Gas leak

[treddieafloat]

My boat safety inspection has identified a minor gas leak somewhere in the gas system

option 1 pay a gas technician to find the leak and fix it 

option 2 spend £50 at screw fix for a gas sniffer and try to do it myself

option 3 find a friendly local boater (Wakefield area) who owns a gas sniffer who is willing to lend it to me or would run it around the pipes in return for a few drinks.

If you could recommend any one for option 1 or fit the bill for option 3 I'd love to hear from you 

cheers

treddie

[Tony Brooks]

Remember tyo test the   "taps" on the gas stove. They can leak when   grease drys out.

[treddieafloat]

Thanks we had gas supply to all appliances turned off still dropping suggests it's in the pipe/connections somewhere 

[Bee]

What have you got that runs on gas? If its just the cooker then you probably have just a length of pipe from the gas locker to the cooker with just one union at the back of the cooker. Just follow the pipe from the locker and brush a bit of soapy water on any joints, little bubbles mean a leak. check for chafe if it passes through things. As Tony says, gas taps on cookers can and do leak. Its best to get a replacement if that is the problem. (Tap, not the whole cooker!,)

[Tony Brooks]

I find the just the lifting in and out of gas bottles tends to loosen the pipe between regulator and bulkhead fitting where the supply passes through the gas tank into the boat. This tends to get masked because the smell can drop down inside the tank and exit the boat via the tank drain so you do not smell it until it gets worse.

[Machpoint005]

26 minutes ago, treddieafloat said:

My boat safety inspection has identified a minor gas leak somewhere in the gas system

option 1 pay a gas technician to find the leak and fix it 

option 2 spend £50 at screw fix for a gas sniffer and try to do it myself

option 3 find a friendly local boater (Wakefield area) who owns a gas sniffer who is willing to lend it to me or would run it around the pipes in return for a few drinks.

If you could recommend any one for option 1 or fit the bill for option 3 I'd love to hear from you 

cheers

treddie

 

Option 1 every time, if you value your safety.

It would help to know where you are as a Manchester gas safe techie wouldn't want to go to London (for example).

[treddieafloat]

Thanks all I'm on the Calder and Hebble at Horbury near Wakefield. Soapy water sounds like a good starting point. Gas runs to boiler, cooker and fridge think I will start at locker and work my way through the entire system. Got to walk the dog first so sorry if I don't reply to posts for a while

[Machpoint005]

8 minutes ago, treddieafloat said:

sorry if I don't reply to posts for a while

 

That's OK -- it's your thread and you have been back twice already!

Somebody will be along soon with a local recommendation.

[haggis]

Undiluted washing up liquid is better than soapy water for finding gas leaks.

 

Haggis

[alan_fincher]

Even better use the proper thing for spraying on any poentially laeking joint - it's not expensive....
 

Example here.

 

Whilst you can use a washing up liquid / water mix (nneds to be fairly strong), it is surprisingly recommended you don't, as the residue left on does cause corrision.

This will find very small leaks, and can be put around cooker taps and joints, as well as thse on the supply ipework.

2 minutes ago, haggis said:

Undiluted washing up liquid is better than soapy water for finding gas leaks.

 

Haggis

If you go that route, in my exerience a 50/50 water mix s about as good as it gets, but recommendation is not to, and to use the proper product.

[haggis]

4 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 

If you go that route, in my exerience a 50/50 water mix s about as good as it gets, but recommendation is not to, and to use the proper product.

I agree that proper gas leak testing stuff is far better but I mentioned undiluted washing up liquid in case the OP thought that a basin of water with a squirt of washing up liquid would do the job.  When I have used washing up liquid in the past (not having the proper stuff to hand) I wash it off afterwards.  The main thing is to find the leak then worry about rusting ? 

 

haggis

[alan_fincher]

7 minutes ago, haggis said:

I agree that proper gas leak testing stuff is far better but I mentioned undiluted washing up liquid in case the OP thought that a basin of water with a squirt of washing up liquid would do the job.  When I have used washing up liquid in the past (not having the proper stuff to hand) I wash it off afterwards.  The main thing is to find the leak then worry about rusting ? 

 

haggis

I don't disagree, and think it is important to day that "soapy water" as people often say will not really cut it.  It does have to be a very strong mix to stay around the joints long enough to see the bubbles.

I suspect many boats actually have a leak somewhere slow enough that a full manometer test in a BSS done properly will find it, but where in reality it is so slow that the gas will disperse harmlessly long before there is any danger of a build up.  It's still a very good idea to have no leaks though!

[cuthound]

58 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

I suspect many boats actually have a leak somewhere slow enough that a full manometer test in a BSS done properly will find it, but where in reality it is so slow that the gas will disperse harmlessly long before there is any danger of a build up.  

 

Problem on a boat is that gas doesn't necessarily disperse harmlessly.

 

LPG, being heavier than air tends to accumulate in the bilges, then when sufficient has leaked to reach the lower explosive level just requires a spark to blow your boat up. (Unless the boat has bilge blowers fitted).

[dor]

A good nose is suprisingly efficient.  Before trying anything else I would turn off the gas at the cylinder, ventilate the boat, then turn gas back on and sniff every joint.

If you don't find it that way then nothing lost. Next would be a tin of gas leak detector.

[Boater Sam]

Integrity of a boat gas system must be 100%, no leak is acceptable.

Proper leak spray is cheap and easy to obtain from Screwfix etc. Better than detergent and does not cause the same corrosion.

If you can isolate the system in part it is easier.

 

Do not assume that there is only one leak!

Integrity of a boat gas system must be 100%, no leak is acceptable.

Proper leak spray is cheap and easy to obtain from Screwfix etc. Better than detergent and does not cause the same corrosion.

If you can isolate the system in part it is easier.

 

Do not assume that there is only one leak!

[treddieafloat]

Thanks again I will .pick up some spray tomorrow and let you know how I get on. The leak is minor gas safety chap didn't think it a risk but had to rightly fail us.

cheers

treddie

[alan_fincher]

1 hour ago, cuthound said:

 

Problem on a boat is that gas doesn't necessarily disperse harmlessly.

 

LPG, being heavier than air tends to accumulate in the bilges, then when sufficient has leaked to reach the lower explosive level just requires a spark to blow your boat up. (Unless the boat has bilge blowers fitted).

I know all this.

However I don't think you'll find much evidence of exploded canal  boats resulting from the kind of very slow leak we are talking about.

Any evidence at all in fact, I rather suspect.

 

I'm not suggesting anyone takes risks, but many systems will have these very small leaks, and it is not until fully tested that you would have any inkling that they did.

 

OP should go over the system with test fluid until they find it, though, in case it turns into something that leaks faster, (which if it is a seal on an appliance tap can easily happen).

[WotEver]

35 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

I'm not suggesting anyone takes risks, but many systems will have these very small leaks, and it is not until fully tested that you would have any inkling that they did.

I believe that’s why MtB used to criticise the specification for the use of bubble testers. He said the test time should be many times longer than that specified in order to find very small leaks. 

[alan_fincher]

14 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I believe that’s why MtB used to criticise the specification for the use of bubble testers. He said the test time should be many times longer than that specified in order to find very small leaks. 

And indeed have they now not increased the time for which the button has to be depressed?

[Chewbacka]

2 hours ago, treddieafloat said:

Thanks again I will .pick up some spray tomorrow and let you know how I get on. The leak is minor gas safety chap didn't think it a risk but had to rightly fail us.

cheers

treddie

Spay plenty on each joint.  As you may have a few tiny leaks that add up to a ‘fail’ it’s best to keep inspecting every few mins for 10mins or so as a tiny leak takes a while to make bubbles.

[Guest]

The spray stuff is very good in my experience. I got a tin from Screwfux years ago and still use it. Also dead easy to make a manometer to test the system, or cheap enough to buy.

Don't mean to hijack the thread but:
What is the recommended time for a bubble tester? I usually test it for about a minute. Is that enough?
The boat safety guy that I have used for years now once bought a fancy electronic manometer, but found that most boats failed with it. I noticed he was using a "traditional" type again at our last inspection. I assume he will just use the bubble tester in future which was fitted more recently?

[bizzard]

Its best if you dabble the liquid around the joints with a small paint brush it will wipe out any bubbles caused by the spray itself and make any genuine  gas leak bubbles easier to see.

[Chewbacka]

2 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

And indeed have they now not increased the time for which the button has to be depressed?

They have it’s now 60 seconds, during which time no bubbles are allowed.

[BEngo]

6 hours ago, haggis said:

Undiluted washing up liquid is better than soapy water for finding gas leaks.

 

Haggis

Please do not use washing up liquid to detect leaks.  It contains a LOT of salt, which creeps between the nut and the pipe and causes corrosion followed by a gas leak.  I have seen systems where the corrosion has caused a union nut to split.

 

  As  Alan has said there is designed-for-the-job  stuff readily available which is not harmful to your gas system.

 

If the OP cannot find a leak at the joints it may be that a flexible pipe has become permeable and is leaking gas through the walls.  They tend to do this as they get older, which is why it is a good idea to change them about every 5 years, and to look at new chandlery ones for the date of manufacture to make sure they have not been sitting on a shelf, wasting 'life'.

N

 

 

[Ex Brummie]

7 hours ago, haggis said:

Undiluted washing up liquid is better than soapy water for finding gas leaks.

 

Haggis

Partly diluted ( 3x water to 1 x W.up liquid) is the best. I'm sure the suppliers of propriety brands know best Undiluted can be thick enough to not bubble on a small leak.