https://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?/discover/Canal World - All ActivityenI didn't say Ed Shiers was one of them...Sun, 09 Aug 2026 14:05:12 +0000That seems very contradictory, that the knowledgeable LFP installers that you mention, who you say contributed to the notes are still doing Lithium installs inside their living space living area. The very thing you say should be avoided. Inc Ed Shears looking at his social media.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 14:03:52 +0000I would imagine the same way -- I seem to remember seeing advice to exactly that effect (sealed box, vented to outside). Just to be clear, something needs to have gone very badly wrong with the system for this kind of severe outgassing to happen -- for example BMS failure, MPPT failure, cell damage/short-circuit, repeated overcharging. In this case you can't rely on the BMS doing a HV disconnect because it might not succeed, so the first suggestion is to have another secondary backup means for limiting charging voltage or disconnecting the battery (as in the Guidance Note). But *if* all this fails -- which should a a very rare occurrence! -- the battery can emit large volumes of gas, something like 100x more (500l/kWh?) than a lead-acid battery, and this is both toxic and potentially explosive in a confined space. So you need to stop anyone onboard breathing it in and vent it outside the boat, where it will dissipate harmlessly. The problem is that until recently this risk was seen as a largely theoretical one only of concern to regulation-writers (e.g. ISO -- not legally binding in the UK) and it was assumed that it was perfectly safe to put LFP batteries anywhere you wanted, including inside the boat. Now that this outgassing has destroyed a boat in an explosion -- and it's only by luck that nobody was killed -- the risk is seen as real (if small), and it can't be ignored any more. LFP batteries are still much *much* safer than the other lithium-ion chemistries with their unstoppable high-temperature fires/explosions so beloved of YouTube, but they're no longer the "perfectly safe" solution they were seen as... 😞Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:49:23 +0000Yes my friend who was asking the question just found that. Got me thinking how motorhome/camper van insurers are handling the same issueSun, 09 Aug 2026 13:47:17 +0000Who?Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:46:50 +0000I was going to say Wot No Foxes... But.... Super bits of kit arnt they for very little moneySun, 09 Aug 2026 13:45:44 +0000Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:45:44 +0000If only they had google....Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:42:20 +0000Maybe if they knew what that was 🤷🏻‍♂️Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:41:14 +0000Have they tried RTFM?Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:38:58 +0000Not always... 😞 There will be one somewhere... 😉Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:38:06 +0000My friend who the question was asked for (🤣) is current looking for the vent in his Victron LifePo4 batteries!Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:37:19 +0000Just wear dark sunglasses and carry a white stick.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:35:45 +0000Well, they could leave the paddleboard behind and just walk across (and back). This would enable them to enjoy the view more (not distracted by paddleboard) and would not delay boat crossings.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:35:06 +0000Yes they have vents in, but in normal operation nothing ever comes out (unlike some LA batteries). To get major gas venting something must have gone badly wrong, either battery/cell/BMS failure or repeated overcharging/HV cutout (which the BMS is supposed to protect against). This can happen due to things like an MPPT controller failing short-circuit and dumping 100V into a 12V BMS and destroying it (this has happened), or some other unknown failure (as happened with the ABC dayboat), possibly due to poor system design or configuration errors. These are not frequent occurrences but have happened *very* occasionally. If this does happen very large quantities of gas can be given off, and this is both toxic if breathed and inflammable/explosive in a confined space (e.g. inside a boat), which is what destroyed the ABC dayboat. Yes this was electric propulsion, but domestic-sized LFP batteries (anything above 1kWh IIRC) carry a similar risk. It's not in any way a big enough risk for most boaters to lose sleep about, the biggest risk is what conditions their insurer may impose (now or in future) when LFP batteries are installed -- and that if they don't tell their insurer, their cover may be invalid.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:34:23 +0000No. A small, deliberately structured weak spot breaks. The blue bit in the pic below. EVE 314AHr cell.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:34:13 +0000Once the case has split open?Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:33:12 +0000Well yes exactly. But this is all about heading off the consequences of your "should" not happening. The danger is when the BMS fails and continues charging a fully charged cell. In extremis they vent huge volumes of poisonous gas.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:32:31 +0000I’m sure there’s a work around. You seems to be talking yourself out of it when many people cope quite well with a dog onboardSun, 09 Aug 2026 13:32:24 +0000But to vent the case of the battery has to split open ?Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:30:45 +0000I typically work 7 am to 11 am and may do the same or similar work in future. My partner (if he ends up sharing a boat) works from home 99% of the time, though had to go in 2-3 times a year. Plus, things like doctors appointments happen. I want to be prepared for all eventualities and not overlook anything. I can't assume that the dog will never be alone on a locked, moored boat during daylight hours. I can't assume that there won't be more heatwaves.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:30:25 +0000The cells usually have structures that vent at a set overpressure, so the cell should not split. However, it is the volume of gas that can be released and the risk of it forming an explosive mix in the space where the batt is that is the problem. Hence a ventilated space, outside the occupied cabin. A BMS is a single point of failure. A FET failing closed circuit, for example, could lead to cells continuing to receive chaege, when the BMS tries to disconnect. Hence there should be integration with charging sources to stop charging, before the BMS has to disconnect.Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:28:46 +0000Do some lithium batteries have vents in them then? If they don’t what’s the point of them venting outside. Surely it’s a bit late if the battery case has split and it’s emitting gas. Shouldn’t the BMS have cut it off before that? (Asking for a friend who’s not an expert in this )Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:24:04 +0000Thanks. Although the thing I didn't say was we were considering coming up from Kingswood and wondered if we could turn to avoid reversing back 😀 However we had a change of plan anyway. Thanks for the replies thoughSun, 09 Aug 2026 13:20:14 +0000Toʻ get too the other side😘Sun, 09 Aug 2026 13:17:22 +0000