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#1 janeygirle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 09:12 AM

Hello everyone.

I need some help with my water system. The water heater and pump have all died recently, the pump was as old as the boat which is a 1971 30' Springer and the boiler was rather ancient too. I have ordered a NEW 12L GAS LPG PROPANE TANKLESS INSTANT HOT WATER HEATER BOILER. The water pressure was pretty pathetic to start with and although the new water heater is built for low pressure I want to get the best possible. The pump is situated just by the water tank in the bow and the boiler is about 23' astern of it. What is the best pump for me to buy,bearing in mind I don't have too much money but want to get it right. Thanks.

Janey
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#2 Titus

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 09:39 AM

Hello everyone.

I need some help with my water system. The water heater and pump have all died recently, the pump was as old as the boat which is a 1971 30' Springer and the boiler was rather ancient too. I have ordered a NEW 12L GAS LPG PROPANE TANKLESS INSTANT HOT WATER HEATER BOILER. The water pressure was pretty pathetic to start with and although the new water heater is built for low pressure I want to get the best possible. The pump is situated just by the water tank in the bow and the boiler is about 23' astern of it. What is the best pump for me to buy,bearing in mind I don't have too much money but want to get it right. Thanks.

Janey


Hi Janey,
I've just got rid of my 30ft Springer, it's water tank was in the bow and the pump under the front seat (about 4ft from the tank) I can't remember what sort of pump it was but it wasn't anything special and it coped well to provide water to the gas water heater (which was situated near the stern) with no problems.
Hope that helps

Dave
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#3 janeygirle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 10:51 AM

Hi Janey,
I've just got rid of my 30ft Springer, it's water tank was in the bow and the pump under the front seat (about 4ft from the tank) I can't remember what sort of pump it was but it wasn't anything special and it coped well to provide water to the gas water heater (which was situated near the stern) with no problems.
Hope that helps

Dave


thanks Dave, the pump is directly in front of tank so shouldn't be any difference to yours, trouble is, and not to be rude or put too fine a point on it I could wee faster than the water comes out of the taps, don't think thats right, or am I expecting too much?

Just as a matter of interest what engine did you have in yours? Mine a bit feeble against the tide and wind on the Broads, I get overtaken by ducks frequently and if the wind is strong have been known to drift sideways down the river, slightly disconcerting for the fibreglass holiday boats who would undoubtedly come off worst.

cheers

J
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#4 trackman

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 11:34 AM

Hi Janey,

There are two main types of water pump in common use, Jabsco and Sureflow Aquaking. I have the latter type. They aren't cheap and I hear the Jabsco ones may cost less. The first Sureflow I had lasted 5 years and may have died due to the severe frosts last winter. The replacement lasted less than a year! However the supplier replaced it under warranty with no fuss and entirely free of charge.

Sureflow used to have a brilliant reputation but I hear that new designs introduced in recent years have been less reliable. My experience seems to back this up as the first pump we had was the old design and the second was the new version.

Jabsco are great according to some I've heard from, but others are less complementary. I'd go for whichever you can buy for less, I don't think the difference in quality is likely to be great. I searched on-line to find the best price when seeking the replacement last winter.

If you can get an idea of the pressure setting and flow rate of the existing pump and buy one with similar ratings it will be more likely to work well with the rest of your set-up than if it's wildly different. The sort of issues that might arise will be around the pressure and flow rate your new water heater requires. My pump runs at up to 30psi and 12litres/min if I remember rightly, which I think is pretty typical these days. I can't say how that would compare with your boat of course.





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#5 blodger

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 11:42 AM

On Ebay BuyNow 30psi & 10.6 ltrs per min about 50.00 but they can end up cheaper on the bidding or buying second hand
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#6 smileypete

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 11:42 AM

thanks Dave, the pump is directly in front of tank so shouldn't be any difference to yours, trouble is, and not to be rude or put too fine a point on it I could wee faster than the water comes out of the taps, don't think thats right, or am I expecting too much?

Just as a matter of interest what engine did you have in yours? Mine a bit feeble against the tide and wind on the Broads, I get overtaken by ducks frequently and if the wind is strong have been known to drift sideways down the river, slightly disconcerting for the fibreglass holiday boats who would undoubtedly come off worst.

First of all, welcome to the forum! :)

Pump may well have had it, but check for a blocked strainer/filter or collapsed/kinked hoses before or after the pump, also dodgy looking electrical connections. If you have a 12 volt test lamp or a multimeter, you could try it across the pump connections with the pump running or off.

If the pump IS gone, I think most people find a 10 litre per minute 30PSI cut-off pressure one is fine for that sort of water heater. A pump of that capacity starts at about £50 from Ebay or discount/online chandlers, check it comes with a strainer or there is a suitable one already.

Shurflo are usually the cheapest but not super-reliable, Jabsco or Johnston are other makes that come to mind, generally you get what you pay for more or less...

cheers,
Pete.

Edited by smileypete, 14 February 2012 - 11:43 AM.

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#7 Titus

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 12:15 PM

thanks Dave, the pump is directly in front of tank so shouldn't be any difference to yours, trouble is, and not to be rude or put too fine a point on it I could wee faster than the water comes out of the taps, don't think thats right, or am I expecting too much?

Just as a matter of interest what engine did you have in yours? Mine a bit feeble against the tide and wind on the Broads, I get overtaken by ducks frequently and if the wind is strong have been known to drift sideways down the river, slightly disconcerting for the fibreglass holiday boats who would undoubtedly come off worst.

cheers

J


Hi Janey,
Firstly, I've checked and the pump we had was a jabsco and we never had any problem with the water pressure at all, it was excellent.
Re the engine, when we first bought the boat it had a single cylinder Ducati engine in that was dreadful, it was so noisey and also a bit under powered, luckily my dad blew that engine up and we shopped round to find a second hand one that fit and came up with a 3 cylinder Mitsubushi Vetus. Perhaps it was a little too large for the boat ! but we never had any problems power wise especially on the rivers!!!!.
A Lovely little boat that we had in the family for 17 yrs but now gone to a new life in Lancashire.

Dave
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#8 janeygirle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 12:27 PM

First of all, welcome to the forum! :)

Pump may well have had it, but check for a blocked strainer/filter or collapsed/kinked hoses before or after the pump, also dodgy looking electrical connections. If you have a 12 volt test lamp or a multimeter, you could try it across the pump connections with the pump running or off.

If the pump IS gone, I think most people find a 10 litre per minute 30PSI cut-off pressure one is fine for that sort of water heater. A pump of that capacity starts at about 50 from Ebay or discount/online chandlers, check it comes with a strainer or there is a suitable one already.

Shurflo are usually the cheapest but not super-reliable, Jabsco or Johnston are other makes that come to mind, generally you get what you pay for more or less...

cheers,
Pete.


Wow, great responses, thanks everyone. The existing pump is a Jabsco. I have checked the filter and hoses, all clear and unkinked but don't have a multimeter to check connections. Will have to get one anyway cos I am sure it will come in useful and I love an excuse for gadgets :) Am learning all the time with this boat. I have looked at the spec for the new heater and this is what it says,

Suitable Water Pressure(Mpa)0.02~~0.8Mpa

To be honest I can do loads of do it your self things mainly carpentry and common sense but am not very well up on this sort of thing. Any figures other than ft and inches in measurements send my brain into a mush.

Love ebay so will check that out.

cheers everybody.
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#9 janeygirle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 12:46 PM

Hi Janey,
Firstly, I've checked and the pump we had was a jabsco and we never had any problem with the water pressure at all, it was excellent.
Re the engine, when we first bought the boat it had a single cylinder Ducati engine in that was dreadful, it was so noisey and also a bit under powered, luckily my dad blew that engine up and we shopped round to find a second hand one that fit and came up with a 3 cylinder Mitsubushi Vetus. Perhaps it was a little too large for the boat ! but we never had any problems power wise especially on the rivers!!!!.
A Lovely little boat that we had in the family for 17 yrs but now gone to a new life in Lancashire.

Dave


Hey, I think I got the one your dad blew up :huh: I have the manual too, all curling yellow sellotape and oily thumbprints. It doesn't actually look a lot like the pictures in the manual, I think people have adapted it over the years. It is extremely noisy but in my ignorance when I bought the boat I thought it was supposed to sound like that :wacko: I know more about sailing boats, actually, thats not true anymore.

Putting another engine in is certainly high on my list now I have completed the inside renovations.

cheers

J
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#10 bottle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 04:38 PM

Suitable Water Pressure(Mpa)0.02~~0.8Mpa


Then if this correct (from Wikipedia)


Standard atmospheric pressure is 101,325 Pa
= 101.325 kPa
= 1013.25 hPa
= 1.01325 bar
= 0.101325 MPa
= 760 Torr[4]
= 14.696 psi.

Your heater requires a pump in the range of 3 to 116 psi

Does it give a flow rate?

ps. Can someone, please, check my maths, results are rounded.

Edited by bottle, 14 February 2012 - 04:40 PM.

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Keith.

What you said, what you thought you said and what I thought you said are THREE different things.



#11 Chris Pink

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 04:58 PM

Then if this correct (from Wikipedia)


Standard atmospheric pressure is 101,325 Pa
= 101.325 kPa
= 1013.25 hPa
= 1.01325 bar
= 0.101325 MPa
= 760 Torr[4]
= 14.696 psi.

Your heater requires a pump in the range of 3 to 116 psi

Does it give a flow rate?

ps. Can someone, please, check my maths, results are rounded.

It's easier to convert to googles first;

http://www.google.co...1.8-1l6l0&mvs=0

3 to 118psi is water speak for "whatever (you want)"
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#12 Keeping Up

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 05:02 PM

Yes the maths check out. I've got a useful little conversion program on my PC, which gives 2.9 to 116 psi
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#13 bottle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 05:07 PM

Thanks both.

Then it will be the flow rate that will effect the temperature of the water at outlet. (ps. I know this just trying to help Janey pick her new pump.)
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Keith.

What you said, what you thought you said and what I thought you said are THREE different things.



#14 janeygirle

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 06:35 PM

Then if this correct (from Wikipedia)


Standard atmospheric pressure is 101,325 Pa
= 101.325 kPa
= 1013.25 hPa
= 1.01325 bar
= 0.101325 MPa
= 760 Torr[4]
= 14.696 psi.

Your heater requires a pump in the range of 3 to 116 psi

Does it give a flow rate?

ps. Can someone, please, check my maths, results are rounded.


:help: WHAT?, I mean pardon?

Crikey, how smart are you guys. Well you know what, I am going to take your word for it. This is the other stuff from the spec,

Heating Status Heating time <=15 Seconds; Over Temperature <=2?; Stability Time:<=15 Seconds
Connection Pipe Specs Water Inlet: G1/2" Pipe; Water Outlet: G1/2" Pipe; Gas Inlet:G1/2" Pipe;
Rated Heat Input Power(KW) 24KW
Rated Water Output(?T=25?)L/Min 12L

Well, there was also the dimensions of the packing they will send it in but even I figured you don't need that bit :rolleyes:

Thanks again, at least I know what I am looking for, well, the 3 to 116psi bit anyway.

cheers again

Janey
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#15 jelunga

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 09:27 PM

Hi Janey,

There are two main types of water pump in common use, Jabsco and Sureflow Aquaking. I have the latter type. They aren't cheap and I hear the Jabsco ones may cost less. The first Sureflow I had lasted 5 years and may have died due to the severe frosts last winter. The replacement lasted less than a year! However the supplier replaced it under warranty with no fuss and entirely free of charge.

Sureflow used to have a brilliant reputation but I hear that new designs introduced in recent years have been less reliable. My experience seems to back this up as the first pump we had was the old design and the second was the new version.

Jabsco are great according to some I've heard from, but others are less complementary. I'd go for whichever you can buy for less, I don't think the difference in quality is likely to be great. I searched on-line to find the best price when seeking the replacement last winter.

If you can get an idea of the pressure setting and flow rate of the existing pump and buy one with similar ratings it will be more likely to work well with the rest of your set-up than if it's wildly different. The sort of issues that might arise will be around the pressure and flow rate your new water heater requires. My pump runs at up to 30psi and 12litres/min if I remember rightly, which I think is pretty typical these days. I can't say how that would compare with your boat of course.


Yes, the latest Surflo ones seem to be now made in Mexico with a crap cheap plastic pump. I have seen stronger looking eggshells. Another pump to look for is a flo-jet. They are a little more expensive but still seem very well built. Unless of course they gave gone cheep and foreign since I last bought one!
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#16 smileypete

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 02:01 PM

Yes, the latest Surflo ones seem to be now made in Mexico with a crap cheap plastic pump. I have seen stronger looking eggshells. Another pump to look for is a flo-jet. They are a little more expensive but still seem very well built. Unless of course they gave gone cheep and foreign since I last bought one!

Seems Flojet are make in USA, UK or China (clicky)

Floking pumps are made in the UK (clicky 1 clicky 2)

cheers,
Pete.
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#17 janeygirle

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 04:34 PM

Seems Flojet are make in USA, UK or China (clicky)

Floking pumps are made in the UK (clicky 1 clicky 2)

cheers,
Pete.


Thanks Pete,
wouldn't do to be asking for the last one if you've got a speech impediment :rolleyes:
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#18 Grace & Favour

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 05:00 PM

Thanks Pete,
wouldn't do to be asking for the last one if you've got a speech impediment :rolleyes:


At least they don't make a Floking 'L' series

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