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BETA 35 not starting - help!


imranino

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1 hour ago, Iain_S said:

If the ignition key is "doing nothing", i.e. no lights on panel, then a likely candidate is the main engine fuse, which is usually tucked away behind the starter motor.

No I’ve already checked that. I fitted a buzzer last year that goes when the key is in ING position so that it doesn’t get left in that position thus draining the starter. That buzzer is buzzing. 

3 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Do you have a multimeter? Could be used to measure voltage at the starter motor, particularly when the key switch is turned to start. A picture of the back of the motor will let us tell you where to poke the probes. This would eliminate the switch and multiplug and wiring as the problem if it shows 12V to the start relay input. Might save you taking the starter off, taking it to a repair shop and be told it was fine all along. A quick test if you have a meter and a second person to turn the key while you measure.

 

Jen

I managed to stick the probes into place, turn the key and look at the multi meter display. I read 12V as you described, so I guess this means I need to take the starter off for servicing?

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2 minutes ago, imranino said:

So it looks like power is getting to the starter motor as it should , so the next step is to replace/service the starter motor. Wish me luck!

Good luck, you'll be fine

 

Richard

 

MORE: Don't forget to disconnect the battery, big blue sparks are very frightening

Edited by RLWP
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25 minutes ago, RLWP said:

Good luck, you'll be fine

 

Richard

 

MORE: Don't forget to disconnect the battery, big blue sparks are very frightening

Yep, already isolate :)

 

now to to figure out how to remove the motor....

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8 minutes ago, imranino said:

Yep, already isolate :)

 

now to to figure out how to remove the motor....

Will probably be held in by 3 +/-1 bolts around the perimeter of the starter. One of these bolt heads will be almost, but not quiet completely inaccessible! If you don't have one, then a metric socket set will be an excellent beg/borrow/buy, plus some spanners.

 

On the first car I ever owned, the starter motor could only be removed by first removing one of the engine mounts and supporting the engine on a jack. This will almost certainly not be as bad as that.

Edited by Jen-in-Wellies
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3 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

On the first car I ever owned, the starter motor could only be removed by first removing one of the engine mounts and supporting the engine on a jack. This will almost certainly not be as bad as that.

I worked on a boat last year where you could only change the starter by removing the engine. You could remove one bolt, see the second and just about touch the third with your fingers if you lay on your back next to the engine and reached up under the fan housing

 

The starter was rusted absolutely solid

 

Richard

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2 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

We'll be scaring @imranino with "badly placed starter motors I have known" stories. I don't know Beta 35's, but I do have a 43 and in general that is sensibly laid out, so it should be possible to remove the starter reasonably easily.

 

Jen

Not if the Beta is positioned hard against the left hand side of the hull. Two mechanics suggested that, if my starter failed, the cheapest solution would be to lift the boat and cut a hole in the side.

 

I have had the engine moved this winter, haven't seen the result yet but reports are good.

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Sweet Jesus. I’ve found and removed one bolt, I can see the other but as stipulated above I’m scratching me head re: how to remove it. I’m gonna try with a socket wrench and extension, failing that I really don’t know...

As far as I can tell it’s just that one other bolt. I’ve just made an ad hoc measurement and I should be able to get it out with just a socket wrench extender. Pray to all the gods for me!

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I've not looked at a Beta starter closely (and won't be able to look at mine until Sunday) but it might be the contacts in the starter solenoid that have corroded. On my old BMC engine that was easy to remove and test off the engine. It's the bit to which the big and small + cables are connected. The bolts should be accessible.

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3 hours ago, imranino said:

Sweet Jesus. I’ve found and removed one bolt, I can see the other but as stipulated above I’m scratching me head re: how to remove it. I’m gonna try with a socket wrench and extension, failing that I really don’t know...

As far as I can tell it’s just that one other bolt. I’ve just made an ad hoc measurement and I should be able to get it out with just a socket wrench extender. Pray to all the gods for me!

Two fixings is common these days

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4 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

We'll be scaring @imranino with "badly placed starter motors I have known" stories. I don't know Beta 35's, but I do have a 43 and in general that is sensibly laid out, so it should be possible to remove the starter reasonably easily.

 

Jen

Ya think?  I don't think there's much chance of my Beta 43's starter coming out with the engine in place. Its not the engine, it's where it's sat. The starter is pretty low down sitting next to, and inside of, one of the fore and aft beams the engine is mounted on.  Every builder is different though, eh?  Having said all that, the last time I did one on a car I did it by sense of touch and judicious use of a mobile phone camera! 

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16 hours ago, Sea Dog said:

Having said all that, the last time I did one on a car I did it by sense of touch and judicious use of a mobile phone camera! 

When I recently changed a brake servo the last bolt was undone with me upside down on the seat with my head in the footwell with a long extension and a uj on the socket set, done entirely by feel. Great fun. 

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1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

f you put power across it does it work ? (make wizzy noises ?)

No, it wasn't making any clicking sound when I tried to start it despite all readings indicating it was receiving power fine. I took it straight to get serviced - looks like it'll be done by tomorrow, what a result!

I had to get these tools from Halfords. There was just enough room between the engine and the keel to get some leverage on it.

1E9CC843-E96D-4BBB-B765-C0AEC5233F4E.JPG

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3 minutes ago, imranino said:

No, it wasn't making any clicking sound when I tried to start it despite all readings indicating it was receiving power fine. I took it straight to get serviced - looks like it'll be done by tomorrow, what a result!

I had to get these tools from Halfords. There was just enough room between the engine and the keel to get some leverage on it.

 

Most starter/alternator rebuild places are like that

 

Sounds like a good result - not only do you get your starter fixed, you get some shiny new toys too!

 

Richard

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1 hour ago, imranino said:

Ladies and gentlemen,

 

I’m very pleased to say that l’ve had the starter motor serviced, I’ve just refitted it and the engine is running. 

 

Thanks so much for all the advice and experience, I would never have figured this out without your help. 

 

Have a great weekend!

Good effort! You wont regret buying those Halfords Advanced tools either - surprisingly good stuff!   

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