big rail development planned for Blisworth

[gazza]

In our local rag today

 

http://m.northamptonchron.co.uk/news/local/rail-depot-measuring-8-million-square-feet-planned-for-fields-near-northampton-1-7143527

 

It would spell the end for the Northampton Motorcycle Club using the land belonging to Arm Farm for the boxing day Wild and wooly Scramble - the oldest event in the UK at 90 years young.

[Leo No2]

I knew it was on the cards that this would happen. The local Parish Councils, I understand, are vehemently against it which is more than understandable but I can see the location is strategically good for what is planned. If it does go ahead I do hope the local villages don't suffer (not in my back yard please!) and that the infrastructure is built to support it. Government doesn't, in my opinion, have a good record on that front.

[kbarber]

It looks as if it might be accessed from either the Northampton ('New') line or the 'Old Road'. But by that stage there's a significant height difference between Northampton and 'Main' lines, so serving the site off both (presumably daytime access off the new Line and the Old Road only available at night) wouldn't necessarily be an easy answer.

 

If they think they're going to get access via the Old Road in the daytime, they can think again. It's all double track and (per the thread about WCML traffic a couple of weeks ago) it's pretty much at capacity with the Bearded One's flashy Pendolinos. If they want freight on that line during passenger hours they'll have to start with restoring Heyford loops but I suspect even that won't suffice and they'll need substantial lengths of 4-tracking to give the capacity they'll need. So the comment that this site gives access to the Main Line is pretty nonsensical without huge additional investment in the route beyond the site boundaries.

 

I don't know if that factor might appear in submissions to the Planning Committee. Would need a bit more research to back it up, but that's not difficult. Network Rail even have a 'Rules of the Plan' document online to indicate things like sectional running times and margins.

[gazza]

The road access is not what you would call ideal for the amount of lorries that would need to service the depot either.

 

It will be a shame if NMCC struggle for a venue as the Woolly is a Boxing day favourite for thousands of spectators and raises a huge amount for local charities with the bucket shake.

 

Oh, well, I rode the Woolly three times there, they had a year off at Market Harborough a few years ago and have run at Bob Jones place near the M1 at Malsor in the past.

 

Absolutely no chance of getting back to Tunnel Hill Farm mores the pity though.

Edited January 5, 2016 by gazza

[Leo No2]

There's a lot of information here - http://blisworthparishcouncil.org.uk (as you would imagine) - one of the documents is quite large (174 pages and no I haven't read them all!)

Edited January 5, 2016 by Leo No2

[gazza]

There's a lot of information here - http://blisworthparishcouncil.org.uk (as you would imagine) - one of the documents is quite large (174 pages and no I haven't read them all!)

Thanks, I'll have a look at that during my lunch break.

[furnessvale]

It looks as if it might be accessed from either the Northampton ('New') line or the 'Old Road'. But by that stage there's a significant height difference between Northampton and 'Main' lines, so serving the site off both (presumably daytime access off the new Line and the Old Road only available at night) wouldn't necessarily be an easy answer.

 

If they think they're going to get access via the Old Road in the daytime, they can think again. It's all double track and (per the thread about WCML traffic a couple of weeks ago) it's pretty much at capacity with the Bearded One's flashy Pendolinos. If they want freight on that line during passenger hours they'll have to start with restoring Heyford loops but I suspect even that won't suffice and they'll need substantial lengths of 4-tracking to give the capacity they'll need. So the comment that this site gives access to the Main Line is pretty nonsensical without huge additional investment in the route beyond the site boundaries.

 

I don't know if that factor might appear in submissions to the Planning Committee. Would need a bit more research to back it up, but that's not difficult. Network Rail even have a 'Rules of the Plan' document online to indicate things like sectional running times and margins.

I doubt they would even consider regular access off the Old Road for freight.

 

As you say, the difference in level between old and new lines is substantial at that point and I would think the whole depot would be designed around 24 hours access off the old line.

 

Whether a connection to the new line could be squeezed in, for use if the old line was closed at night for maintenance, is open to conjecture, but with a site a mile long I suppose some sort of incline could be designed.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[gazza]

I take what you are referring to as the 'Old Line'is the former SM&JR? Affectionately knicknamed the Smelly, Mouldy and Jarring by a certain LTC Rolt.

Edited January 5, 2016 by gazza

[LEO]

Could be worse, try living with HS2 ruining a large area of the Chilterns and beyond......

 

L

[alan_fincher]

If they think they're going to get access via the Old Road in the daytime, they can think again. It's all double track and (per the thread about WCML traffic a couple of weeks ago) it's pretty much at capacity with the Bearded One's flashy Pendolinos. If they want freight on that line during passenger hours they'll have to start with restoring Heyford loops but I suspect even that won't suffice and they'll need substantial lengths of 4-tracking to give the capacity they'll need. So the comment that this site gives access to the Main Line is pretty nonsensical without huge additional investment in the route beyond the site boundaries.

Yes - I admit I have not studied this at all, but I agree, it is very hard to imagine that proximity to the two track main line is of any advantage at all. You only have to watch it from the canal during daytime to appreciate that what is on it is very fast and very frequent, with no reasonable possibility of freight traffic in times of normal operations.

[Cheshire cat]

We've just moved out of Gayton Marina. The noise from the bypass is quite intrusive. Building a transhipment facility of this size can only bring more noise.

[furnessvale]

We've just moved out of Gayton Marina. The noise from the bypass is quite intrusive. Building a transhipment facility of this size can only bring more noise.

Apart from the fact that, once transshipped to rail, that same freight will cause much less intrusion for many more people for the rest of its journey of perhaps 100s of miles.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[furnessvale]

Could be worse, try living with HS2 ruining a large area of the Chilterns and beyond......

 

Would that be the bit not already ruined by the M40, A41, A413, A4010, West Coast Main (railway) Line, Aylesbury railway line and even the Grand Junction Canal.

 

Progress happens. The alternative is more road traffic and a third motorway, perhaps neatly bisecting the existing M40 and M1 routes.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[LEO]

 

Could be worse, try living with HS2 ruining a large area of the Chilterns and beyond......

 

Would that be the bit not already ruined by the M40, A41, A413, A4010, West Coast Main (railway) Line, Aylesbury railway line and even the Grand Junction Canal.

 

Progress happens. The alternative is more road traffic and a third motorway, perhaps neatly bisecting the existing M40 and M1 routes.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

 

Cheerfully agreed, that's why I did not condem the HS2 outright. the Chilterns have adjusted to all the trough traffic you mention since the Ancient Brits created the Ridgeway path and at Cowroast we are between the A41 and the WCML.

 

The proposed rail depot will fit in, it's the initial 'knee jerk' reaction which creates the problems.

 

With an ever increasing population these improvements are needed.

 

L

 

Edited January 5, 2016 by LEO

[tillergirl]

I understand that if this gets the go ahead there will be lots of valuable farmland lost and many compulsory purchases of property. I also understand there was a preliminary meeting last night at Blisworth Village Hall and it is being rescheduled to a bigger venue because so many people turned out to attend. Apparently destroying two beautiful villages is called progress. I really feel for all those it is going to affect.

[YamYam]

Don't know the proposed area at all but hopefully it will turn into a 'third runway scenario' and go on for years although thats not much comfort for those affected

[valrene9600]

I understand that if this gets the go ahead there will be lots of valuable farmland lost and many compulsory purchases of property. I also understand there was a preliminary meeting last night at Blisworth Village Hall and it is being rescheduled to a bigger venue because so many people turned out to attend. Apparently destroying two beautiful villages is called progress. I really feel for all those it is going to affect.

Not looked at plans but the rail side will stay on rails and not come through villages. The thing that will kill the villages wwill be traffic. The planning permission should insist on new roads to and from a trunk road. No other traffic other than for the depot. No other way in.

[furnessvale]

Not looked at plans but the rail side will stay on rails and not come through villages. The thing that will kill the villages wwill be traffic. The planning permission should insist on new roads to and from a trunk road. No other traffic other than for the depot. No other way in.

Certainly Dirft Daventry is better located, having direct access to the M1.

 

If its any consolation the proposed terminal at Alconbury has been going on for about 10 years. Meanwhile of course, the goods are doing 100% of their journey by road thus ensuring we all get a bit of the misery.

 

Someone earlier mentioned we all have some cross to bear for the greater good, eg power station or wind turbines for example. I have a major trunk road, two railway lines, overhead national grid, flightpath to Manchester airport......oh, and an oil pipeline!

 

The thing is, if you can get the thing passing YOUR front door stopped, it is highly unlikely that the alternative will also pass YOUR door.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[Cheshire cat]

Unlikely or likely?

 

When I said it was noisy I wasn't wanting to stop the scheme, I was merely thinking Gayton Marina is likely to become less popular.

[furnessvale]

Unlikely or likely?

 

Unlikely.

 

If a major rail scheme is proposed, it is highly unlikely that the alternative, increased road traffic or even a new road, will pass the same set of houses.

 

Thus is NIMBYism born.

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[keif's mate]

I first spectated the Wild & Woolly 45 years ago at at the Tunnel Farm venue. Mate parked (slid ) his series 1 in the ditch, many hip flasks were passed round then we went to the pub afterwards happy days!!!!

[kbarber]

I take what you are referring to as the 'Old Line'is the former SM&JR? Affectionately knicknamed the Smelly, Mouldy and Jarring by a certain LTC Rolt.

No, sorry, this was (in my day at least) railwaymens' terminology for the original London & Birmingham Railway main line that ran via Blisworth & Weedon; the loop via Northampton came somewhat later, hence 'Old Road' and 'New Line'.

[gazza]

No, sorry, this was (in my day at least) railwaymens' terminology for the original London & Birmingham Railway main line that ran via Blisworth & Weedon; the loop via Northampton came somewhat later, hence 'Old Road' and 'New Line'.

Ah, right, I'm not a railway buff by any means!

 

Rolts term for the Stratford upon Avon and Midland Junction stuck in my mind!

 

Quick look on wiki reveals this:-

 

Today the only part of the SMJR still open is the 5 miles (8 km) section between Fenny Compton and the Ministry of Defence depot at Kineton.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratford-upon-Avon_and_Midland_Junction_Railway

 

Cheers.

 

Gaz.

I first spectated the Wild & Woolly 45 years ago at at the Tunnel Farm venue. Mate parked (slid ) his series 1 in the ditch, many hip flasks were passed round then we went to the pub afterwards happy days!!!!

Sounds like good fun, bit more sanitised with double ropes and scores of marshals these days!

[gazza]

Looking at the route of the S&MJR I have actually used some of the track bed on a Hare and Hounds Enduro at Woodend to the west of Blakesley!

[furnessvale]

No, sorry, this was (in my day at least) railwaymens' terminology for the original London & Birmingham Railway main line that ran via Blisworth & Weedon; the loop via Northampton came somewhat later, hence 'Old Road' and 'New Line'.

In which case, one of my earlier posts has the two lines wrongly identified.

 

Not being from this area, I was identifying the lines from my misreading of your earlier post.

 

Sorry for any confusion.

 

George ex nb Alton retired