comfortably numb

Many thanks to chesire rose, Ssscruddy, and Jerra for your helpful advice. I suppose getting only 3 sensible answers out of 50 replies is par for the course for this forum. It's reminded my of why I rarely visit here any more

Our marina is over run with Canada Geese. Many people on the marina have issues with them crapping everywhere, the noise they make, and the disruption they are causing to the other wildlife. Rather than the option of culling them people have tried making life difficult for them by regularly shooing them into the water when they see them in the hope that they will move get brassed off and move to one of the many lakes in the vicinity. One chap even operates a remote controlled speedboat in an effort to disturb them. But they are still here. Presumably many marinas have similar problems and I'd be interested to know how others have dealt with the problem, or don't they perceive them as being a problem perhaps?

I don't think it's changed much over the last 20+ years. There's always a chance of becoming a victim if you happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, but generally if you're sensible about where you moor and what times you travel in certain areas then it significantly reduces the chances. I also think engaging with potential trouble makers rather than ignoring them helps too. We've cruised much of the system including the BCN regularly, and in 25 years all we've had is some kids throwing stones on the rural southern Shroppie, and on 2 occasions in Stoke on the Calden Canal. The 2nd time we were wiser and when I held up my phone and filmed the 2 kids they dropped their stones and decided against it. Ironically these two incidents happened in exactly the same place but 20 years and a day apart. Perhaps these kids were the offspring of the kids who'd stoned us before!

Having spent 30 years on hireboats cruising mainly canals, after buying our own boat a couple of years ago we began to explore the rivers, and have since been on the Trent to Keadby, the Yorkshire Ouse, the Severn, the Avon, the Soar, and the Weaver. It's given us invaluable experience but every time even though we've managed to go on them when they've been calm and fairly sedate it's made me very aware of how different to canals they are and how one has to give them so much respect. I've always prepared well such as keeping the engine serviced, fuel polished, buying the charts, the correct anchor and ropes/chains, navigation lights, lifejackets etc, and I have my VHF and licence for advice and in case of emergency. But despite this preparation and having had some experience on rivers now, I still worry about high river levels with fast flowing 'fresh' and because I'm now retired I can take the easy way out because I have the time to sit it out and wait for calmer waters, but by bottling it in this way I'm not going to gain any experience of faster flowing waters. So with this in mind I've read this thread with great interest, but I'm not sure if it's made me more confident to venture onto them or whether it's made me more paranoid than I already am

Brilliant folks, and a great help thanks. Whether or not we actually moor overnight there depends upon time of day we get there as well as things like the weather etc. So long as it's safe and reasonably quiet and there's somewhere to exercise the dog then that's fine and if we are able to get out of the compound and have a mooch around then that'd be a bonus.

Thanks all of you for your replies, very helpful suggestions about winding (my boat is 62'), but not many about actually over-nighting there . I'm fairly certain the chain is no longer there which should help me with winding and if the need arises I now know that mooring there is an option. I knew I could rely on you lot

I'm planning our latest venture on the wonderful BCN (filling in the few parts we haven't 'done' before). I'm looking for potential overnight mooring options and was wondering if it's possible to moor at the end of the arm outside the Bradley Works, or perhaps other safe moorings elsewhere along the arm. . Researching some old posts on here I see that a few have moored outside the works unofficially, but that was 3 years ago so I'd be interested to find out what the up to date situation is please? I prefer not having the restriction of planning our trips too specifically but like to have a few options available for when we're actually there and this is one I'm considering.

We're just coming up to 3 years. We bought an older boat so managed to keep the house in case we didn't take to life afloat. We rent it out and the income has helped allow us to retire early. We love life afloat so much I can't see us ever going back to live there. We're marina based because the wife likes to have a base, but we do go out for weeks and sometimes months on end. I'd love to CC all year round but the misses doesn't so I can't see this happening.

When we were looking to buy a boat I couldn't make up my mind which type to go for as I could see the pros and cons of both. So I accepted that whichever loo the boat we bought had would be fine. Now 3 years on and living aboard I'm really pleased ours came with a pump out and I really cannot see why some hate them so much. But of course it's all down to personal preference so I can see why it's such a divisive subject.

A fair point, but if CRT were to throw more resources into it how do you suggest they go about it? What measures should they implement etc?

I thought there were a few inaccuracies in there, as well as the omissions. At least it ended with the cautioanry note from CaRT saying that it should be chosen as a lifestyle change and not cheaper living option.

Thanks for all your helpful suggestions. I was going to give Norton CBB at Glascote a call but then my 'prop man' phoned me and said he's now arranged it with Streethay. They are the nearest to me but I'd disconted them thinking they might be very expensive but their price is very reasonable. Some of you have queried why I need a propeller specialist and whether there is such a thing. It's a long story but I have my reasons, LOL. If it cures my problem I might bore you with the gory details in due course. You have been warned !! Thanks again everybody.

I need to have my 62' out of the water for some work to be done with the prop so I was wondering if anybody knew the cheapest place within a maximum of a couple of days cruising from Fradley Junction. It doesn't have to be a dry dock of course, as a pull out onto hardstanding would be fine. I've already put the feelers out and some prices seem to be around £300 plus an exorbetant daily standing charge both of which seemmvery high to me. One problem might be that I wouldn't be using the on site/marina staff because I plan to use somebody who specialises in propellers. I believe that Aquaduct Marina on the Middlewhich Branch are very competitive but it's a tad further than I'd like to go really. I realise that winter stoppages may also be an issue however although I'd like it done ASAP I'd accept I might have to wait until after Xmas or the Spring. With the wealth of knowlege on here I'm hoping somebody might know of somewhere I hadn't thought of, perhaps a smaller concern which may be cheaper. I once used somewhere like this (Clattercote?? on the South Oxford) which was were very cheap, but it's further away than I really want to go. Help and advice would be much appreciated.

This problem could be solved very easily if councils did as Dagenham Council have started doing recently by using DNA testers. It would probably be a less costly option than having wardens trying to catch people in the act which must be very difficult to achieve. To be fully effective it would have to become law to have all dogs microchipped, something which should be done anyway. The revenue from the increase in succesful prosecutions would surely pay for the equipment and manpower. The chances of people getting caught 'in the act' are minimul but knowing that they could get caught retrospectively should significanly reduce the amount of problems. If CRT introduced it for the towpaths I would certainly volunteer my time for free.

No of course not! We are experienced narrowboaters but it was our first time on the Caledonean Canal and with this type of boat so it was essential and useful for us. However I doubt they would make returning customers go through it all again each time. Common sense would prevail.

I don't think you will go far wrong with a boat from ABNB and survey by Trevor Whitling. I've had dealings with both and they are excellent. Before buying our boat the opinions I sought were that Trevor is one of the most thorough surveyors around and this was certainly the case with the boat we bought.

In May we hired a cruiser from Caley Cruisers on the Caledonean Canal. Before you were allowed on the boat you had to sit in a room and watch a half hour instructional video followed by a Q&A session. I think all hire companies should do this. It was only after this that we were shown around the boat and then allowed to leave the marina.

During the last 10 days (since the last reply to my OP), I've been mulling over what to do next. Getting all these opinions from this forum and people on our marina has been tremendous but has also increased my dilemma as to what to try next because whatever I do I have to pay somebody to do it and naturally I'm trying to avoid spending money unnecessarily. A local boat mechanic is now telling me the overheating is almost certainly being caused by a faulty gearbox (PRM 160) and that my next step should be to have it replaced, which seems a drastic and very expensive option. However, could a faulty gearbox be the reason I need 2,000 RPM to maintain 4mph? How likely is this to be the cause? Would I be able to tell there's a problem as I cruise along? I've not noticed anything amiss and only a couple of times in the last 70 hours of cruising has there been a sudden small dip in the revs, and each time I put this down to some debris in the water temporarily catching the propeller. The drive seems fine going forwards or going in reverse. Sorry this thread of mine has gone on a bit and thanks to everybody who is trying to help me, it really is appreciated, and hopefully some of you will be kind enough to stick with me. So to sum up the story so far ….. I have 2 main issues – The engine (BMC 1.8) overheating (100c+) when travelling on a canal at 4mph for longer than a few minutes. The revs have to be 2,000 RPM in order to travel at 4mph (assuming adequate depth of water etc). The 2,000 RPM seems way too high. I haven't had the accuracy of the rev counter checked but even if it is giving a false reading it doesn't alter the fact that to maintain 4mph the engine overheats anyway. Are the two issues connected perhaps? Following all your helpful suggestions earlier in the thread, I have checked or done the following: I've established that the skin tank is big enough for the engine and hull. I've spoken to the chap who did the blacking in April and in his opinion it wasn't particularly thick on the skin tank part and he's certain this isn't the cause of the overheating. I've re-checked to prop size and it is 17”, also checked with Colecraft that it is the one fitted when the boat was built in 1995 so it should be fit for purpose. Replaced temperature gauge & sender unit. Bled the skin tank when engine running. Checked % of coolant in water system. New coolant was put in last year and the place that did it said they'd completely flushed out the system beforehand. I presume they weren't lying. I haven't replaced the water pump but feeling the pipes and the skin tank it does seem to be pumping the water around okay. Engine has always been prone to overheating on canals in the 2+ years I've had the boat but since its hard work in May on the Trent it's worse now I'm back on canals than it was beforehand. At 1800 RPM (2.5 – 3mph) the engine temp is 90c. At 2,000 RPM it reaches 100c and looks like it would go above it I dared to let it. After reaching 100c it cools down to 90 – 85c within a minute or two if I reduce the revs to about 1,600 RPM. The rises & falls happen quite quickly. I have about 10 shallow pock marks on the drive-plate caused 6 months after I bought the boat by a bolt inside becoming dislodged and rattling around. It happened when going through Stone on the T&M in 2013. I was virtually outside the boatyard there so gently eased to boat there to avoid major damage. They told me the drive-plate would be fine left as it was. I can't remember for sure, but I think my overheating problems may have started around that time but this could be coincidence of course. The high RPM's has always been the case since I bought the boat, but the overheating hasn't. So maybe this latest suggestion about it being a gearbox problem could be relevant then? The water system needs topping up with approx 100ml of water about every 20 hours. The engine oil rarely needs topping up, but needed so in May when I was on the rivers. Since back on the canals it's back to hardly using any oil but then I'm not working the engine as hard. I rarely do above 3mph and have only been doing the 4mph in order to test the temperature issue. The engine starts pretty well from cold even in winter. It smokes a bit for the first 20 seconds or so but then is fine, even at high revs. There is no sign of water in the engine oil. When operating at 100c there is no visible sign of overheating (steam). When on the Trent I had the deck board up to keep an eye on it. So it's what step to take next that I'm in a dilemma about. Do I get the gearbox replaced or looked at? Do I have the engine stripped down and checked? Should I replace the water pump as the next step on the basis that it's the cheapest option to try first? Or on the basis that they are BMC specialists I'm considering taking the boat to Calcutt Marine and let them take a look. Perhaps I should sell the boat or sink it and claim the insurance!!! Any further help/advice would be very gratefully received.

I'm still trying the things you very helpful folk on here have suggested, the next one is replacing the water pump in the coming week. I've thought of something else but even allowing for my dumbness with anything mechanical I wouldn't have thought this would have caused the overheating but thought I'd mention it just in case. About 18 months ago (and I think was about the time I began to have the problem but this could be coincidence), a bolt came loose in the gearbox (caused by a too low tick-over and knackered engine mountings). Thankfully I was right by the boat place in Stone. They checked it and found that the bolt rattling about in the gearbox had made small pock marks all over the drive plate and that I'd been lucky it hadn't cracked. They replaced the engine mountings and adjusted the tick-over. Their opinion was that it would be okay with the pock marks and that I wouldn't need a new drive plate, and since then I haven't noticed any changes to the performance of the engine or gearbox. So could this be relevant to my overheating problems?

I think these policies vary so much that it can make it difficult to compare like for like. We're with Sainsburys and are covered for a maximum of £7,500 for any single treatment with an excess of £75. We thought initially this cover was a bit OTT but are glad we did because our 8 year old has racked up £14,200 in vets bills so far (a titanium plate in each hind leg, a spine operation, and recently a melanoma removed from her front leg). Our premium was initially £13 a month but is now £33, a big rise but well worth it considering what she's had done. Mind you I reckon the vets inflate the charges when they know you are insured.

After years of hiring, we bought a 12th share in a boat and had a great 4 years before buying our own boat in 2013. Others on here have covered most of what you need to know but I'd like to add a few things. The management companies pay all the bills on your behalf. In addition to you paying them a fee for managing your boat, you then pay them for any maintenance on your syndicate's boat. This is usually estimated in advance based on decisions made by your syndicate at an annual meeting and a monthly contribution figure for this is then decided upon, or following email/phone discussions between all syndicate members there might be an additional contribution for some unexpected cost that occurs. Syndicates sometimes have a 'sinking fund' into which all owners will pay a small monthly amount as a contingency for this in case any unexpected costs arise. Ownerships who went bust in 2009 used to have all the years the money off us at the beginning of the year so when they went under in the April we all lost about £600 each (we'd had a re-paint and our winter maintenance for which they hadn't paid). Nowadays you pay the management companies monthly so the risk is far less because in the event of them going bust the most you'd lose would be a month's contributions. As for choosing a boat, a share in a new/newer boat will cost more but in theory the annual maintenance should be less. However with there being more depreciation on a newer boat you may lose more when you come to sell your share. In 2009 we bought a share in an nb Cropredy, an 8 year old 58' cruiser stern for £3,500 and sold it 4 years later for £3,250. Our annual share of the running costs and management fee was around £1,100. So not bad for 4 weeks use a year, however we had the cost of diesel, pump outs, and a valet (optional) each time we used the boat. Despite the problem with Ownerships going bust (we then went with BCBM who were excellent) we had no regrets because if you like canal/river holidays every year and you're not too bothered where, it's so much cheaper than hiring. You have to be prepared to not always get your own way of course, but decisions are made democratically. Although used extensively throughout the year, shared boats are usually very well maintained because owners are far more willing to have jobs done on the boat with only having to pay a twelfth of any costs, and they usually look after the boat well too. If you take the excellent advice others on here have given you and take the plunge, I'm sure you won't regret it. Good luck.

I've measured the skin tank and it is about 46 inches from front to back and 20 inches high. I'm not sure of the width but it protrudes inwards by about 3/4 inch. I've re-measured the prop and the 8 inches I mentioned before was the length of each fin from the centre of the prop, so I should have said it was a 16 inch prop. Does that still seem a bit small for a 62' Colecraft shell?

As usual you lot have been brilliant and come up with some suggestions I hadn't thought about. After reading that very useful link from ditchcrawler about somebody not giving all the facts, I'm going to try and address mine here, so apologies in advance that it's going to be long winded. “does skin tank need air bleeding out of it ? “ Yes the skin tank has been bled. “A build up of blacking would certainly decrease the efficiency of cooling but that would first be seen when the engine is working hard on rivers. If the engine has started overheating on canals then it's likely to be a different problem”. I've had the boat 2 and a half years. From new it was well used for 16 years by the previous owners, quite a lot on rivers, and it has 10,000 + hours on the clock. I have spoken to them recently and they said they never had overheating problems. My memory is poor these days, but I'm sure we didn't have overheating problems initially when we first bought the boat. . I think it started to get the problems (reaching 90c+ after a while at 3/4mph) about a year ago (on canals). We had it blacked in April, then in May we went on the tidal Trent then the Ouse up to York. It was then that the overheating seemed to worsen. Having certain time windows for each tidal stretch I wasn't able to keep up with other boats after we all left a lock together for fear of overheating. For example on one 3 hour stretch I was taking 4 hours. I was told (rightly or wrongly) that one can run a BMC up to 100c and I was having to do this in order to progress against the flow but still lagged behind the other boats because any faster and it would have gone above the 100c which I didn't want to risk. Sometimes I had the deck-board up and there was no visible sign of overheating such as steam. The engine did need a daily topping up with water but only with about 100ml. In case it's relevant, the coolant is about 45%. I've been back on the canals for 2 months now and it still gets up to 100c if I'm doing 3/4mph for 5 minutes or more which because this isn't often possible due to moored boats etc, it doesn't seem to be using any water. Other facts which may be relevant – I've replaced the thermostat, sender unit, and temperature gauge. Maybe the water pump next, however feeling the pipes the water seems to be flowing alright. The engine starts easily and except for straight after starting up, doesn't discharge any smoke. I do have a concern about the revs on the boat. I was told that this isn't relevant but I think it may be, so I will mention it here in case it is. To travel at 4mph necessitates 2000 rpm and having had quite a lot of experience previously with hire boats and a share boat, this is much higher than those, however at 2000 rpm the sound/pitch of my engine sounds to me like the others did at say 1600 rpm. And at 2000 rpm looking at the discharge of water from the prop it doesn't seem excessive in comparison either, and the same with the wash. Interestingly at a constant 1800 rpm the temperature doesn't rise above 90c but at 2000 rpm it quickly shoots up to 100c. Soon after decreasing the revs it drops down again (the rises and falls happen quite quickly). My boat is a 62' Colecraft. The prop size is 8 inches which I've been told is on the small side for this sized hull. Engine is a BMC 1.8 38HP. So on canals the overheating isn't such a problem because I rarely go above 3mph anyway, but there are times when I'd like to, and I also want to go on rivers again. “Before doing anything else measure the skin tank area. You need about 1sq ft per 4 hp and if it is significantly less than this you can mess about for ever and not solve the problem. Not only excess blacking but overplating a swell can cause such problems”. I've promised somebody a day out on the boat today so I will measure the skin tank tomorrow. As for whether it has baffles/pipes inside it I don't know, I assumed it had thats all. “The same good people in the link fitted a cooling loop to my boat, curing my long- standing overheating problem”. I've heard about this as being a solution but have also heard that there's a danger of it being damaged or even dislodged in shallow water. Finally (phew!!) I don't think this is relevant but the problems I think may have began after this. 18 months ago a bolt came loose in the gearbox. Thankfully I stopped fairly quickly, as I was by that boat yard in Stone. They inspected the drive plate and the loose bolt had caused 'pock marks' on the drive plate. They told me I had been lucky and that the damage wasn't too bad and it wouldn't require a new drive plate. The gearbox has worked fine since and I haven't detected any noticeable problems. Thanks again for all your suggestions and apologies for the long reply! Hopefully this additional information can further help in identifying the problem.

I've been having over heating problems with my BMC 1.8 and have been trying various options to cure it such as replacing the thermostat, temp gauge etc in order to try and hopefully cure it and avoid the more costly stripping down of the engine. Somebody suggested that the build up of blacking over the years on the skin tank might be a factor by lessening the effects of water passing it. This hadn't occurred to me and although I have my doubts I wondered what you others think? The previous owners had it blacked virtually every year of the 16 years they owned it and my surveyor commented on how thick the blacking was throughout the hull. It was also suggested to me also that perhaps the baffles/pipes inside the skin tank may have perished therefore affecting the flow of water within it. Short of taking the drastic measure of cutting the side out to take a look, is there any other way of checking this, perhaps a device which can measure the density within it?

Thanks for the info. I'm not really bothered about it but was just curious as to why. Now it makes sense.