Anti freeze mix proportion for coolant

[nb Innisfree]

Normal Fernox is just a corrosion inhibitor and pump lubricant, you can add antifreeze but a I'm not sure which type. I believe Fernox inhibits corrosion by getting rid of surface tension in water so purging it of oxygen?, before Fernox plumbers used to add washing up liquid instead but prob with that is salt content.

[johnjo]

Normal Fernox is just a corrosion inhibitor and pump lubricant, you can add antifreeze but a I'm not sure which type. I believe Fernox inhibits corrosion by getting rid of surface tension in water so purging it of oxygen?, before Fernox plumbers used to add washing up liquid instead but prob with that is salt content.

 

 

Can only agree, what I've asked is whether it will mix with either blue/geen or red/purple anti-freeze without damage. And whether there are any benefits, I wouldn't have thought so in a modern fast revving diesel but there might be in the slower revving older diesel, if they are prone to a build up of gunge in the system, I don't know, are they?

Edited January 4, 2010 by johnjo

[DHutch]

There are other considerations. My Alde heater instructions say 50%. When I tried to get a replacement pump and impeller under warranty the Alde agents claimed, quit rightly, that I had been using a weaker mixture. (Oxide deposit on impeller blades) The cause of failure was no way related but they insisted. I stuck to my guns and eventually won my case. however I do not think it was worth the hassle.

I now run with a 50% mix, pump is quieter and radiators hotter!

Its not untrue. Most cars also start 50%

- However in your case, i have to say, i would have proberbly just told them i was using 50%

 

Its like when you moaning about broadband speeds, never mention your using a wireless connection to your router unless you want to spend an hour going through wireless settings before the put the hands up to the fact there line knackered and the contention rate in your area appalling.

 

 

Daniel

[nb Innisfree]

Lister Petter specify 40% antifreeze to be maintained under all conditions with their Alpha series.

[johnjo]

Just for the record here is the reply from Fernox regarding the use of their products in engines of any type and the mixing with anti-freeze in central heating systems.

 

Not really surprised, but was worth an email none-the-less

" Thank you for your email regarding engine cooling system treatment.

 

We regret the Fernox Protectors are not suitable for use in automotive cooling systems, primarily due to the higher surface temperatures and also the non-oxygen barriered rubber hosing used within the cooling circuits, which leads to an elevated dissolved oxygen level in the circulating water.

 

Also, we would not be able to assume compatibility with the antifreeze treatment currently employed." [Applies to blue/green or red/purple antifreeze].

Andrew Upton, Fernox Technical Services

Edited January 5, 2010 by johnjo

[David Schweizer]

I use a 40% mix and have done so for years, not sure where I got that percentage from, but as the engine coolant is the same water that travels around the central heating system on our boat, I may have elected for a higher than normally recommended percentage to improve corrosion inhibition.

 

I also always top up with the same mixture, which reminds me I have to get some more as I have almost run out

[steelaway]

I use a 40% mix and have done so for years, not sure where I got that percentage from, but as the engine coolant is the same water that travels around the central heating system on our boat, I may have elected for a higher than normally recommended percentage to improve corrosion inhibition.

 

I also always top up with the same mixture, which reminds me I have to get some more as I have almost run out

 

 

I think you might be suprised at the price. It seems to gone up mightily over the last year.

 

Alex

[NB Alnwick]

It is possibly worth mentioning that a mix of 50% Ethylene Glycol provides the best protection against freezing. If either the proportion of water or the proportion of Ethylene Glycol is increased beyond 50%, then the effectiveness of the mixture as an antifreeze will be reduced.

 

It is also worth mentioning that such a mixture is extremely toxic and may only be disposed of via specialist waste contractors. It should not, under any circumstances be tipped into the canal, over land or down drains.

Edited January 5, 2010 by NB Alnwick

[steelaway]

It is possibly worth mentioning that a mix of 50% Ethylene Glycol provides the best protection against freezing. If either the proportion of water or the proportion of Ethylene Glycol is increased beyond 50%, then the effectiveness of the mixture as an antifreeze will be reduced.

 

It is also worth mentioning that such a mixture is extremely toxic and may only be disposed of via specialist waste contractors. It should not, under any circumstances be tipped into the canal, over land or down drains.

 

 

 

50/50 mix?

When was the last time we had -36C in this country?

 

Alex

[alan_fincher]

It is possibly worth mentioning that a mix of 50% Ethylene Glycol provides the best protection against freezing.

Of course I'm being pedantic, because in typical British conditions the -34 degree C protection afforded by a 50% mix is more than you can possibly need.

 

However, according to several sources, the cutover point where it becomes counter productive to go any stronger is 70% ethelyne glycol, 30 % water.

 

That will improve protection down to - 51 degrees C, according to several charts, including the one in this Wikipedia article.....

 

Wikipedia link...

 

Pure ethylene glycol freezes at about -12 °C, but when intermixed with water molecules, neither can readily form a solid crystal structure, and therefore the freezing point of the mixture is depressed significantly. The minimum freezing point is observed when the ethylene glycol percent in water is about 70%, as shown below. This is the reason pure ethylene glycol is not used as an antifreeze--water is a necessary component as well.

 

As I say, irrelevant to this discussion, but something I didn't know, I'll admit.

[nb Innisfree]

50/50 mix?

When was the last time we had -36C in this country?

 

Alex

 

Don't know but how about next week!! Scary!! :lol:

[steelaway]

Don't know but how about next week!! Scary!! :lol:

 

 

Ay lad - thad best dig out thi themals or cum an lodge eer fora week.

 

 

Where are you Chris

 

Alex

[nb Innisfree]

Ay lad - thad best dig out thi themals or cum an lodge eer fora week.

 

 

Where are you Chris

 

Alex

 

Sitting out the ice at Norbury. Cafe, pub, toilets, shower, water point, rubbish disposal, chandlery, loads of Excel, we're in heaven

 

Chris

[NB Alnwick]

It is possibly worth mentioning that a mix of 50% Ethylene Glycol provides the best protection against freezing. If either the proportion of water or the proportion of Ethylene Glycol is increased beyond 50%, then the effectiveness of the mixture as an antifreeze will be reduced.

 

It is also worth mentioning that such a mixture is extremely toxic and may only be disposed of via specialist waste contractors. It should not, under any circumstances be tipped into the canal, over land or down drains.

 

My information was based on an old manufacturer's data sheet (Smith's 'Blucol') - the 50% 'rule of thumb' is believed to stem from the fact that many products sold as 'Ethylene Glycol Anti-freeze' do not consist of 100% pure Ethylene Glycol - they also, typically, contain corrosion inhibitors, emulsifiers, colouring - even flavouring and water . . .

 

A 50% mix was generally recommended for the superiority of all its qualities rather than just for the amount of frost protection it gives but I agree that in the UK a 33% or 40% mis is probably satisfactory.

[J R]

Hi all. Is it ok to use normal car anti-freeze or do you have to use non-toxic like fernox in the central heating system?

 

Use normal 'car' antifreeze. Replace with 'blue' if that was previously used or 'red' what ever the case may be. Cheapest way is to go to a motor factors as you will get a better deal. The boat engine manufactures will recommed the correct mix, usually 50/50. The antifreeze should be replaced every 2 years I am advised, as the anti corrosion bit it contains goes off after that time. We use the same mix with the Webasto system as well. Always premix the solution; as correctly mentioned in an above post as if you add neat antifreeze and then water it will not mix itself in the system. As and when you top up, keep a small container with premixed solution handy. Hope this helps.