johnsons Hillock but there was some sort of CRT supervisor taking photos of the new footbridge but wouldn't makeveyd contact. 2 at Blackburn who were being assessed. (And I was glad to see them having been stoned by kids at every lock last time we were there) none at Greenberfield but lots of boats coming up so no so much work to do, 2 at Bank Newton who went ahead and set each lock leaving us and a hire boat to come down on our own (which was fine) and one at Gargrave who wouldn't let any single boats down, but a couple of singles up and was for ever asking how long we were going to be filling our water tank. Now moored above the 5 rise. Very few boats today but seem to insist that a single boat coming up must leave the top lock before the single boat waiting to descend can start down. Unlike the wonderful Barry who would cross boats over in the chamber.

 

Edited to say that Bank Newton and Gargrave locks have notices on the balance beams asking/advising/telling you to not touch the bottom gates.

Edited August 9, 2019 by pearley

[ditchcrawler]

51 minutes ago, pearley said:

  No moored above the 5 rise. Very few boats today but seem to insist that a single boat coming up must leave the top lock before the single boat waiting to descend cannstarg down. Unlike the wonderful Barry who would cross boats over in the chamber.

 

Edited to say that Bank Newton and Gargrave locks have notices on the balance beams asking/advising/telling you to not touch the bottom gates.

She brought us all the way up, fiddling with paddles both sides all the time so I was all over the place before she would let the one at the bottom even start up

[MHS]

1 hour ago, pearley said:

and one at Gargrave who wouldn't let any single boats down, but a couple of singles up and was for ever asking how long we were going to be filling our water tank.

I wonder if they will still do this when we come down in 8 or 9 days time if after the heavy rain:

Foulridge is 100% full and water is flowing over all the bywashes. 

[Iain_S]

6 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

I had my first ever disagreement on the Stratford flight when he stopped Dian setting the lock below until I had started to drain the one above, he went off in a huff with another volockie who was with a boat 3 locks ahead. His reason was that he wanted the water from the lock above to fill the   lock below, the fact it would have gone over the spill weir was beyond him..

Surely, in a water saving situation, the lock below should be filling BEFORE the one above is emptied???

[pearley]

1 hour ago, MHS said:

I wonder if they will still do this when we come down in 8 or 9 days time if after the heavy rain:

Foulridge is 100% full and water is flowing over all the bywashes. 

You should be ok. Restrictions lifted but not at Bingley of Wigan.

[MHS]

56 minutes ago, pearley said:

You should be ok. Restrictions lifted but not at Bingley of Wigan.

There’s plenty of water up here, but that’s just my point. I wonder if the vlockies will still want to restrict individual boats if second boats don’t arrive. 

Edited August 9, 2019 by MHS

[nicknorman]

5 minutes ago, MHS said:

There’s plenty of water up here, but that’s just my point. I wonder if the vlockies will still want to restrict individual boats if second boats don’t arrive. 

When the thrift code was on, we were told to wait 15 mins at Newlay. Also the guy at Gargrave was a right moaner about single use locks. He was a CRT employee though. But with the restrictions lifted, presumably the thrift code is also lifted.

 

After the guy at Gargrave had had a right old gripe at Jeff (who is mr mild mannered avoid confrontation) about the number of single boats using the locks, Jeff said to him “perhaps it would be best to ban boats altogether”. I think he got the message and after that was much nicer. We had done much of the L&L in company with another boat but we had separated in Gargrave (they had to go home) and this was the first lock we had done as a singleton.

 

Anyway, unless there is a proper lock keeper in charge, the volockies have no power to tell you what to do. Don’t put up with any BS from them!

[Keeping Up]

Maybe they'll do like the vollies we met at both Braunston and Bosley last year. On each occasion we were held up for a few hours because a vollie at the top of the flight was determined not to let anyone start down until a boat had come up, while a vollie at the bottom of the flight was equally determined not to let anyone start up until a boat had come down. There were queues top and bottom, and each time it took a very strong complaint to CRT before a proper locky was sent to sort things out.

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Iain_S said:

Surely, in a water saving situation, the lock below should be filling BEFORE the one above is emptied???

But as he said to my wife as he stomped off, "he obviously doesn't understand water flow"

[Lily Rose]

Do CRT employees and/or volockies have to carry ID?

 

If so, do they have to produce it on request?

[nicknorman]

Boaters are at fault for allowing volockies to take charge. If you want to traverse a flight of locks you just do it.

[MtB]

1 hour ago, Lily Rose said:

Do CRT employees and/or volockies have to carry ID?

 

If so, do they have to produce it on request?

 

This is a very good point I was wondering about too. When in a confrontation with a twat of a vollie, demanding their ID and photographing it with your phone might get them to moderate their behaviour. 

 

And a refusal to produce ID along with CRT authorisation puts them on the back foot and in a very weak position to argue the toss about being ignored. 

 

 

[Lily Rose]

On 09/08/2019 at 22:34, Lily Rose said:

Do CRT employees and/or volockies have to carry ID?

 

If so, do they have to produce it on request

Does anybody know?   (Surely someone must)

[Rob-M]

6 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

Does anybody know?   (Surely someone must)

I'm not aware of an official ID card for volunteers, I don't have anything for my volunteering role, although most have a CRT name badge that they wear.

 

[roland elsdon]

Photographing them wouldnt be a bad idea. After all they can make all kinds of allegations about boats and owners  who are identifiable, but you have no idea who they are or indeed who to praise or indeed complain about.

[Spanners]

There's a couple of good locky,s on  bank newton and gargrave , , but also one volunteer that needs educating that he down,t actually own the canal

[Quaffer]

On 09/08/2019 at 22:34, Lily Rose said:

Do CRT employees and/or volockies have to carry ID?

 

If so, do they have to produce it on request?

In London & Southeast region Volunteer Lock Keepers are issued with name badges but this will give christian names only.However there is a rota for each VLK site ,so it is easy for CRT to identify which volunteer is on duty on any given day.There is also a sign in sheet at the location which is filled out before duty begins.

 

Volunteer Mooring Rangers have photo ID which is a Boat Licence Customer Support ID card authorised by CRT Head of Boating.

 

I do not know what ID is carried by CRT employees but my guess is that it relates to their function.

 

Hope this helps