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The argument about legalities and liabilities detracts from the main issue. Many parts of the towpath are places where people like to relax, possibly daydream, as they wander along, idly gazing at the view, the boats, the wildlife. It is not just the towpath - many footpaths in parks and the countryside are (or should be) places where users do not need to be constantly on the alert for possible hazards that are not directly related to the environment they are enjoying. A minority of bikers (and joggers) who do not take this into consideration are spoiling the amenity enjoyed by so many. CRT are actively promoting the canals as a place to relax and get away from the stresses of modern life, and should be proactive in ensuring that this is a realistic objective.

What I want is for this forum to be more welcoming and accepting of the new members who come here or if they can't be welcoming that they don't jump to conclusions and start grumping at people... what I want is for this forum to remain relevant. I know several people who own businesses that they have run from facebook who have had problems when facebook has changed it's algorithms and their groups have become less accessible - if you think that something like this forum could survive in it's current or a similar format on facebook then that would be fine but I don't think Facebook can provide the service that this forum can and it saddens me greatly that new members are not staying to become regulars, I don't see why I should go to facebook to find women who boat when they do actually come here, I believe in campaigning to have them feel welcome and want to stay. It saddens me that there was a very vibrant community of women on this forum but that they felt the need to go off to start their own private group on facebook. This forum has lost something special with the loss of some of its lady members. In the same way that you feel strongly that you should counter they arguments of cyclist bashers I feel strongly that this forum would benefit greatly from diversity. I don't relish chaos but once upon a time people had a little fun on this forum; I'm not looking for love myself but I've even heard that a very special relationship or two started here.

See this is the problem with your participation in these conversation you seem to be under the impression that people are saying things they aren't, that people are making arguments they aren't. Like all good echo chambers half truths are echoed back to you and you automatically pounce on them calling them whole truths. I have always stated - and you will find those posts simply by reading any cyclist bashing thread that I have participated in - that anybody who breaks the law and does harm to another human should be held responsible that there are cyclists out there not as courteous as they could be. What I am arguing is that your experience is not a reasonable argument, you remember your experiences tainted with your own biases. There is good reason why we look to science to answer our questions about the universe and not the church. You have escalated you arguments on this subject to the point where they can not reasonably be taken seriously, this does not help you convince me as a cyclist that you are anything other than a hater and I've rarely found haters constructive - if you want me to listen to you, to learn from you then the best way to do that is not by making me your enemy. The Biggest problem I've had discussing any thing on this forum of late is that I struggle to find any middle ground - nothing is all bad or all good, all too often I feel the discussion isn't about the thing being discussed as it is about bashing anything thats not us.

I came from an RAF electrical engineer and a Devon bus clippie

I'm pretty consistent in the fact that I'm silly

I picked my words carefully. It is very possible that someone who has to drive to earn a living and the driving may be ancillary to their actual job could lose their license or their job just because an idiot cyclists jumped a red light, came up the inside despite left turn indicators flashing, rode straight across a crossroads and so on. That endangers the drivers lively hood and probably a lot more these days - and no I don't think the court processes would side with the driver, just like when it was cyclist V pedestrian it did not side with the cyclist. You and NB Calmiri can protest as much as you want but it won't alter the fact that too many cyclists ride like complete idiots who do injure pedestrians, pets and damage cars without any form of sanction being taken against them.

If I was more disciplined there would be less posts on the B..... thread, and without such a thread I wouldn’t have have found out how many people on the forum have views that make me cringe, let alone the ones who are personally offensive.

I admire your determination to instils some sense into the conversation I really do - I once tried the same thing, then the other day when the whole cyclist bashing started again and I was reading through some of the comments I though to my self "I should copy and paste all my last comments into a file and then I can just copy and paste them back into which ever cyclist bashing thread is the hot topic this time - Then I read one of Tony Brooks comments and I realise how truly pointless the whole thing is. None of these cyclist bashing topics have anything to do with sense or logic or even reality; it doesn't matter how much sense or logic you instil into the conversation they will in a couple of months time come back and have exactly the same conversation putting forward all the same petty nonsense, I'm not overly sure these threads are even about cyclist so much as just the need for a bogey monster to get worked up about. Either way I'm not saying don't keep putting forward the other side of the story I'm just saying it could start to resemble banging your head off a brick wall so don't let it get to you or spoil your day. The problem with living in a single demographic echo chamber (circlejerk) is that the BS is allowed to escalate unchecked to the point where it is a flat out lie but by that time they've spouted it back to them selves so many times it now true to then and you won't convince them otherwise. Like I say I'm quite sure the vast majority of the pet hate projects on this forum have very little to do with what is being hated and more to do with the people who really need to get angry/outraged at something - the saddest part of the whole thing is that it's driving new people and different demographics away so this forum is slowly stagnating into an old mans private chat room (or probbly already has); of course the old men don't really see that, how could they.

What terms are you offering ?

I'm happy with that! I have many friends who are cyclists. Hell, I have three bikes myself and I have yet to meet a nicer person! ? George

and I have not seen anyone who has said anything different but the fact remains that motorists can be easily identified as long as you can see their registration plate but cyclists can't so are free to ride as they please with little fear of consequences. That is the situation that some here do not seem to want to address.

I wondered what it was. I was hoping it wasn't a middle finger! ?

We were at cross purposes but there is never any need to stay there. ?

An articulated vehicle with an insulated trailer body fitted with a fridge unit. Usually prefaced by "bleedin' " ... L for leather ... O for the wings of a dove ... Q for a bus R for mo ... T for two ... X for breakfast

And this post here tells me that every thing in your view on the subject is either black or white and has no room for expansion of thought, no room for co-operation. ?

"How about" when a motorist having checked the 'bit of road' is clear when all of a sudden finds it is 'filled' by a cyclist. I had this happen to me on Monday of this week. Maybe not so easy to explain, but I'll try (for those that may know it, it happened on the mini-roundabout in Newark near the railway station and the turn off to the C&RT offices at the Kiln.) I was on the main road and approaching the mini-roundabout intending to turn left (the 1st turn) there was a group of pedestrians waiting on the kerb to cross but as it is quite a busy little roundabout the numbers were slowly increasing. As I tuned onto the roundabout I saw a cyclist coming along the pavement behind the group of stationary pedestrians at an 'excessive speed' and I got the feeling ' he's not going to stop'. He didn't, he bumped down the kerb and suddenly saw me, I slammed on the anchors and he narrowly missed going over my bonnet, he swerved to his left, hit the kerb, wobbled and went down the same road as I was intending (and signalling) to turn into. He stopped after 50 yards and as I past him appeared to give me a mouthful of abuse and some 'gestures'. Now had I knocked him off his bike and damaged my vehicle, without any insurance or requirement to stop and divulge information, how would I have got any recompense ? Should I claim on my own insurance and lose my no-claims ? In such circumstances, had I injured him, I would have no remorse / guilt and would hope that it would act as a reminder to ride with a little more consideration and thought in future. I guess at least I would have had 20+ witnesses.

Unless, of course, the accident is your fault. George

No idea officer

The problem with that argument is that it is not remotely logical - it is an argument based entirely on your fear and bias. It's an argument that holds all the same logic / reason as the flat-earth and anti-vaxxer arguments. Just because you want something to be so does not magically make it so.

As a cyclist I think this is the crux of the matter. Towpaths were a place where it was possible to switch off and relax. Unfortunately that is no longer possible due to the significant minority who are looking to make faster progress than most boaters find comfortable. I was out a couple of weeks ago around Birmingham and was surprised by the noticeable increase in Ebikes. That will take the problem to a whole new level

I'm sure some of them will eventually - I have felt in the past like a very lone voice battling against a very deaf crowd, if more cyclist banded together more often and called out the BS then I'm sure the tides would turn much quicker. It can get very time consuming, frustrating and at times very soul destroying saying the something over and over again and then a week later reading the same people write the same carp that you debunked last week. Some of us aren't retired and don't have all day to sit on this forum fighting our corner. I'm not saying that we shouldn't stand up for those of us who are law abiding cyclists but just that NB Caelmiri is a new member and that he may find himself fighting this battle more than once. I rather like this forum and I'm rather fond of some of those grumpy old men (even when I'm giving them a bit of a telling off) but as someone who is not an old man I would really like to see more diversity, more members on the forum who I can relate to and some that I really can't (other than old men) so I can learn new things from. If all the new members are giving up and this place and going off to join facebook groups then how long is this forum going to be providing the wonderful wealth of knowledge that it has? Older people complain that the younger people are changing life on the canals - well it they want the younger generations to care or understand what they do then they have to pass that on and that requires actually interacting with people not just grumping at them.

The problem is that we don't have elephants causing a problem. We do have cyclists. My experience suggests that per (pick a number) I'll say 1000 there are more problems with cyclists than there are with cars. In 70+ years as a pedestrian I have never had a collision with a car and I must have been exposed to several million passing me. However during the same length of time also as a pedestrian I have had about half a dozen with a tiny fraction of the number compared to that of cars. With regard to elephants I have never been passed by any let alone touched by one. While I agree things need to be done (and are being) to reduce road injuries it is IMO a little daft to see a problem developing and say we will leave that for another 10 or 20 years before we tackle it. Ignoring developing problems, just the sort of thing CRT are regularly criticised for and yet you suggest, that as a nation we should do just that. It doesn't make sense.

and from that I guess you have never experienced a cyclist deliberately endangering you as a pedestrian or motorist - yes cyclists do endanger motorists because the cyclists flout many aspects of traffic control and it seems cyclists are always deemed to be in the right.

I think I met Boater Sam's wife at a lock once. Shortly afterwards, I gave up dating and got a puppy.

I think I was moored and iced in outside that house for 11 weeks in 2009.?

Will you tell us whereabouts you are on the last day of each month so we can make the arrangements and agree on the size of spanners needed ?

We have seen this boat a few times, and nothing wrong with that name. The fact a group of psychopaths have hijacked the name of a Egyptian god is irrelevant. Personally I would rather our media used the derogatory term Daesh, especially as apparently, the twats it refers too don't like it.

I mark mine by tying a narrowboat to them with thick ropes. It really helps to draw attention to the small bits of metal if you have a colourful boat, with obvious decoration on it, left near the path in the wet bit ...

Many years ago (very early '80s) we bought a Bayliner that was named "Wet Wet Wet" (presumably after the band). It became a real chore when calling up the Coastguard to inform them of our departure to repeat the boat name 3 times (as required) Holyhead Coastguard this is "Wet Wet Wet, Wet Wet Wet, Wet Wet Wet", and then their response "Wet Wet Wet, Wet Wet Wet, Wet Wet Wet - go ahead" We eventually agreed it was easier to be called just "Wet". with full details listed on the CG66 registration form

Composting toilets are not repulsive, or shouldn't be. The bucket is black, it is inside a wooden box that is held at a negative pressure to eliminate the escape of odours and the opening is small. It is so dark inside that what you have 'done' is barely visible, unless you are using a torch...... you're not are you? Composting toilets are very widely used amongst 'glampers' who pay heavily for the privilege of not being able to flush. We have had both family and friends aboard and all have been pleasantly surprised by how pleasant our 'bucket' as you put it, is. Our composting/dessicating toilet is odourless, unlike the Tecma Silence macerating loo that it superceded. Try it, with the blessing of the C&RT.

Does that mean they can move their sign to other houses from time to time so long as they don’t exceed 14days??

This one was around in the early 80's when I was at Culdrose. Back then it was the Captain of HMS Seahawk that got the bill from the parents and replied with a bill for the helicopter time (a Wessex in those days). I don't think 771 Naval Air Squadron even have the SAR task any longer, since SAR went commercial. N

Blimey, we used to see a lot of posts on the forum complaining about people running their engines or generators outside of the permitted 8am - 8pm time limits. Now it seems they're complaining about people doing it within the permitted times. What's changed? We've become a bunch of snowflakes.