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cloudy diesel


jenevers

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This is what I drained from the bottom of my diesel tank. It's been treated with Marine16. There's 90 litres in the tank and it has a 15cm x15cm sump in the bottom to collect impurities. The diesel is cloudy which I assume is emulsified water but there are   "bits" floating about as per the photo. Is this what Marine16 does.

IMG_20190212_115135.jpg

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Its probably bits of rust / sludge / bug. Whatever it is it would ne better if it was not there. If the engine runs quite happily without clattering or knocking then it is managing to burn the fuel. I would start by trying to drain off the cloudy stuff but if the whole lot is cloudy I would drain all of it out, clean the tank as best you can and see if its possible to salvage the fuel by 'polishing' it.  Cleaning the tank is hard. I had a nightmare trying to clean my mild steel 'integrated' tank and I had a lid I could get my arm inside. The stuff in the tank was horrible. I am starting to think that steel tanks might not be very good, separate stainless or aluminium tanks could be better. Good luck.

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6 minutes ago, Bee said:

I am starting to think that steel tanks might not be very good, separate stainless or aluminium tanks could be better. Good luck.

You do know that there are thousands and thousands of steel diesel tanks feeding diesel engines all over the country? Lots of central heating tanks, bulk storage on farms, that kind of thing

 

If you read what the OP said, this is the stuff from the sump at the bottom of the tank where the crap is supposed to collect, not what the engine is burning

 

TBH, I'm delighted if when I remove a drain plug on a boat diesel tank anything runs out. The stuff that sits benignly in the bottom of tanks is amazing

 

Richard 

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I often wonder why people become so obsessed with the diesel in their tank, although after the introduction of bio diesel I did add Marine 16 when re fuelling. Our boat was 35 years old when we sold it, it had a pair of linked integrated steel tanks with no sumps, no drain plugs, and no inspection hatches, so there was no way we could inspect the fuel, except when I changed the fuel filter. That was always a clean pink liquid looking exactly the same as diesel which went into the tanks.  The take off pipe was about two inches off the bottom of the tank, and I expect there was a layer of sludge in the bottom of the tanks, but as long as it didn't get to the engine why worry?


 

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My paranoia on this issue is due to having crewed on two particular narrow boats for a tideway trip. Everything  was fine for about 30 mins, and then the said sludge/crap got nicely stirred up and blocked the filters. Fortunately in each case we had a couple of minutes warning to call for help. 

I use a thin copper pipe down the filler and a hand pump to see what's going on at the bottom of the sump. After my last lumpy water crossing (the Wash) there were a few specks of water at the bottom pf the pre filter bowl. Allowing for the capacity of the bowl, and the circulation of the fuel during a long day, I reckon this was about 1 part water in 40,000, which sounds acceptable.

 

PS I like the original photo - looks pretty good to me!

 

dscf5433.jpgdscf5435.jpg

Edited by Scholar Gypsy
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I have also experienced Diesel bug blocking the filter, many years ago on a hire boat, but that was before it was a serious problem in narrow boats, and before the ready avaiability of treatments. To be honest if I was as foolish adventurous enough to attempt a sea voyage in a narrow boat, I would have undertaken a number of precautions, including having the tanks inspected or cleaned beforehand.

 

 

Edited by David Schweizer
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I'm not sure about some of the additives, a layer of watery crud at the bottom is one thing but emulsified fuel in the tank might be a bigger problem. First time we went down the Thames years ago in a narrowboat with a separate steel water tank the filth that came out the tap was horrible and that was because of it being stirred up by the more interesting movement on the river. Fuel was fine but I think a boat that had been used on the canal and then went somewhere more adventurous might get into trouble. Maybe a tee piece in the fuel line with a bit of plastic tube so you could poke it into a container full of clean fuel would be wise and the same with the return pipe? Never mind the BSS, it wouldn't matter if you meant to get to Portishead and were being carried past Ilfracombe.

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10 hours ago, Scholar Gypsy said:

My paranoia on this issue is due to having crewed on two particular narrow boats for a tideway trip. Everything  was fine for about 30 mins, and then the said sludge/crap got nicely stirred up and blocked the filters. Fortunately in each case we had a couple of minutes warning to call for help. 

I use a thin copper pipe down the filler and a hand pump to see what's going on at the bottom of the sump. After my last lumpy water crossing (the Wash) there were a few specks of water at the bottom pf the pre filter bowl. Allowing for the capacity of the bowl, and the circulation of the fuel during a long day, I reckon this was about 1 part water in 40,000, which sounds acceptable.

 

PS I like the original photo - looks pretty good to me!

 

dscf5433.jpgdscf5435.jpg

In my oil company engineering days if I encountered cloudy sample like the top sample, the tank would be closed off. Fuel should be clear and bright, even dyed fuel. At one stage the prescribed test was that you could read a sample of The Times newspaper through a Johnny Walker bottle full of fuel! I kid you not. The initial reaction to fuel this would be to wait and see a few days to see if the cloudyness settled out and draw any water and crap from the bottom. If that did not work, then expensive on site polishing would be required.

Are you using an additive? They aid emulsification and therefore tend to defeat normal gravitation fuel water separators. I intensly disliked emulsifier additives because in my experience because they caused many more problems then they solved. I also intensely disliked biocicide additives because the unauthorised, and non notified addition of some, actually a lot, poisoned one of my contractors performing a pump and filter change.

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1 hour ago, DandV said:

In my oil company engineering days if I encountered cloudy sample like the top sample, the tank would be closed off. Fuel should be clear and bright, even dyed fuel. At one stage the prescribed test was that you could read a sample of The Times newspaper through a Johnny Walker bottle full of fuel! I kid you not. The initial reaction to fuel this would be to wait and see a few days to see if the cloudyness settled out and draw any water and crap from the bottom. If that did not work, then expensive on site polishing would be required.

Are you using an additive? They aid emulsification and therefore tend to defeat normal gravitation fuel water separators. I intensly disliked emulsifier additives because in my experience because they caused many more problems then they solved. I also intensely disliked biocicide additives because the unauthorised, and non notified addition of some, actually a lot, poisoned one of my contractors performing a pump and filter change.

I use Marine 16 biocide.

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36 minutes ago, Scholar Gypsy said:

I use Marine 16 biocide.

Have you got any way of taking bottom samples from your fuel tank?. A tube through the fill or dip point to a hand pump. If so you could start routinely taking bottom samples and discarding the dregs. With undosed fuel the water should separate out readily. Provided your fill point is free of leaks, you should fairly quickly clear any gunge and be able to reduce the frequency of the checks and removal to just prior to any refuelling. I used a Roses marmalade jar. Let the sample set for an our or so, before returning all but about the bottom tablespoon full to the tank, The dregs were soaked up on a paper towel, great to help the charcoal BBQ into action but otherwise just disposed off in the rubbish.

This technique utilises the bottom of the fuel tank as the high capacity primary settling chamber.

Edited by DandV
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8 minutes ago, DandV said:

Have you got any way of taking bottom samples from your fuel tank?. A tube through the fill or dip point to a hand pump. If so you could start routinely taking bottom samples and discarding the dregs. With undosed fuel the water should separate out readily. Provided your fill point is free of leaks, you should fairly quickly clear any gunge and be able to reduce the frequency of the checks and removal to just prior to any refuelling. I used a Roses marmalade jar. Let the sample set for an our or so, before returning all but about the bottom tablespoon full to the tank, The dregs were soaked up on a paper towel, great to help the charcoal BBQ into action but otherwise just disposed off in the rubbish.

This technique utilises the bottom of the fuel tank as the high capacity prime settling chamber.

Yes, I use this through the filler, no dregs to speak of. The photos above are from 2015.
 dscf5434.jpg

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