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I need advice....

Roxy

By Roxy
in Living Afloat

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dave moore Influencer

dave moore

Posted
Posted

Hi

 

The Kelvin J3 (not jp 3, that's the Lister) is a superb piece of kit if it's properly set up. I have one in my own boat and it's a beauty. Having said that, they are a vintage engine that require more than a turn of t he key to start but once running they go for ever. Maintenance is an oil change , simple but messy and occasional valve clearance adjustment. They were designed to operate in Scots fishing boats and are rugged, solid lumps. I'm happy to talk, call me on 07831 243001 if you wish to. Expert help is not far away to check the engine over if needed.

 

Cheers

 

Dave

Roxy Proficient

Roxy

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Hi

 

The Kelvin J3 (not jp 3, that's the Lister) is a superb piece of kit if it's properly set up. I have one in my own boat and it's a beauty. Having said that, they are a vintage engine that require more than a turn of t he key to start but once running they go for ever. Maintenance is an oil change , simple but messy and occasional valve clearance adjustment. They were designed to operate in Scots fishing boats and are rugged, solid lumps. I'm happy to talk, call me on 07831 243001 if you wish to. Expert help is not far away to check the engine over if needed.

 

Cheers

 

Dave

 

Brill Dave, thanks for that, I'm used to my BMC 1.5 which has been easy to maintain etc

 

However why do they have it listed as having a JP3 'Lister' when it's a J3? I'm confused

Speedwheel Influencer

Speedwheel

Posted
Posted

However why do they have it listed as having a JP3 'Lister' when it's a J3? I'm confused

 

Because they don't really know/understand what they are selling.

Grace and Favour Veteran II

Grace and Favour

Posted
Posted

Brill Dave, thanks for that, I'm used to my BMC 1.5 which has been easy to maintain etc

 

However why do they have it listed as having a JP3 'Lister' when it's a J3? I'm confused

 

You'll probably find the reason why it's been mis-described is that it's Sawley Marina that have put the advert together

 

You're lucky that they recognise it as a boat!

Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted

You'll probably find the reason why it's been mis-described is that it's Sawley Marina that have put the advert together

 

You're lucky that they recognise it as a boat!

 

Agreed.

 

BWML are indeed crap and frankly amateurishness at posting boat details - there is no way I would let them broker any boat I was selling.

ditchcrawler Veteran II

ditchcrawler

Posted
Posted

Hi

 

The Kelvin J3 (not jp 3, that's the Lister) is a superb piece of kit if it's properly set up. I have one in my own boat and it's a beauty. Having said that, they are a vintage engine that require more than a turn of t he key to start but once running they go for ever. Maintenance is an oil change , simple but messy and occasional valve clearance adjustment. They were designed to operate in Scots fishing boats and are rugged, solid lumps. I'm happy to talk, call me on 07831 243001 if you wish to. Expert help is not far away to check the engine over if needed.

 

Cheers

 

Dave

What size prop would it want?

dave moore Influencer

dave moore

Posted
Posted

Hi again

 

Prop size is partly dependent on the depth of the swim. Resolute has 28'' of swim and I recall that we fitted a 23 by 19 to start. This was a bit big, not allowing the boat to creep along at tick over. Graham Edgson( builder) took it off ( locking not split pin to secure the prop), I made a wooden pattern and we cut some 5/8" from each blade, linished up and refitted......perfect! Graham has long experience, this isn't an amateur option.

 

Dave

 

Hi again

 

Prop size is partly dependent on the depth of the swim. Resolute has 28'' of swim and I recall that we fitted a 23 by 19 to start. This was a bit big, not allowing the boat to creep along at tick over. Graham Edgson( builder) took it off ( locking not split pin to secure the prop), I made a wooden pattern and we cut some 5/8" from each blade, linished up and refitted......perfect! Graham has long experience, this isn't an amateur option.

 

Dave

Roxy Proficient

Roxy

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You'll probably find the reason why it's been mis-described is that it's Sawley Marina that have put the advert together

 

You're lucky that they recognise it as a boat!

 

Great! So I'm not sure at what enjin it is nor have they! great advertising/salesman

ditchcrawler Veteran II

ditchcrawler

Posted
Posted (edited)

Hi again

 

Prop size is partly dependent on the depth of the swim. Resolute has 28'' of swim and I recall that we fitted a 23 by 19 to start. This was a bit big, not allowing the boat to creep along at tick over. Graham Edgson( builder) took it off ( locking not split pin to secure the prop), I made a wooden pattern and we cut some 5/8" from each blade, linished up and refitted......perfect! Graham has long experience, this isn't an amateur option.

 

Dave

 

 

The reason I asked as this boat only has a 2ft draught

Edited by ditchcrawler
Roxy Proficient

Roxy

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You'll probably find the reason why it's been mis-described is that it's Sawley Marina that have put the advert togetherYou're lucky that they recognise it as a boat!

 

 

Agreed.BWML are indeed crap and frankly amateurishness at posting boat details - there is no way I would let them broker any boat I was selling.

 

 

If yo ugive Sawley a ring, and ask for Paul Sissons or John, they'll pop down to the boat and i.d. it for you

 

Now I'm really confused............ :wacko::blink::unsure::banghead::huh:

MtB Veteran II

MtB

Posted
Posted

On this :

 

http://www.bwml.co.u...ge/sm_8814_elan

 

Is the Kelvin JP3 reliable? easy to maintain? This would be my ideal liveaboard boat ( I think) apart from looking at it in real life, is it worth the money, if not a resonable offer?

 

Looks quite a good deal to me, if it's what you want. It prolly hasn't sold because the vintage engine puts off buyers wanting a modern Reeves 'shiney boat', and the boring modern Reeves hull puts off buyers of interesting boats with vintage engines.

 

It's a Kelvin J3 engine, relaible yes, easy to maintain, yes, cheap to repair if it goes wrong, no.

 

One option would be to buy yhr boat a change the engine. Sale of the J3 would more or less cover the cost of fitting a boring engine to match the hull ;)

 

MtB

alan_fincher Veteran II

alan_fincher

Posted
Posted

I kind of agree Mike the Boilerman's comments.

 

This is an odd marrying together of a modern shell from a builder that is well respected, with a vintage engine that would be desirable to many, but I would not thought of desirable to that many in that shell.

 

The shell, (which is just"bog standard" modern leisure boat), might more normally expected to have a modern engine like Beta, Isuzu, Vetus, Nanni or whatever.

 

The engine would be more at home in some kid of genuinely old boat, or in some kind of modern "replica" at least based on an old boat.

 

I suspect if the Reeves hull is genuinely the standard "two feet and not very much" under the counter, the engine and gearbox are unlikely to be matched to a suitable propeller - or, if they are, a big prop may have been squeezed in, but with its blade tips really not having adequate clearances under the counter or from the skeg.

 

You have the "complication" of a 24 volt starting system, (so need two normal starter batteries not one), and it may well not be an engine suited to chugging along off load to charge domestic batteries if your primary use is live-aboard, without really moving on every day.

 

The advert does not (I think) say what insulation is used - something that has arisen in several threads recently about bats used as live-aboards.

 

Also, taken at face value the BSS is about to run out.

 

As I very much suspect you are not a vintage engine fan,or probably have o great desire to become one, unless you want to get involved in an engine swap, my advice would be "avoid".

 

It is very hard to see who a boat like this would appeal to. That must drag down its value, and would continue to do so if you subsequently wanted to sell it on, I think.

Higgs Rising Star

Higgs

Posted
Posted

The shell builders are reputable. The engine also looks good and apparently is good. There is a mis-match between shell and engine, but neither are bad separately. The price seems ok. Some of the fitout is a bit spartan. It's only 12 years old, so should have lots of life left.

BEngo Veteran II

BEngo

Posted
Posted

I kind of agree Mike the Boilerman's comments.

 

This is an odd marrying together of a modern shell from a builder that is well respected, with a vintage engine that would be desirable to many, but I would not thought of desirable to that many in that shell.

 

The shell, (which is just"bog standard" modern leisure boat), might more normally expected to have a modern engine like Beta, Isuzu, Vetus, Nanni or whatever.

 

The engine would be more at home in some kid of genuinely old boat, or in some kind of modern "replica" at least based on an old boat.

 

I suspect if the Reeves hull is genuinely the standard "two feet and not very much" under the counter, the engine and gearbox are unlikely to be matched to a suitable propeller - or, if they are, a big prop may have been squeezed in, but with its blade tips really not having adequate clearances under the counter or from the skeg.

 

 

 

Alan,

 

I agree this is a bit of a shell /engine mismatch, but it's mainly about aesthetics, not practicality. You may not recall that the Kelvin J box is always a direct drive with no reduction. Thus there is no need for a large prop. The "standard" scimitar bladed Kelvin-supplied 3 blade prop for a J3 was 21 dia x 15 pitch and Dave Moore above reports that his J3 is OK with a prop that has been reduced to "22 and a bit" diameter. Either size has slightly tight but acceptable clearance in a two-foot stern post, especially if the skeg has been droppped and the shaft is below the centre-line by an inch or so.

 

I don't know what the blade size is on Elan, but I'd bet there is a reasonable match.

 

 

The J3 is a wonderful engine, and will run like an old shoe if looked after. It is verrra definitely an engine for an enthusiast who is handy with a BSF spanner and who has good supplies of both elbow grease and Brasso. The magneto start can be a bit of a weak point, as is the need to keep a can of petrol, but there are ways round the magneto. The inlet manifold on this one has a couple of non-standard protrusions ( the bits with the red ends) which may be starting aids.

 

Check carefully that the prop thrust is transferred to the gearbox. Separate thrust bearings do not work well over the long term with this engine/gearbox.

 

 

N

Athy Veteran II

Athy

Posted
Posted

I kind of agree Mike the Boilerman's comments.

 

This is an odd marrying together of a modern shell from a builder that is well respected, with a vintage engine that would be desirable to many, but I would not thought of desirable to that many in that shell.

Possible scenario:

He: I want a boat with a lovely engine which I can polish and listen to.

She: I want a comfortable saloon, central heating, fully fitted kitchen and all mod cons.

They (after frank exchange of views followed by stony silence): O.K. then. That's a deal, let's go and see who will build us one.

 

That's just about the scenario when Mrs. Athy and I were planning our first new boat about 12 years ago. We ended up with a 40 foot Liverpool shell with a nice modern fit-out until you reached the blunty end, which had a gleaming Rigas Dizelis for all to see (and hear).It may be a commoner combination than you think.

  • 2 months later...
wiltshirewonderer Collaborator

wiltshirewonderer

Posted
Posted (edited)

Sorry for digging up an old thread but.... what was the outcome of this? (Apart from the boat not being purchased!). Did anyone view? Was it a mess? Was the exhaust a very deep and narrow fish pond? I ask as I'm heading up that wayon Saturday and I am wondering whether to have a look.

Thanks Mike for your youtube vids. Seems more complex to start but possibly (?!?!?) simpler to maintain than a 6.534 (The nearest I have ever come to a vintage engine), at least according to the manual I found online.

The idea of a fairly modern shell needing an interior refit (but liveable) and a classic engine is quite appealing. I wouldn't have thought I was that "special" though? This thing has been sat for over 2 years now which will also no doubt bring its own issues.

If it is a good boat, please can you not sneak in and buy it before I arrive before on Saturday..... rolleyes.gif

 

Edit was for spelling an availability of smilies now not on mobile phone

Edited by wiltshirewonderer

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